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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to think that in a shopping centre on a busy Saturday

103 replies

Vinomum · 27/02/2010 15:55

toddlers (and I mean ones that are really still tottery) should be kept in their pushchairs instead of being allowed to get out? It's stressful enough shopping on a busy weekend without having to walk at a snail's pace behind a toddler walking along with two oblivious, dewy-eyed parents watching adoringly as their offspring falls over for the hundredth time.

There are plenty of places to let small children wander, shopping centres at a weekend are not one of them!

OP posts:
ImSoNotTelling · 28/02/2010 09:26

Mine has walked up to the shops every day since she was about 18 months. It's good for them.

This whole "if you're slow or unsteady or take up too much room you should keep away from me" attitude is so depressing.

There was a thread on here recenty saying that old people and mothers with pre-school children should not go to the shops at lunchtime or weekends wasn't there.

porcamiseria · 28/02/2010 09:30

YABU

Its a shopping centre, not a busy railway station, not an emergency evacuation

my toddler HATES his buggy and as he can walk, why should he have to sit in it? I HATE seeing people who shop for hours with a perfectly able toddler strapped in, unable to move

I work FT so if (and all fairness I avoid shopping) I dont want to have to spend my 2 days with him complaining

Noone would dare say this about an aged person who has trouble walking

also is shopping THAT important??, why are we all so rushed and busy?

I also resent being classified as dewy eyed!

ImSoNotTelling · 28/02/2010 09:39

PMSL @ important people being allowed to go to nice warm shopping centres and enjoy themselves.

While mumes with small children, irrepsective of the fact that many of them will work full time, have to go and stand by themselves, in the pissing rain, in the park. Cos that's where you have to go when you have kids, innit. They are not worthy of looking at nice things in a warm place.

Mishy1234 · 28/02/2010 09:44

I guess it's down to a judgement call by the parents. I wouldn't choose to let my toddler run around a busy shopping centre, but that would be more about my worries he would be trampled, rather than slowing down other shoppers.

However, I do agree that as parents we do have to consider other people and their needs too. For example (OT I know, but just an example), we were in a cafe yesterday and it was quite busy with lots of couples having lunch, wine etc. DS got a bit restless and upset. We didn't just ride it out and order coffee etc anyway. DH removed DS straight away to go and have a look around the shop whilst I had a quick coffee and I did the same for him so he could have his. We all got what we wanted in the end and DS didn't cause a distraction for everyone else whilst they were having their lunch.

My point is, for me it's not about who had the 'right' to be somewhere or not. It's about having some respect for other people and thinking how you would feel if you were in their shoes.

Saltire · 28/02/2010 09:52

The problem at the shopping centre where I worked in a shop wasn't parents walking with toddler holding their hands. The adult (usually the motehr) would be way on in front chatting to anotehr adult about who they'd slept with (and no I'm not beign judgemental, this is genuine conversations I've overheard) what pub they were in how drunk they were etc etc, whilst the child is wandring around a good distance away from them. In the shop I worked in there was 2 doors into the shoppin centre, at either end of the store. I've seen mums so busy chatting that they have actually wandered out the door into the shopping centre, while their toddler is still inside. Toddler then cries, naturally because he/she can't find their mum, and anotehr shopper goes to crying child - and then the mother appears and asks the other shopper why they have their child.

In the same scenario above, a child tripped over my walking stick, and the mother gave me evil looks - I couldn't help it, the child was all over the place

Irons · 28/02/2010 10:06

I'm a firm believer in pensioners and stay-at-home mums/fathers should keep away from the shopping centres on weekends!! I've been trying to tell my grandmother this for years!

frasersmummy · 28/02/2010 11:19

Mishy there is a huge difference between kids toddling around a coffee shop and toddling up and down a mall

In a coffee shop most people are carrying hot drinks ..some with trays which makes seeing small people almost impossible.. leading to potential harm for all.
Even if they dont send someone flying I can see the annoyance factor when you sit down for a rest and a coffee and toddlers are careering about- doesnt bother me but can see its annoying

but op was talking about kids toddling slowly along a mall

oldandgreynow · 28/02/2010 11:37

YABU the toddler is every bit as entitled to be there as you !(IME going SLOW has never been a problem with toddlers)

Fruitysunshine · 28/02/2010 12:28

I am really open-mouthed at people who believe that public spaces are for people with no kids and the able-bodied.

