in wanting to burn the baby whisperer book!

[Littleknight]

Hi

I've just had a few days of tears and self doubt in my role as a mummy to my gorgeous 4 and a half month old baby after reading the baby whisperer book.

Until now I've always bf DS on demand and until recently we were co-sleeping. He had moved to his cot in his own room very well but I was BFing him to sleep then putting him in. I wanted to get him used to falling asleeep more independently rather than dropping off on the boob! I also felt that I needed a bit more of a feeding routine - but not a really regimented GF style one - SO I started reading the baby whisperer. Big mistake in hindsight!
I used the BW pick up/put down strategy to settle DS which is fine but then I started reading more of the book ....big mistake
DS sleeps well at night once settled but will only nap for about 30 mins at a time during the day usually totalling 2ish hours over the day. I'd never really worried about this before reading the stupid book - but according to BW this type of napping is a sleep problem. I've just spent 2 days 'observing' my DS (as the book recommends) and basically misinterpreting his every move and sound for overtiredness and overstimulation.
After a tearful chat with my mum and heeding her wisdom to chuck the book I feel normal again and am enjoyng my baby again instead of feeling guilty and inadequate.
I sure BW works for some but it's going in the bin!

Sorry Mumgenius but I don't understand why my post is "tasteless". The woman died and I was informing people of the fact. People are saying they didn't like the book and I thought that it could perhaps be because it was written before she died and as things are always changing then perhaps the book's techniques might be a little out of date.

Irons Thats really not how your post came across.

Agree that all the 'Look, Luvs' get rather annoying! I got the impression that it was written for the American market (was it?) and she was selling herself as a 'down to earth northerner'.

'PS also liked Your Baby Week by Week and No Cry Sleep Solution, though Your Baby Week by Week bit too keen on weaning at 4 months for me. Early bits great though and written by a doctor. '

Did it? Ooops, I have to admit I never made it to the end of the book - I read it as I 'entered' each week when DS was a new born and for the 1st few months, but I gave up towards the end as it didn't seem relevant anymore... (maybe that was weaning? can't remember now)... I found it a godsend in the early weeks though and thats when I needed the most reassurance that cuddling DS 24/7 and feeding on cue wasn't actually a bad thing for either of us!

Oh I liked the BW book a lot. It was one that gave me some useful tips without making me feel that I had to follow anything rigidly, or worry that my baby was weird if he wasn't like the ones in the book.

Maybe it depends on how seriously you take these books - I've never been one for being told what to do

The EASY (eat, activity, sleep, you) bit for example - DS actually followed the sequence AESY much more often, and quite often it was totally random, but I wasn't bothered. But what I did like was that she advocated time for "you" while the baby slept, and made it clear it was all flexible. Also pick-up-put-down method saved my sanity.

The BW totally sorted out our feeding and sleeping woes, and I intend to use it again with DC2 (assuming it works for DC2).

I read Gina and binned her as soon as DS1 came along as it just didn't relate.

I don't understand anyone getting stressed out by a book. If it doesn't work for you, it doesn't work for you - just try something else - maybe even your own instinct!

I had the American version which IIRC did "hey honey" instead of all the ay up me duck stuff.

Tracey Hogg in her own way, was just as much of a fraud IMO as SWMNBN and has been the cause of many mothers giving up breastfeeding because of her advice which is just as rigid as old G's. (in fact, I think in some ways GF is less bizarre than TH)

And as I find someone who has never had a child writing a child-rearing book odd (in the case of GF) I find the idea of someone who left their 2 children in the care of their grandmother while they fecked off to the States to become a baby guru infinitely odder.

WTF has her being dead got to do with anything? Jane Austen is dead and I can't get through her books without boaking either.

Can heartily recommend Deborah Jackson, Dr Sears and Elizabeth Pantley though. (although with Dr Sears you do have to sling him in the bin once he starts going on about how PFBs are just highly sensitive souls etc)

I agree Bucharest, why any parent would trust the advice doled out by someone who has never had children is beyond me.

It would never happen in any other field. Imagine buying a book about plumbing written by someone who had never done any plumbing themselves, or a book about chicken keeping written by someone who has never owned chickens? It would just never happen.

I met Tracy Hogg twice, she was doing a series for the Discovery Channel is 2002, I'd just had my first baby and saw an ad in the local docs looking for new babies and mums, DS1 was 3 months at the time and I was struggling with sleep and feeding. I was living in Putney, London at the time.

She was really lovely, kind and reassuring. She definately knew what she was talking about, kids or no kids, she listened and suggested things, not at all 'this is how you should do it' etc etc. She was totally genuine, warm and sincere. She had the experience to be able to write about it. Of course someone who has never plumbed can't write about plumbing, the two are incomparable.

