To claim more money from the state instead of earning it myself?

[muggglewump]

I knew that would make you look

OK, so I'm a cleaner in a Care Home, my normal hours are 16, over 3 days in school hours. I do lots of overtime, whatever is offered except for weekends which I won't work due to childcare costs (I had a thread about this a few months back) This month I'll do around 27 extra hours, and usually at least 10 a month.

I've been offered Monday and Friday as permanent, I currently do Tue-Thurs, still school hours.
Now I've checked on entitled to, and I won't be financially better off, in fact a little worse as I'll have a bigger childcare bill to pay, plus I'll lose the overtime as I'll already be working Monday and Friday, and these are the days I do as extra, plus early starts/late finishes.

It makes no sense to do this, there's no promotion available, except to Housekeeper and she isn't leaving, plus I couldn't do her hours, and as I am already great at what I do and valued in my job (confirmed by my direct boss and management in my appraisal last week), I don't really need to do extra days permanently to prove myself.

I have one DD, age 8 and no babysitter so I value the two days a week I have on my own whilst she's at school, and it allows me to get the boring stuff done so weekends are free.

The one niggle I have is a moral one, should I earn the extra myself and claim less, or is it OK to carry on as I am?

if I was you I would carry on as you are because the extra time with your dd is valuable.

There is another scenario you dont seem to be considering.

What if they hire A N Other to work the Mon and Friday they're currently offering you, losing you the hours you normally now do as overtime?

That's your downside risk of turning down the extra days.

Carry on..

I cover the Monday and Friday when the others in the team are on leave. I am the only one who doesn't work these days so the overtime is always offered to me.
There's 5 of us, so I get a fair few days to cover.
I also get days as an extra which means to come in even when no one is off, and do all the jobs we don't get round to on a weekly basis.
Again, offered to me because I only work three days.

If it would make you worse off financially to move to Mon-Fri, then don't do it. Maybe when your daughter is older and there are no childcare costs to consider, you can look at it again (and maybe the Housekeeper job will be available then ). YANBU to stick to your three days.

Shouldn't you be declaring the overtime you do already though?

I'd be looking ahead if I were you - after the election any government that comes in is going to massively slash benefit payments.

You might be better off taking the offer of more work.

Yes, WhereYouLeftIt, when DD no longer needs childcare I'll be looking for full time work, as in 40 hours, and that's not available in my current job unless I do 7 days.

roulade, I was told I didn't need to declare the overtime, it's perfectly legal to do it, though I may have an overpayment of TCs, which is fine for this year. I can do some overtime and keep the money though and I guess I'll find out how much at the end of the rapidly approaching tax year!

Nancy66 I hadn't though of that. How likely is it that I'll be unable to carry on in my current arrangement?

I'm not workshy, not at all, I wouldn't be cleaning for a living if I was, but it makes no financial, or practical sense to work more hours for less money.

Thanks for all the replies, and I should say that I still do have that niggle in the back of my mind that I should earn more and claim less, even if it makes no sense to do so, and I'd advise others not to do it.

I claimed fully for 7 years, and do want to put back now.

If you only do part time hours within school hours then surely your extra childcare costs cant be that much?

I'd take the extra hours, far better to earn your own wage than claim benefits. At least if tax credits etc do get cut in the next election you'll already be on more hours.

Whilst you may enjoy your two child free days, its a luxury thats at the cost of the state.

You don't need to declare overtime? Who told you that?

Have you phoned the tax office and asked if you need to declare overtime?

I have always paid tax on extra days and hours.

HappyMummyOfOne , it's just half an hour a day in term time, but in holidays is my actual hours, plus an hour a day. It soon adds up.

I do know it's at the cost of the state, which I contribute to too btw, but to work more and have less money. I just don't know.
I am having a hard time saying no to the extra as I feel I should do it, but it makes no sense.

barefootinthepark It was the Tax Credits folk who told me that, I did call them.
I am taxed on whatever I earn, and TC's said if I'd earned too much I'd have an overpayment this year.
I do not have to tell them week by week what I am working, according to the guy I spoke to.
I hope that's true, as it's what I've done.

Honestly, I'm not trying to get away with anything, or be dishonest about what I earn I wouldn't do that.

You pay tax on what you earn, including overtime. I can't believe that however much you earn in overtime you don't have to declare it. I mean -- I do believe you, I just think it's really stupid and an invitation to fraud. Not by you flower, I mean just generally.

tax on earning and Tax Credits are different things.
She WILL be paying tax on her earned overtime through the PAYE system.
TC's are based on the previous year income unless current year will be £25k more. You then have to do an annual declaration following the year end and they calculate for the next year and whether an adjustment is needed for the previous year.

Carry on as you are.

If benefits get slashed, then just pick up more work in another care home elsewhere.

Yes ChasingSquirrels, that's what I mean. I do pay tax on whatever I earn though PAYE, and at the end of the tax year, I'll declare everything I've earned and they'll tell me whether I have been overpaid. If I have, I pay it back.