WHO do you really think you are? Where did you gain that right over everyone else?

Public spaces are for everyone. You can shout what, ifs and buts as much as you like but at the end of the day all you are doing is showing your lack of compassion and patience for your fellow human being, regardless of their size.

These toddlers that are going through a well-documented stage that irritates you so much are our future generation and it horrifies me to think that the very society they are part of and that is supposed to be their peers and mentors would like it if they just shut up and were kept out of the public eye.

And blaming the parents for unruly toddlers (which toddler is not to one extent or another?) is just a way of shifting the blame so that they don't look so nasty.

nellie12 · 28/02/2010 12:34

I dont think public spaces are only for those who re fit and able bodied by any means.
And having young children - including a newly walking toddler means I am probably one of those whose kids have been in the way.

But the op is talking about newly walking toddlers i.e. one under 2yo. So technically still a baby.

I really dont understand what is to be gained by allowing an unsteady baby to walk through a busy area where they are at high risk of being stood on.

But perhaps I'm a bit scarred by the experiences of having people trip over the pram and people not see my 4yo walking along holding my hand and still knocking him to the ground. No they didn't apologise btw.

edam · 28/02/2010 12:45

My ds is 6 but still occasionally rushes about potentially getting in the way of other people - 6yos just don't think the same way as adults, he's far more preoccupied with what HE is doing.

So I've learnt to use a penetrating voice: "Mind out for the lady!" at least alerts said passer-by to the hazard. Most of them smile.

frasersmummy · 28/02/2010 13:07

Nellie I can see why you would want to strap your toddler in having been through that (nice people in your area)

That said there are a few things your toddler will gain from this experience

  1. They get to practice their new skills in a traffic free environment
  1. They get to build their self esteem and independence

3.It gets rid of some of their excess energy allowing them to sleep better

  1. They can explore stuff they would miss in a buggy ..
nellie12 · 28/02/2010 14:16

yes with an older toddler I completely agree with you. But one who is still unsteady? Sorry I remain sceptical.

mummygirl · 28/02/2010 17:45

YABU,

other people could be thinking how inconsiderate it is of you to bring your buggie in a busy shopping centre on a saturday. And I take it it's a double buggie? When you have a three year old perfectly capable of walking, still you chose to block people's way in order to do your shopping in the way most convinient to you.

BTW, the above is what other people might think.
I have often found that in my effort to be considerate of people I have been deemed inconsiderate. I have also thought people as inconsiderate and it turned out they were trying to be considerate.

we also have to accept the fact the universe doesn't revolve around us and there's only so much complete strangers are prepared to do to accmodate our lifestyle.

Original poster
Vinomum · 28/02/2010 18:13

Mummygirl, your argument is fundamentally flawed. If I'm inconsiderate bringing a buggy into a shopping centre when it's busy, how inconsiderate does that make the people who bring a buggy into the shopping centre then let the child out of it? A double case of blocking people's way surely?

What should we do with our children in your world - balance them on our heads?

OP posts:
mummygirl · 28/02/2010 18:34

balancing them on your head would slow you down, therefore inconsiderate.
What people may think "A 3 year old should surely enough be able to walk and not stray away from his parents -he should know the rules after all."
"Can't she use a childminder for shopping, them parents get all these vouchers through my taxes, at least put them in good use" or even " do you shopping on-line lurve, shopping centres are not places for children."

" has she never heard of slings/backcarriers?"