Our meeting changed my whole thinking and approach, I did not do everything she suggested, but what I did do worked.

I used the book for both DS's, the pick up put down thing worked really well for us.

I was quite shocked and upset when I heard she had died, she was so young and happy and vibrant.

So nice comments from those about her 'being dead' Lovely way to put it not to mention very respectfull.

YANBU

Books can be useful for tips but if it's not working for you ditch the book, and definitely ditch the guilt!

Once and for all...

Tracy has kids (albeit ones she apparently ditched with grandparents ).

Gina does not.

Bucharest - good book recommendations, although i did find reading Deborah Jackson while hormonally crazy with a newborn really upsetting at the start where she's talking about horrendous baby advice from the Victorian era etc

FWIW when I was pregnant, I asked my (very wise) SIL for advice on reading baby books.

She told me to look at a wide range of books, decide what kind of parent I wanted to be and then choose the one that told me what I wanted to hear.

I chose the BW which was perfect for me.

Friend of mine recommended the BW as having been really helpful for her and I couldn't stand it, because of the:

• patronising tone
• 'I can fix anything at all and know your baby better than you do'
• recommendation that you start trying to get your baby in a routine from day one
• whole 'accidental parenting' thing, i.e., never trust your instincts, mine is the only correct way...
• weird bf advice about doing 'yields'

I'd be less cross about it if she admitted that there might be someone, somewhere, who was happy and had a happy baby without following her advice.

I liked First time parent, which someone else has mentioned, because it is actually very funny in parts. That and 'Your baby week by week' were really useful in the first couple of months for things like how to swaddle a baby, what to do about cradle cap, that sort of thing.

I also bought 'No Cry Sleep Solution', which has fairly similar sleep advice, but would recommend it over BW because near the beginning she says that your baby only has a sleep problem if you or your baby are not happy - don't try to make changes just because someone else is telling you that you should.

MN has been great for giving me confidence to ignore advice that doesn't suit us.

Oh, and my 5 1/2 month old now springs into wakefulness half an hour into every nap. I don't think there's anything I could do about that and he seems fine on it.

Is it only me who is bothered by the description of "Spirited Babies" on the BW forum? Only I can't help but think there's a resident exorcist sent round at the first sign of a little 'un breaking out of Stepford Baby mode.

Oooh I loved the BW, but like every book you have to take the things you want from it. Lets face it all children are different, at least she gives you a variety of child scenario's to choose from to see if your child slots in, unlike GF who if fine if again you take bits (but don't understand those who follow it to the letter - have met some pretty unhappy mothers and children because of that....)

I liked the EASY routine and followed that (Although was actually doing it without realising) and I guess it slotted in to my way of parenting - also GF was being forced down my throat at every avenue and so my backlash was to do TH.

There was one book I read which I was given something about Toddler Taming, or taming your toddler (mine has never been that much of an issue) but I was reading it about bedtime and children staying in bed because a friend was having issues and it was suggested that you tie the door shut so your dc can't get out. Found that one a bit odd but maybe its just me

I totally agree with Muddleduck. There are books out there which cover all views on parenting, you have just got to find one that suits you.

I read everything from Dr Sears (which I didn't like because having read some of the original research he referred to in his books, as I felt he misrepresented the original research) to Gina Ford, which I also hated from beginning to end. In the end, I liked the BW as I had a spirited baby and I found the advice very useful. I found the EASY really helpful, the PUPD which I never really had to use, but did for one short period with DD1 and found that to work, and I also liked the idea of building a routine around your baby. I did the whole observe your baby for three days, and the idea that any routine has got to fit in with the baby, and not the baby fit in with the routine idea. So for us, it worked and it gave me confidence and I used it with both my DDs very successfully. (Although there were large sections I ignored!)

But I also recognise that it won't suit everyone. So, if its not for you - find one that does or if no books suit you, then throw them all out. After all, isn't difference what makes the world go round !?!

Ow, Littleknight,...I just wanted to say that I know how you feel honey. I have not read all of the posts to your reply but just wanted to share my thoughts with you.

I would say take the bits of advice in that book (and any book I suppos)that work and with which you are comfortable and ignore the rest.

I used that particular book to give me ideas - loved some of it, totally disagreed with other bits. And some of it I modified to suit us.

I only used it with DS1, must have cracked it by DS2.

But mainly I just wanted to say that you will see from some of the replies that no-one has the right answer when a problem pops up - but you are your dear son's loving mother - so you will get it right just because of who you are. So I am sure you will find a way that works for you and your little man that does not make you sad.

