To think labour are crap

[Reallytired]

The national insurance hike is unfair on low income working families and damages businesses.

I do not want hand outs, I just want to keep what I earn. Child tax credits are a complex system and its terrifying claiming them. If DH gets a job then will they claim them back all at once.

The workshy are not usually claiming carers allowance, its usually IS or JSA. Some are genuine short term claimants using the system as a welfare safety net as it was intended, however there are millions who now see it as a lifestyle choice.

Far too many people wont move off benefits and work for the same money - it shouldnt be a choice they should have. Others wait for the "prefect job" instead of taking anything that will support themselves. We currently allow people to have children with no thought as to how they will support them and it costs thousands in tax payers money to support their lifestyle choices - both by the benefits paid to them and the benefits paid to the children as many simply go onto claim themselves repeating the cycle.

People giving something back to the community in exchange for benefits could be good for everyone. Community benefits, the person benefits by getting experience/references and the state benefits in that if somebody has to volunteer in order to claim benefits then working would become more on an incentive.

Cuts needs to be made regardless of who gets in, it would be nice if they were fair though rather than just penalising the workers who support themselves and their families.

Actually looking at my payslip I think there has been a major cock up by human resources. I think that they have decided to charge me emergency tax.

The welfare state is an excellent sfaety net but it should be means tested. ATM everyone gets child benefit regardless of salary. That isn't right.
The poor aren't necessarily workshy btw.
What happens if you loose your job?
After the birth of my first child I ha dto go on benefits as I got dumped but these have acted as a platform for me to get a part-time job and set up my own business so I am grateful for them. I also don't have a problem with paying my taxes unlike tory sympathisers.
the welfare state is not a long-term prospect but it does cushion us against complete poverty.
I also think it can be a poverty trap conversely.

Belledechocolatefluffybunny - you know that the conservatives supported the war in Iraq don't you??

I have no problem with paying taxes when my family have a fair income. Income tax is much fairer way of raising tax than national insurance.

Why is it that people who are not working, but have a good income be excempt? Surely those with an excellent final salary pension should be taking a hit as well as those on low incomes? A small minority of pensioners are very wealthy.

dunceinlove, I know single mothers who are on income support and their youngest child is eight years old.

Yup, I know. They were sucked in by the false info

I think that those claiming JSA or whatever the hell its called this week should have to do however many hours at minimum wage it works out at in community support. That may be litter picking, or whatever, but since the government are effectively paying them, then they might aswell work for their money. It certainly couldnt hurt to clean graffiti/mow grass on verges or any community work. If you dont turn up, you dont get your benefit that week.
I have all the time in the world for those who claim benefits because they genuinely cant work, or are carers etc. I have no time at all for idle sponging b*stards who have never worked, and have no intention of ever doing so.

i hate to say this....but in the police you see it all the time, people living on benefits who have absolutely no intention of ever getting a job.

and im not talking of your average carer.

im not sure what the answer is for those who dont want to work, (not those who cant work for genuine reasons.)

when DH was made redundant we used the benefit system for a short while. for many thats what it is - a short term life saver, but im afraid that there are those who do abuse the system and use it to fund a way of life.

im not sitting in an ivory tower. both my siblings were heroin addicts who used the benefits system to stay that way.

I commend you for pointing it out. i agree, this pm is shite just like the last one. has anyone actually wondered why tony blair doesnt live in the uk?

i think he realised he couldnt afford the taxes and what a crudhole he made it

"I like paying taxes. With them I buy civilization."

Riven, pensioners do not pay national insurance as they are not working. They also get a larger personal tax allowance.

Look at this link.

www.hmrc.gov.uk/rates/it.htm

Why should someone get a greater personal allowance just because they are over 65? Many pensioners do live in povety, but a minority have an excellent income. Yet all of them get free bus passes, free prescriptions, winter fuel allowance etc.

My FIL pension is more than our family income, even when both my husband and I were working full time. How can that be right?

I think that a pensioner who is earning 30K should be tax as LEAST as much as working person who is earning 30K.

Reallytired - on your FIL's pension, he will have paid for that and worked for it over a whole career. If it happens to be more than you and your husband are earning then that is not your FIL's fault.
Sorry if I'm not expressing myself very well, I don't mean to be harsh at all, but I think to begrudge someone their pension is wrong.

Yes there are some very well off pensioners, my parents are among them, but they have worked bloody hard for it and paid a large percentage of income towards them for years. Personally I'm very happy they are well off, for one thing it means that DH and I won't have to support them financially like they have to my Dad's mother.

There are millions more very poor pensioners who need and rely on the winter fuel payments etc. I know that we all as parents incur a lot of costs, but pensioners incur different costs - taxis to essential appointments, paying for help around the home and garden, higher heating bills, all sorts.
Plus, their income is fixed. Any income from private pension will never increase, and state pension only increases inline with inflation and not in line with earnings. So the slightly higher personal allowances compensate in part for that. At least as a person of working age you have the chance to increase your income and alter your circumstances.

Riven - I have to admit that Oliver Wendell Holmes said it first though ;)

Labour ARE crap!

"I get a disabled bus pass and free prescriptions too.... "

You need the disabled bus pass and the free prescriptions.

Riven do you HONESTLY think that a pensioner should gets lots of benefits if they have a good income. My FIL has an income of 35K and is very fit and healthy. What justification is there for giving him a free bus pass? My FIL doesn't need a winter fuel payment. In fact he chose to fly to the canaries to escape the cold.

My husband does the same as what my father in law did for a living. He works jsut as hard. I think its bit unfair to describe him as work shy when he has only been unemployed two weeks and has already had two interviews. Hopefully he will get a job soon as he lots of interviews coming up.

The big difference is that virtually all final salary schemes in the private sector have been closed. Also our generation will be expected to work until 70.

I agree, pensioners benefits like bus pass, fuel allowance should be means tested. But I dont think that they should be taxed on their pension - they have presumable already paid tax on the money once when it was earned/paid into the pension, I think it would be a bit sh*t to have to pay tax on it twice.

faddle - they DIDN'T pay tax on it when it was paid into the pension. That is the whole point of a pension.