to already be terrified of childcare costs for an unbon child

[strawberrykate]

I live in London and I've been browsing childcare costs. They are terrifying. They are more than I've ever paid in rent or on a mortgage in fact! Local nursery is £920 a month, childminders seem around the same. Plus they rarely start early enough for me to get to work on time. I'm absolutely terrified. How do people afford childcare?

When I started childminding I had a two bed flat... I used one of the bedrooms as a playroom, had a lovely open plan kitchen/lounge/diner, we grew a little garden of flowers on the balcony, and we went to the common/communal garden/park every day. OFSTED were 100% happy with this.

I now have a 3 bed house with a gorgeous garden and I prefer it loads (for the kids and us!)... but this is not the be-all and the end-all for the parents or OFSTED.

Good luck if you choose to childmind... I had a complete career change to childminding and have never looked back

yes I agree with kitkats

I went back when I barely cleared a penny over childcare costs and my working costs (so travel, the odd sarnie etc.). Although childcare costs do attribute to both salaries, when you are looking at going back to work, you tend to attribute it to the partner who isn't working as if they are going to lose money, it means you are worse off as a couple (if that makes sense). But logically, those costs should be seen as being attributed to both of you..

anyway, the long and short of it is that I agree with kitkat. Go back now for very little money and other opportunities may arise. Keeping your foot in the door of employment is so important, especially in this economy. It is far easier to move to another job or change career from the position of having a job already.

Kate - have you looked into childcare vouchers? Does your employer do them?

If so, get yourself signed up quickly before they close the door to new entrants. You can certainly do it before you come back from mat leave, not sure if you can do it while still pregnant!

Hi Strawberrykate, I was shocked too with my childcare costs when I looked into them. I paid £80 for my dd's first nursery which was awful. I then took a job outside of London where I now pay £36 a day. My salary is lower than what it was when I paid £80 but with the reduced childcare costs I take home more. Obviously there isn't much left of it when I get home but I know that with a few more years of experience my salary will jump much higher than it would if I have a gap in my CV. But that is due to my field of work though and is different I'm sure for teachers.

In terms of childminding I just wanted to say that a friend of mine was thinking along the same lines as you but ended up nannying a girl in addition to her own child (in her own home). She got CRB checked and ofsted approved but because she is only looking after 1 child she didn't have too changes to do to her house. Because she didn't have experience as a nanny she couldn't charge what more experienced nannies charge but she is still getting £8 an hour and I think she takes home £1000 a month. She says that although it was hard in the beginning it has been great. Maybe this could be an option for you?

I do agree with FIS and kitkats too, actually. Five years is a looooooooong time to be out of the job market - and that's if you only stick at one child. And although teaching does make it easier 'once they start school', as the cliche goes, it still isn't exactly easy.

Snuppeline - nannying in the other child's home or nannying in the nanny's home, because the latter is childminding regardless of how many children are cared for.

Nannying could be a very good option for a qualified teacher and nanny jobs tend to have a shelf-life anyway.

you know it's funny, I am packing up the house as we are doing some building work and I found the contract for dd's old nursery.

This was in late 2000/early 2001 in a zone 2 London suburb. Even 10 years ago, these nurseries cost £50 a day!

It is an expensive business childcare but also, I really did not find it got easier when they started school. I found it got worse because we almost had to have a nanny otherwise the children couldn't get ferried around to things like swimming (unless you get a childminder who can fit yours in around their already existing schedules).

We have quite a few friends who are teachers and use the after school clubs (if you manage to get a teaching job in the borough or a neighbouring one). In fact, the after school clubs seem only to be used by teachers or people who work from home because, where we are, there is no way you can get back from central London by 6 unless you've got the sort of job where you can guarantee you can be out on the dot of 5 (and right by the station etc. etc.)!

Anyway, the reason it feels so expensive is that it all comes out of our net earnings. It's not that I think childcarers are overpaid, more that, as an employer or user of childcare, you are getting treated as a business yourself if that makes sense.

I absolutely agree with that foxinsocks.

I don't think registered childcare costs should come out of net earnings at all. It's an expense incurred directly because of working, and you wouldn't need it if you weren't going out to work; therefore it's ridiculous to take it out taxed earnings. Particularly as the childcare provider will then be taxed again.

My children were at nursery in the early and mid 90s, and yes, it's always been expensive. From what the OP says, the cost has only increased in line with what you'd expect.

Childcare costs - aye. Expensive.

So many of my contemporaries just gave up work at this stage in their lives. It's only the better paid who kept going.

The childminding idea sounds reasonable but you need to work out if you are going to recoup the costs of conversion. Otherwise you might just as well use your savings to fund an extended period of not working.

Good luck - you'll be fine

We live in London and the nursery fees that you quote sound about right. Child minders worked out a little cheaper. To answer the question about would I use you, I look for 3 things - the person (and it sounds like you would be a fantastic find) - the place - the room you suggest sounds OK but not huge - would depend on the number of children you were minding - and the activities you would go to.

IMO at first most people talk about child care for that '5 year' period - ie pre-school - as the one where it may not make financial sense to work. It is true that childcare for young children is expensive. But it is, at least, relatively logistically simple - 1 provider, 8-6, 51 weeks of the year (if a nursery - fewer weeks if a childminder is used). I think when children go to school (particularly if you have more than one and therefore a period of time that you have 2 children in different places) it actually gets much more difficult.

However, as you are a teacher, school holidays may not be so much of a problem. So, whilst I think you childminding would attract customers, I do agree with the people who say that over the long term it may be better to return to work. Can you find a job (or look for a job) in a school with a nursery attached?

strawberrykate: my friend (also a primary teacher) decided to have a career break when she had her children. She set up a singing and dancing class for '5 months to 5 years' children and has made that pay for her to stay home with the children. She charges £5 per child for a 45 minute session, runs 2 sessions back to back per morning (to minimise room hire costs) and runs 3 per week in term time.

I think that teaching is a far more flexible job than most; you can have a career break without it necessarily wrecking your future chances. Plus your professional experience will stand you in good stead for running classes like these: Nikki's are far better than any of the 'franchise' classes I've attended.

Just an idea. Good luck x

Oh, and (don't think anyone's said this): I thought that the tax relief on childcare vouchers was due to be axed. Do check that before you do your sums x

Have you thought about part time / job share, also? That works best for us. You could still do some classes on your days out of work each week.

I'm going now, really.