I am not trying to cheat the system and am going by the rules as told to me.

Yes Expatinscotland, I think that really is the way to go. It seems daft to work more for less. OK if I had lots of cash, but I don't, and even a small amount of extra childcare will make a difference.
There's not many jobs in this town, which does worry me, but considering how easy I have it really, with the days and hours I work, and how great my boss and Manager are, it seems daft to not only have less money, but to give up the advantages my job offers.

"I value the two days a week I have on my own whilst she's at school, and it allows me to get the boring stuff done so weekends are free"

So what your really saying is, that you COULD go to work for those 2 extra days, but you CHOOSE not to, so you can sit at home 'and get boring stuff done' and let the state give you money for the pleasure of having weekends free?

Erm, well that sounds perfect to me. Makes me wonder why i work full time when i could have '2 days off to myself' and get 'paid'

Oh, thats right, igo to work to earn my money to keep my family, and at times, no it 'doesnt suit' and yes id love more time at home with family etc, but i guess i was brought up to earn my keep.

Sounds like im the mug.

I would work the extra days but during school hours only so that you are free to drop off and pick up without incurring any childcare costs.

I remember you muggle, you were the one that was asked to work on a Sunday as a favour to your boss, and the childcare Sunday rate meant you actually lost out, am I right?

If you are going to lose out, it makes no sense to take up the offer of additional work, let alone the time you would lose with your DD.

It IS daft that you work more, for less money, and I can't imagine how frustrating it is for you.

Is there anything like Childcare vouchers available? If your work agreed to pay for your childcare, so you didn't have to, that might make a difference...

I recall how well you get on with your Boss, can you have a chat with her about it?

Best of luck to you as ever Muggle. You sound lovely.

Yes groundhogs, that was me, thanks for remembering.

Unfortunately there's nothing that my boss can do, I work for a big company, and a stingy one at that so it's not as clear cut as giving me a pay rise, or covering my childcare so I'll do the extra.
That kind of thing would have to come from head office, who of course don't know our home at all, or how well we work together as a team and would baulk at doing anything other than the £5.95 set out in our contract, take it or leave it.

You are right that it is frustrating though.
I want to work, I really do, but there is no point, and I do love being at home on Mondays and Fridays of course.
I have every long weekend off, though I mainly work but I don't have to, and I don't in school holidays, and I have loads of time with DD.
I hate that I have been offered more work but I will have less money doing it. Why?
Really why?

I would love to be offered a chance to earn more money, why wouldn't I, but I'm not.
Due to the rules, I can work two days more, but will have less money.

hana I wish it was just available in term time, but it isn't, it's permanent or not at all.

hoppershopper
I can understand your frustration with me, but can you not understand that I'd like to earn more money too?
But going 5 days will leave me with less.
I'm sorry you can't be at home more but I'm not to blame for that.
I work to keep my family too.
I'd love to work more, but this was the only job I could get, and though I should perhaps work more hours to give back the money I took from the state, I have a moral obligation to my daughter too, and after reading all replies on this thread, will be staying as I am, and being there for her as much as I can for now.

If you know of a full time job in my area, where they will not look down on me for being at home for a long time, nor be put off by my lack of recent experience, nor sneer at me for waitressing/cleaning, then do let me know, and I'll apply for it.

I have, for many.
I never get a reply.

Oh, and could I just add that yes, I am lovely

I am so peed off with recruiters etc at the moment. DH has recently been applying for jobs, and 90% of the time, you never even hear back!

He got a job, it's going well, but this was a direct ad I saw.... Tis very quiet on the job front out there at the moment.

Much luck (lovely) Muggle!

I got so disheartened when I was job hunting last year.
I got very few replies, and even when I went right through the recruitment process with the Job Center (to work for them), it was made clear at interview that I was too old to have little experience.

Too old, at 31, though I was offering them the rest of my working life.
Yep, too old.
Aren't they mean to understand why you have been at home, that's what I thought?
How wrong I was.

Most places I appliquéd to didn't reply at all, so yep, I clean for a living.
It's a job, it has it's advantages, and they are having every long weekend at home if I want, and a great understanding boss, and Manager.

I shan't feel guilty for it, this is not what I'd have chosen.

oh god mugglewump I think you do have to declare overtime (who gave you that advice that you dont) every penny in has to be declared.People who trade regularly at car boot sales and on Ebay are liable for tax the tax man will get it any which way he can unless you are Lords Ashcroft, Paul et al. Well done for getting back on the work ladder BTW and good luck

Scuse my spelling in the last post.

bernadette, I pay tax on what I earn, I always have, I'm not fiddling the system, I never have been.
It's Tax Credits that I haven't informed, and they have said it's fine, they'll see at the end of the tax year what I have earned, and I may have to pay back some money.

I assure you, I am doing nothing illegal, and am in no way having/earning/keeping money that I am not entitled to.