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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to think this is pretty bad?

63 replies

completelyconfusedagain · 21/01/2010 18:27

Please settle this argument between me and my exh.

Been married for 5 years. Due to the deterioration of our marriage due to his constant drinking and general lack of commitment to me and our marriage our sex life tailed off to the point where we had sex twice in two and a half years.

In the early months of last year (2009) my h visited two high class prostitutes for a threesome and used cocaine with them. He believes that is not one of the worst things that could have been done in a marriage and certainly not the worst thing that has been seen on MN (he knows my committment to this forum!) He thinks I should manage to forgive this and move on as we have three dc and I should get over it and make the family work.

Ladies I know you will be honest so please let us have your honest opinions to settle this argument once and for all.

OP posts:
Coldhands · 21/01/2010 19:14

Wow, what a fucking twat he is!!! I can't believe his attitude and the fact that he thinks that shows that he really has no respect for you whatsoever. He should have thought about your DCs before he did this.

You are much better off without IMHO. Do you really want someone who is capable of doing these things around your DCs full time?

2010aQuintessentialOdyssey · 21/01/2010 19:17

holy cow, this is some of the worst I have read on here. Not only what he did, which is loathesome, but his attitude after. He does not regret it, he justifies his action saying other men do worse (well, most dont), and then he is trying to persuade you to give your relationship another go! Not because he is sorry, but because he disagrees that he did something wrong! In other words he blames you for the marriage breakdown, because you dont accept that he pays for sex to have a threesome, and take drugs. What a fucking arsewipe of a shit. This is not a MAN. It is a scumbag of the lowest order. Sorry, but men like that for sure does not deserve a second chance. You are well rid, and well done for having booted him.

MrsVidic · 21/01/2010 20:05

he paid for sex- just sex- so no emotional cheating (this may be his view)

However- the lies surrounding it, the money he used to pay for it selfishly and the arragence of him assuming you should forgive him are major concerns. Also if you're not having the intmacy- then his actions weren't those of someone who wanted to make the relationship work are they?

CirrhosisByTheSea · 21/01/2010 20:48

It strikes me as worthy of note that this man paid for a threesome. This was someone indulging not only their desires but their fantasies as well. Someone really into what they were doing, not just being 'desperate' for sex they were missing. That would make a difference to me personally. Don't know if it does to you, completelyconfused.

And yes, in order to even consider re-thinking the relationship I would expect him to be completely accepting of just how crap what he did was, to want to make you realise that he knows the magnitude of his crap treatment of you, not just with this 'incident' but his part in getting your marriage to crisis point in the first place - the drinking and lack of commitment

Personally, these to me would all be huuuuuuge issues and I don't imagine I could overcome them even if the ex was fully contrite and shouldering of his blame!

Original poster
completelyconfusedagain · 22/01/2010 08:21

Thank you all very much for confirming what I already knew. I know it is unforgiveable but it is not something I would want to discuss with friends or family to get an opinion on so I only have his point of view. He honestly believes he has not behaved that badly and this is a forgiveable thing. It can be quite difficult to see things clearly when someone is so sure like that.

There were many issues involved in us not sleeping together and I gave him many, many chances to make our relationship work so deep down I just don't believe it was because he needed sex.

OP posts:
diddl · 22/01/2010 09:03

Couldn´t forgive that at all.

In fact would find it hard to forgive the drinking in the first place.

Original poster
completelyconfusedagain · 22/01/2010 09:16

I couldn't forgive the drinking diddl but he kept asking for chances to make things right and I kept giving them to him, making excuses for him - he was young, he had a bad time as a child etc etc. The prostitute thing is not the only thing that happened in the marriage, there loads of other stuff as well but this was the final straw for me.

OP posts:
RonaldMcDonald · 22/01/2010 09:25

Do you want to make it work with him?

I know people who have worked through worse than this but it wasn't easy

Thing is, very often putting something like this behind you in a relationship means that the "injured party" sometimes has to admit some element of fault as well
Which is sometimes a step too far and too much to ask

My friend's husband admitted going to a brothel every week (as he was about to be dobbed in, complicated story)his explanation was a need for sex as well
Eventually through counselling they both actually spoke to each other and understood what was making them exhibit fairly awful behaviour from both of them
They both climbed down
Much happier than ever before and still seeing a counsellor but genuinely over the betrayal etc etc

She said the hardest bit for her was giving up the "injured party" high ground and admitting that she had a part to play in it all. Once she did though things snowballed from there and they actually started to understand each other again

I'm not saying that this would be my reaction and nor am I suggesting that you take this route but it is an option.

Original poster
completelyconfusedagain · 22/01/2010 09:31

I understand the injured party thing, I really do and have thought about that.

I have said and still say I could have forgiven him most things that he did, even being unfaithful though I know lots couldn't, but I do believe that it doesn't always mean a great deal but the deal breakers for me are the fact that all the while he was being unfaithful to me he was coming home and giving me crap about the house not being clean and tidy enough, gave no help whatsoever with childcare or housework, being verbally and on occasion physically abusive when drinking or hungover and the final fact that to this day he is still drinking at least 5 cans a night, sometimes more with the odd day off here and there just to prove he can. He says he would stop drinking immediately if I give him another chance but I don't believe him.

I know I contributed to this that is why I let him stay so long but no matter how much I changed my behaviour, his never did. I can't have the drinking around the dc anymore.