I think you have to find a way/system (rather than routine) which suits your baby.

I had the BW book when DD1 was born, I read it, enjoyed it, took what I wanted from the book and then stopped reading it cos DD1 just wasn't a BW baby. She never napped for more than 40 mins from the day she was born to the day she dropped the daytime naps.

However the twins were classic BW material. They suited the EASY routine from very early on and it has served me well until about 3 weeks ago when it all went completely pear shaped...but that's another story

This could have also been because I was so much more relaxed 2nd time round...I didn't stress like I did with DD1, so maybe I am giving credit where its not due??

The Baby Whisperer made me feel terrible - I think it was the bit about identifying the different cries your child had - I felt so lacking because all my dd's cries sounded exactly the same. The pick-up put down method never worked for me because she was far too clever for that. I picked her up - she stopped crying then when I even slightly leaned towards the cot she started again. It worked well for a friend of mine but then she had a completely different sort of baby.

If you feel the need for a sleeping-type book I'd recommend the "No Cry Sleep Solution" by Elizabeth Pantely - the first thing she asks you to do is work out whether you really have a sleeping problem or whether everyone else thinks you do. So, for example, if you don't think you should be feeding your baby to sleep then you could try X but if you are quite happy doing that and it's your HV or MIL who says you shouldn't be then stick with what works for you.

I always found that it was other people who took issue with the fact that my oldest dd went down at 10pm, fed to sleep, shared a bed with us and that it was only when DH and I started to listen to them that we got stressed about it.

I agree with you though - pretty much every baby book belongs in the bin, particularly when the baby is under 6 months old.

Oh god, I forgot about the "accidental parenting" thing - that enrages me now, but made me feel crappy at the time - how dare she use that term! Actually I feel quite proud of the fact that I was an accidental parent in retrospect - better than being an uptight one

I agree with the 'accidental parenting' thing - made me feel rubbish about DS's inability to go to sleep when he was little. Now I feed to sleep at every opportunity and am incredibly grateful that I have something that works!

I agree that you should only follow the bits of advice that suit your baby / your family, but my issue with books like the BW (and GF) is that they come across as so prescriptive and suggest that every baby should fit into their mould, which just isn't true.

And the advice on breastfeeding is, frankly, plain wrong which really makes me mad.

I like the Elizabeth Pantley approach of suggesting a whole lot of ideas that might or might not work for you.

(I did try the BW when DS was tiny, but ended up with a hysterically overtired and screamy baby who would not sleep. As a stupid first time parent I didn't have the confidence to ditch it and try something else until we had a real problem on our hands.)

Baby Whisperer .. Gina Ford .. they are all designed for and by control freaks. It suits people who need to be organised but god help them if their baby decides otherwise. Everyone I know who swears by 'the book' has had an easy baby who does exactly as it says on the tin. Burn them all I say and use old fashioned common sense.

I enjoyed the BW and GF and a couple of other books, it was interesting to see various insights and attitudes and took out of the books what sounded logical to me - think every book I read gave a something.

Needed it as my mums parenting skills were stuck firmly in the 1960's and with the best intentions offered gems like dummies dipped in jam to help settle lo!

No one else in my family ever bf'd either so needed a bit of education their too.

Books are no better/worse than asking for advice here on mn, take various opinions and then do what suits you and your baby best.

I liked BW. Not all of it, but the sleep thing was a godsend when DD was about 3mos. She went from no naps and being utterly miserable to fist having three naps of between 1 and 2 hours a day, and now at 9mos she has (usually) an hour and a half in the morning and 1 1/2 - 2 hours in the afternoon.

Also had the no cry sleep solution, which I didn't get on with at all, and Gina Ford which I quite liked the idea in theory, I decided that in practice I couldn't be bothered and needed to be more flexible.

Tone of the BW was massively annoying though, it took me a while to get past it and take on board some of the advice.

I loved the babywhisperer, tbh, but I didn't follow it like the bible or anything. I liked that I was able to have a little structure that was more or less guided by DS...he was a baby who thrived on routine, and took to it immediately. It was sanity saving for me, becuase I kind of liked having a more or less set rhythm to our days together...I'd never been home all day every day, much less with a small baby!

It didn't work as well when DD came along...she's much more free and easy, and can cope without structure, but we found a rhythm anyway.

I just knew I didn't want to do any sort of crying it out, or on the hour feeding (ala GF), and I wanted a good bedtime routine, and I found all three of those in the BW.

Don't follow it to the letter...take what you like, and lump the rest.