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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to already be terrified of childcare costs for an unbon child

63 replies

strawberrykate · 07/04/2010 17:34

I live in London and I've been browsing childcare costs. They are terrifying. They are more than I've ever paid in rent or on a mortgage in fact! Local nursery is £920 a month, childminders seem around the same. Plus they rarely start early enough for me to get to work on time. I'm absolutely terrified. How do people afford childcare?

OP posts:
Original poster
strawberrykate · 07/04/2010 18:23

ruddymoah, surely a room is a room? We have stairs to access the property anyway. Full fire regs and safety gates etc. too. Just would be a huge playspace compared to other rooms. Not that I wouldn't let them in other areas! Just would be main base.

OP posts:
FioFio · 07/04/2010 18:24

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn

ruddynorah · 07/04/2010 18:25

sometimes they are ok with it, depends on the general set up of the house. distance to loo, distance to outside play space, distance to kitchen etc. they tend not too like set ups where kids are miles away if you need to go to kitchen for something or answer the door etc.

startagain · 07/04/2010 18:26

south london, never mind!!

Downdog · 07/04/2010 18:27

it's my biggest bill by far I'm afraid. But I do have a fab childminder in London - £200pw - (this week is a 5 week pay month so that is £1000).

I don't know how I afford it - when I did the figures when pregnant it seemed impossible - but it has worked out, though I am quite skint. It keeps the 3 of us living in a one bed flat - we can't afford anything more while paying out so much in childcare.

My partner earns 3/5's of fuck all (he works in London but has one of those jobs where they must think that you live at home with your parents as you can't live off what they pay you) so it's really down to me to pay - and he wasn't keen on being house dad (though personally, although he is fantastic Dad, I think our childminder does a better job than he would). I'm the main breadwinner & sadly being SAHM never been an option - I think I would have been good at it too.

There is a lovely nursery next to my office in Chiswick but its £75 PER DAY!!!

Original poster
strawberrykate · 07/04/2010 18:32

ruddynoah, if it came to it I'd just swap rooms around. But it's only a two storey with a loft anyway, currently one floor.

fiofio-took ages for someone to comment on that typo...

Downdog- £75 per day!!!!!!!!!!! If I ever set up a business I know what it'll be...

OP posts:
geraldinetheluckygoat · 07/04/2010 18:33

they like you to be able to access outside easily, and especially like you to be able to offer free flow play, accessing outside easily when the kids want. They might want to know how you will manage the stairs with the kids safely. Also practically, if you have say a baby and a toddler already there, then your third mindee arrives at the front door, how will you supervise the children in the loft while you answer front door and have the inevitable five min chat with the mum or dad at the door? If you have to cart all kids with you to answer the door, that would be a nightmare. However, could you not mind in the rest of the house? Just use your living areas downstairs, and have the loft room as a sleeping area for naps? Good luck whatever you choose to do.
Bear in mind also with childminding, it is very long hours sometimes, and you will need to attend courses which are often in the evenings. There is a fair ammount of paperwork which you will end up doing when you are not minding, but I should imagine youre used to doing paperwork in your spare time being a teacher! I childminded for almost ten years but gave it up as i found although I was with my own kids, I wasnt actually spending quality time with them as I tended to be putting their needs behind all the mindees most of the time!!

tethersend · 07/04/2010 18:44

Consider going back part time- it worked for me; also, if you don't go back you may have to repay some of your maternity pay (the half pay part iirc)

Consider also taking on my DD if you go ahead with the childminding idea - sounds like we are almost neighbours.

Original poster
strawberrykate · 07/04/2010 18:45

hmm...garden? Pretty rare in London.

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Original poster
strawberrykate · 07/04/2010 18:46

lol tethersend- I have visions of after my ranting you knowing who I am as I've worked in/ with so many local schools..oh dear

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Original poster
strawberrykate · 07/04/2010 18:47

mmm tethersend..but back for the 13 weeks min? I could borrow a sibling/ mil for that....

OP posts:
tethersend · 07/04/2010 18:51

Haha, don't worry, I'm lucky enough to work on the god-forsaken other side of London.

Used to work this side though... I'm sure our paths will cross one day

overmydeadbody · 07/04/2010 18:51

Go for it, if you want to, I know a few other teachers who have become childminders after having kids.

gingernutlover · 07/04/2010 18:54

£920 a month isnt that high and I am guessing you are on london teachers wages too.

I live in Kent and our nursery would be over £1000 a month for a full time place.

I am a teacher too, and not on london wages and we manage. Also most nurseries round here open at 7.30/8 so if you find one near your school then thats plently of time in the morning surely? When you have children you will have to cut down on your hours at school i remember doing much much lonmger hours before dd and now that I can't the work still somehow still gets done.

Try not to worry too much, its totally do'able.

Also, some childminders are happy to do term time only contracts with no retainers in holidays. That would cut down your childcare costs.

notevenamousie · 07/04/2010 19:01

strawberrykate well done for thinking about it now, it hit me much later and I didn't have an equal partnership like yours.
The CM idea sounds good. 2/3 of your salary in childcare costs sounds fairly average. Would you/ could you handle SAHMotherhood, maybe shared with your DH, could you do some sort of private tuition?? An au pair in your loft space?
I hope it works out ok, money is a nightmare for so many of us.

morningpaper · 07/04/2010 19:08

I probably wouldn't invest in a loft conversion (=enormous outlay) for this to be honest - you are talking about a huge amount of building stress during the most stressful time of your life - and a huge amount of money for a job that you might not enjoy.