OP posts:
AvengingGerbil · 22/01/2010 09:33

Ron, I can't see any circumstances, ever, in which a partner using a brothel (once, occasionally, regularly, whatever) is the responsibility of the non-using partner.

However bad their behaviour, there is nothing they can do which 'forces' their partner to pay for sex. She IS the party injured by that behaviour, whatever other mutually damaging behaviour has taken place.
The man (in your example) has free will; he has chosen to use prostitutes. He could have chosen not to.

Original poster
completelyconfusedagain · 22/01/2010 09:33

Oh and FWIW on three occasion when I took my kids away and he didn't have money to go out drinking he pawned our TV and other electrical goods.

Believe me I have tried and tried almost to make this all my fault so that I could keep giving him chances but where do you stop?

OP posts:
wukter · 22/01/2010 10:34

He sounds terrible.
You are better off out of it.

A one off mistake is one thing. People work through them, but it takes a lot of work on both sides.
But his constant prolonged behaviours and his appalling attitude make this situation a non runner. IMO. (And in yours too, it seems)

upandrunning · 22/01/2010 10:37

It's bad, but he doesn't seem to think so at all. He should be crawling over broken glass if he wants things to "work out".

FimbleHobbs · 22/01/2010 10:42

Sorry to be frank but - hes a complete shit.

Hes physically abused you
Hes verbally abused you
He paid money to cheat on you
He took/takes drugs
He drinks too much
He pawned your family belongings

And he thinks hes a catch? Hes deranged.

Original poster
completelyconfusedagain · 22/01/2010 13:06

Thank you. Just needed it in black and white. I showed him the first few posts but he won't read any more. He honestly believed that someone would come on say "well its not that bad....."

This has been very helpful for me as well as has this way of making me doubt myself and whether I am doing the right thing continuing to be broken up with him.

OP posts:
tispity · 22/01/2010 13:20

gosh he sounds like a tabloid caricature - i don't think you can go from a sexless marriage straight to a coke-fuelled threesome without quite a lot of things happening in between which you would prob not like to know about.

it sounds like he has lost all perspective on the matter if he thinks that is forgiveable. is he clean atm?

i would get 2 appointments: one to the sexual health clinic and the other to a good divorce solicitor. make sure you have enough concrete evidence to nail him - emails, phone records, recordings and the rest

drloves8 · 22/01/2010 13:27

OMG ! Run ! Run! RUN! - DONT TOUCH HIM WITH A BARGEPOLE !

  1. hes been shagging hookers !
  2. he's clearly a utter bastard
  3. he`s a mysoginistic git , who clearly thinks woman are there for his amusement - and if he should get away with anything .
  4. just reading about what hes done and said to you makes my skin crawl.
  5. you deserve better than him.
coppertop · 22/01/2010 13:29

Presumably he'd be equally forgiving if you'd paid two men for a threesome.

heQet · 22/01/2010 13:32

coppertop - was going to say exactly that!

Tell him you too have shagged someone else and tell him that you are glad he wants the two of you to put these things behind you and move on as a family.

See how keen he is to forget about it when the boot is on the other foot!

Bunnyjo · 22/01/2010 13:36

OP you are certainly NOT unreasonable. Your ex is under the illusion that he can excuse his behaviour because 'it's not that bad'... It IS bloody bad, he's betrayed your trust on a number of occasions and he's also been abusive. No matter what has gone on in a relationship, there is NO excuse for any kind of abuse.

You are right to have left him, your DC's do not need to see their dad behaving like this. I understand he may have had a difficult childhood, but he is a grown up now with his own children to consider. He should be adult enough to understand he needs to seek help for any addictions/ abusive traits he may have and that he has a responsibility to do the best for his children.

Lastly, if he believes he can cut down the alcohol if you got back together, why doesn't he do it now whilst you are separated? My guess is he has no desire to give up the alcohol, otherwise he would have tried by now.

dittany · 22/01/2010 13:42

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

YouKnowNothingoftheCrunch · 22/01/2010 13:42

The real deal breaker in all of this (for me at least) is the fact that he has no respect for the hurt that he has caused to you.

Even if everyone came on here and said, "I reckon I could get over that" that wouldn't matter, because this is about the pain caused to you.

And he cannot see that at all.

He isn't saying, "I hear the way you feel and I will comfort it and try to rebuild your trust in me through my actions from now on" he is saying, "Your feelings are wrong! You shouldn't feel like that."

Irreperable with that attitude. He's not hearing you. Nothing will convince him you have a right to feel how you feel, and he is the cause of that pain.

Stay away.

tispity · 22/01/2010 14:33

so you def did not have some kind of open marriage arrangement and it has completely come out of the blue?

Original poster
completelyconfusedagain · 22/01/2010 14:53

No, tispity, we most definitely DID NOT have an open marriage arrangement. He has told me that he was unfaithful to me from around a year into the relationship until the present day. I found text messages and phone numbers on his phone but as I said before I didn't want to break our family up over it. I always put it down to his drink problem and that he didn't really mean it because he was drunk when he did it.

Thank you all so much for your replies. I feel stronger than I have throughout the relationship because I have had specific opinions on only one thing that happened in the relationship.

I think what I am struggling with is his total and utter refusal to accept that he has done anything all that bad and his constant justifications.

OP posts:
verytellytubby · 22/01/2010 15:00

I'm pretty unshockable but jesus...