FWIW, my children have been encouraged to walk everywhere since they were able to, I'm very realistic about the fact that not everybody thinks they're cute, I was a child hater BC and I respect the fact that my little dah-lings are not the centre of the universe. I'd also like it if other parents did the same but it's not always the case.

At the same time my children are individuals with wishes and rights and if they wish to walk slowly through a shopping centre they have as much right to do so as my elderly neibourgh.

I'm only saying that what you consider considerate/inconsiderate is not universally so and you should reconsider your methods of consideration when you accidentally run into people with your buggy, which is difficult to avoid.

Original poster
Vinomum · 28/02/2010 18:59

But neither of my children are tottery. Which is what my OP is about.

OP posts:
mummygirl · 28/02/2010 19:48

you don't make any sense Vino. so what that neither of your children are tottery? You think that people with tottery toddlers should use pushchairs, you obviously did when your DS was younger and all I'm saying is that in other people's eyes this is not considerate behaviour. Towards other shoppers or even towards your child.

there's nothing worse than buggies on a saturday morning. Specially double ones. But when I see one all I think is the ppor mum who has to do her shopping lugging two young kids around, not how inconsiderate she is for not using a sling and make her toddler walk.

Lucyellensmumma · 28/02/2010 20:46

get over yourself, you don't own the shopping centre - what if it had been a little old lady?

houseworkhater · 28/02/2010 22:07

When my 2 were very young I had no choice but to take them shopping with me.

How inconsiderate of me to actually go out to work for my keep. To be able to afford the high cost of childcare (no labour freebies then I'm afraid) I had to work weekends plus weekdays. The days when I didn't work, unfortunately my dh did. Oh so too did my mum and mil-how inconsiderate of us all.
If my dd wanted to get out of the buggy I let her.
Now when I see a mum with small children maybe having to walk slow with her toddler all I think is how tiering it must be for her and how I am glad I am past that stage.

mummygirl · 01/03/2010 07:14

good post housework.
I've heard all sort of accusations in the past coming my way for having kids in supermarket trolleys, bfing baby in sling while shopping, having kids in pushcharis, out of pushchairs, walking, crawling, crying, laughing, whatever you do someone will always be unhappy.

Thing is when I was shopping with my three under three it was NOT out of choice, I'd have to be mad to CHOOSE to do it, but,as you say housework, sometimes there's no other option.

Original poster
Vinomum · 01/03/2010 10:11

'How inconsiderate of me to actually go out to work for my keep. To be able to afford the high cost of childcare (no labour freebies then I'm afraid) I had to work weekends plus weekdays. The days when I didn't work, unfortunately my dh did. Oh so too did my mum and mil-how inconsiderate of us all.'

Er - wtf? I come on here posting that in my opinion, parents with children who can barely take 3 steps without falling over should use their common sense when they're in a busy place and keep their children in their pushchairs. Now suddenly I'm having a go at working mothers? Housework, Mummygirl - do you have any idea whether I work or not? By all means make your point about small children being or not being in pushchairs, but don't make misplaced assumptions about my opinions on any other matters - as it happens, you could not be more wrong.

OP posts:
swanandduck · 01/03/2010 11:37

This keeps happening on here. Someone makes an opening post about a certain point and suddenly they're being accused of all kinds of things they never said or implied. I wonder how many people have left mumsnet because of this kind of stuff.

Original poster
Vinomum · 01/03/2010 11:52

Too right SwanandDuck - I saw this happen on your pub thread. I think some people on here either can't be bothered to read the thread properly, or conveniently ignore the bits that don't suit them so that they can get on their soapbox.

It's very frustrating and can be quite upsetting, and yes I do think it will stop people posting on here.

OP posts:
swanandduck · 01/03/2010 11:55

Glad you noticed that Vinomum. It actually upset me a bit. I also noticed that someone who stated the view that people who could afford to pay for school breakfasts should do so and leave the free places for those in need, was accused, quite nastily in some cases, of begrudging free breakfasts to all children.
Anyway, sorry I'm taking your thread off topic.