to think some people actually prefer moaning to doing something to help themselves?

[BitOfFun]

And that they are their own worst enemies?

I see it a bit on here, to be honest. Every suggestion is met with a "yes, but...", or helpful contributions are ignored, or even whole threads are pulled by the OP because they nobody is letting them wallow.

AIBU?

Nemofish, I reckon you are spot on there.

err, no ???

I see a hesitation there

Hmmm... YANBU but it can be hard to change behaviour as quick as might seem obvious to an outsider.

If it were about relationships, I have been there a little. Because with emotional issues you are not exactly in the best frame of mind to go 'OK...I'll do that and life will improve.'

If you have been in an emotionally abusive relationship for a long period of time, and possibly as a result of a pattern formed in early life through, say, parental treatment, it is hard to see it as wrong, because that is what you understand as normal.

I don't know how long it is before outsiders feel frustrated with people who could change things themselves, for the better, but I so badly believed that things were wrong because it was literally my fault, that I was to blame, that I put my energy into trying to please and get it right.

This is different to the wake up call that the patterns from earlier life are actually enabling whoever it is to be a fuckwit, because of your own passivity.

Of course there are people who seem addicted to the drama.....but that is how
it seems to me.

6 months ago, I wouldn't even have been able to write that and I was intimidated by some of the more dominant posters who can be awesome and inspiring on relationship threads, but at the other end or middle of a shitty relationship, what they say sometimes, whilst being a much needed wake up shake, can be very hard to take on board.

o

MW, I think to feel frustrated with someone making constant excuses can co-exist with understanding why on some level, IYSWIM

frustration and empathy are not, nor should be, mutually exclusive

Oh Mitts, you're so sensible and very right indeed.

Really we just need to be 'there' for friends, but very hard to continue being 'there' for people on the internet!

Yanbu.

Some people just love a good old moan.

I, for instance, like to moan when I don't know what thread/poster everyone else is alluding to on threads like this. Makes me feel like I'm missing out because I'm horribly nosey.

YANBU.

My father is like this. He likes to moan and enjoys the drama in every situation. Ones that could be easily sorted out with a bit of thinking, I tell him how to sort something out, but he prefers to moan and tell all about the dramatics of every little thing.

I think it keep him going

bibs, I don't think the OP was about one particular thread....more just a general feeling

have to say agree wholeheartedly.some posters like a good ole poor widdle me.pointedly ignoring any advice or links to grow-a-spine.com

even better are the ones ho post whata tit their partner is.ritinga long narrtive about how they skivvy like a dog,get tuppence housekeeping and a slap for their troubles.

so someone ansers "hes's a twat"

and the op starts to argue."hoi how very dare you...you don't even know him."he's great when he isnt sniffing deodorants/in jail/doon the pub"

sm...you forgot to say "he is great with the kids, even when he is calling me a cunt..."

ah,yes good point.the ole hes good wi the kids crap (as he batters seven shades of shite out of you)

It's funny how you sometimes (including in real life) get a very bad impresion of someone's partner, when the person doing te describing is the one person in the world who should like them.

BoF, I agree ... and there's actually a name for it:

"Why Don't You, Yes But"

This is a "game" identified by Eric Berne, the originator of Transactional Analysis.

More info here if you're interested:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transactional_analysis#Why_Don.27t_You.2FYes_But

Oooh, I love a good wiki link

YANBU BoF - but you do appear to have missed the point of AIBU.

I think there should be A Game for 'You Need A Right Kick Up The Arse, You Do'

MW, yes you're right, but it's an internet site, and, like Flamingo says, it's different for real life friends.

ScottishMummy has described the most annoying one: 'he's a good dad to the kids but he's never with them and is always drunk and hitting me blah blah blah'.

WhatNoLunchBreak, transactional analysis is a great thing. It changed my life

I have a friend who updates her Facebook status about 3 times a day to moan about the worst thing in the world ever just happened to me type of stuff. 'Well that's my night ruined, I've just had my hair done and now its raining'.

And she does the 'Yes, but..' stuff when you offer her any advice. She is lovely mostly though.

Yes, BoF - there should be. We could call it the Reactional Anal-Assault school of thought.

Chilli - I lurve TA! Uncomfortable when I realised just how many of them I play.

I think the kicks up the arse are massively important though.. helping someone in that situation find anger is tremendously important.

And IMO Transactional Analysis is brilliant. Wish my counsellor when I was 18 had used it or whatever form existed way back then.

I know you are right AF, I see it myself as a mum.... frustrated at them for something but seeing how or why they don't get something.

As far as the deep stuff goes (as opposed to people who just seem to be content to be discontent), going on the threads about normal stuff, about normal relationships, about partners who don't abuse on any level, had a profound effect on me and really bought home that what I was existing wasn't normal in any way. Or for the DC's and for their point of view. I wish I had found MN a long time ago.

Kicks up the arse only work if the kick is accepted and acted upon.

MitsubishiWarrioress ,thats quite a deep post.most reflective