Also - FWIW - I don't let my children play at a friend's house because she has a loft conversion and I am terrified of them falling down the (steep) stairs. So a childminder would be a no-no for that reason. But that's just me.

Most teachers that I know have taken off a year or so and then done supply teaching until their child is at school. Remember, it is only five years. You are unlikely to even make back the cost of the loft conversion in childcare fees over that period.

I would take it easy and not make any decisions yet. You might hate staying at home with your child and be gagging for a job stacking shelves in the evenings just to get away.

MumNWLondon · 07/04/2010 19:31

Childcare is v expensive, £45 a day (roughly £920 a month) is reasonable in London, many nurseries charge more than that.

Actually I looked into setting up a nursery and because property costs in London are so high and because you need 1:3 for children under 2, running a nursery is not as lucrative as it sounds. eg once you take the minimum wage (and you might not be able to find suitable staff prepared to work for that in London) and add on national insurance, days off for holiday and training etc. it comes to more than £8 a hour - even assuming your nursery is totally full, that would take the fees of 2 children so you need to cover all the other costs (eg property, food, materials, nursery manager, utilities etc from the fees of the 3rd child).

re: the comment about enabling DH to work - I don't see it that way - he earns more than me so need to balance the childcare costs again my salary not his. Only needs one of us to look after the children, and as he earns more it would be him. If he earned less than me then maybe that would be different.

Also re: loft comment there are very strict rules for childminders and nurseries, a loft certainly would almost certainly not be allowed.

Original poster
strawberrykate · 07/04/2010 21:18

MumNw- To explain about the loft. We are currently a single floor home, it would only be the ssecond floor with a normal staircase plus door.

It's something we are doing anyway.

morningpaper-supply teaching is not a good option, I'd be paying for childcare without a stable income! At least teaching ft I'd know I would have the money.

I could make myself afford it, but I don't really see the point in working ft for next to nothing. If I go down the career route it will not be in teaching. Teaching was meant to be the family option instead of the previous career.

OP posts:
kitkatsforbreakfast · 07/04/2010 22:46

strawberry kate - I'm learning from bitter bitter experience that, as pp have mentioned, it may be sensible in the long run to go back to work. I am a primary teacher, experienced, fab refernces etc and have found it extremely difficult to get back into permanent employment. I was out of the profession for 6 years and in that time have tutored, set up a toddler group, am a school governor, worked at my dc's nursery school from time to time, and have found it next to impossible to get back tot work. I am now volunteering 2 days a week and doing some supply. But my dc are at school/preschool now and I was expecting to be back at f/t work by now. From September we will have 3 sets of school fees to pay, and we were budgeting on my income for that.

I wish someone had told me 5 years ago that working f/t for no money may well be the best thing in the long run. It would have sved enormous stress now if I had kept my foot in the door career-wise.

MrsC2010 · 07/04/2010 22:51

We had the same discussion and have decided that I'm just not going to go back to work for a while. I love my job but to be honest I would far rather be at home! Obviously that may change, at which point we'll reassess.

TheBossofMe · 08/04/2010 03:13

Don't you have to provide secure outside space as a childminder? So if you don't have a garden, you wouldn't be able to childmind from your home....

You should probably post in the childminders, nannies etc section - Katymac et al are very friendly and helpful!

TheBossofMe · 08/04/2010 03:45

Hope you don't mind OP - have posted a link in the childminders section to this thread so hopefully some of the regulars there will pop over and give you some advice. Try not to worry too much about childcare at the moment - I know how horrible it is when you're thinking that you can't afford it and just fret about it, but these things do have a way of resolving themselves.

BTW - you mention that you were thinking about going back into law when the children were older - would it pay you a higher salary that makes childcare more affordable? Or is it the long hours in a legal career that made you career change into something more family friendly?

geraldinetheluckygoat · 08/04/2010 08:02

I dont think that strictly you HAVE to have a garden, but you would have to show how you can provide plenty of regular daily outdoor play.

BoysAreLikeDogs · 08/04/2010 08:15

yy what geraldine said

you have to ensure that the children have access to the outdoors every day

wrt the conversion, you will have to demonstrate how you could keep the children safe, so you may need to fit a fire escape?

CM is a very rewarding career

KitKaTS for breakfast, very good post about the point of returning to work in your childrens early years

Katymac · 08/04/2010 08:38

As such there isn't a problem with the playroom being upstairs - you will need to risk assess extensively (eg.1 baby, 1 toddler & 1 pre-schooler what do do with baby/toddler while you take pre-schooler to loo & no he probably can't go by himself)

Limited outside space is a major issue as children should be allowed to choose inside/outside at will

Childminding is hard - it is long hours & lots of paperwork - CAT me & I will send you some of the stuff I do (I share with lots of cmers on here so I have 'blank' documents)

If I had known the amount of work involved when I started I wouldn't have done this.....btw my playroom is 24' by 12' with an outside covered are of 16' by 12'....so you will have to be very careful with storage in you space to make it all fit