To think "pushy parents" need sorting out?

[Spannerweb]

By pushy parents, I mean the ones whose eight-year-old daughter virtually lives at stage school or whose clever son has extra tuition in maths, with a view to him achieving a Master's by the time he is twelve.

They crucify these poor kids in a quest to have everyone acknowledge their talent as if it were their own.

I would happily have a quiet word and point these things out... free of charge.

there were girls at my school who spent every spare moment after school attending dance and drama lessons. Me anad my best friend used to say their parents were "farming" them because they used to push them so hard... and for what. most of them are at uni now doing law or business studies not dance!

YANBU.

You see this alot in ski resorts. British parents telling their DCs to "pull themselves together" when they are bawling their eyes out at prospect of morning of ski class followed by afternoon in hotel creche. For an adult who is a reasonably competent skier, a ski holiday is a joy. FOr a child, just learning, in the freezing cold, possibly with a non-english speaking instructor and stuck in a class with non-english speaking children, its a nightmare. Personally, I don't understand it. I would rather spend time with my DCs than ski anyway - no matter how frustrating it may be, I certainly wouldn't leave them whilst severely distressed.

At least they put in a bit of time and effort. I would say feckless lazy parents need sorting out more.

I totally agree with you. What vanessa mae's mum did to her was abuse in my book. There must be a connection between doing an extreme amount of dancing and doing a law degree the really pushed dancers that i knew all either teach dance or did law.

What if the kid wants to go to stage school, though? Or wants the extra math tuition? I, too, think that the child should decide how much it wants to do and whether to compete or not, but there surely is nothing wrong with supporting a child in developing a talent?

Why is it that people are always more sneered upon for achieving something, or working towards an avchievement than for doing nothing.

What Widow says.

Of course it is dreadful if the parents are forcing their child, always egging her on, not letting her leave Stage school. But is it fair to tar all parents with the same brush?

There are children who genuinely want to spend all their spare time pursuing their big interest, whether playing the violin or learning foreign languages. Should they be stopped? After all, lots of non-talented children spend all their spare time on one activity: my ds spends all his kicking a ball around (badly) and has to be hounded into other activities. Presumably this is legitimate and non-pushy because he does it badly and in the street? But if he had talent, the same level of activity would probably get him onto a team and he would be putting in the same hours of kicking on a proper pitch: would that suddenly transform me into a pushy parent?

My parents taught me Latin and Classical Greek: horribly pushy seen from the outside. From their pov it was a kindly attempt to rescue me from trying to read the Iliad on my own without knowing how to use the dictionary.

My dd would happily live at a stage school if we could afford it. Absolutely nothing to do with me.

i think you are generalising way too much. some kids have their own passions, and the hard work and discipline probably pays off one way or another for most kids.

My DD does cello and piano - some consider might consider this pushy(two instruments and she is 9) We are not a musical family and me or my DH cant read a musical note to save out lives. She started piano as her best friend started doing this at school and took up cello as that was the other instrument her music teacher loved(listened to this on you tube).Making good progress in both and infact we are surprised wth her ability . We do support her by taking her to concerts(although I dont understand and would rather spend time on somewhere else) and make sure she does her practise fairly regularly.

You need to expose them to various thing and you might find that there might be something they might be good at (music,dance,sport).My view is she will a hobby (or a profession) when she growps and will enjoy it for the rest of her life.

What is preceived as pushiness from outside is propably not.

I get accused of doing that with ds who is 7.

He is at drama/dance/singing/guitar etc every night (although is home ed so is not like knackered after school). At 6 he got on the internet and googled the classes himself and begged to do them.

He does plays, auditions etc, but it's all him, not me. Although I support him, I limit the amount of auditions I allow him to go to, and I am so far from a pushy parent it's untrue. I see loads of pushy parents at auditions and castings, I feel for some of those kids. My ds doesn't give a monkeys if he doesn't get a part in something, he just says 'oh well, maybe next time' and moves on. I see other parents getting upset and berating their kids when they don't get through auditions etc, and that's sad.

Thing is, he is good at what he enjoys. I couldn't stop him doing the things he loves.

OP - forgot to add, yes, I agree with the fact that some pushy parents 'crucify these poor kids in a quest to have everyone acknowledge their talent as if it were their own.' That's what I was talking about with the stage school parents I see.

If I wanted to act, I'd do it myself, not live my life through my child as some parents do.

Like your son lola - she just enjoys music and although I was surprised and happy that she managed a merit in her grade 2 exams in cello at 8 she just was happy that she can move on from the exam pieces and actually learn to play different music.

Agree wholeheartedly with peacocks.

If you find a parent berating a child for not winning, that seems a pretty telltale sign as far as pushiness goes. But you can't judge just from the number of hours put in. Some children are incredibly single-minded. Think of horse-loving girls who spend all their time at the stable (often to the despair of their parents). Why is spending all your time at stage school any worse, if that's where you feel happy?

And extra tuition in maths could be because the child is gifted and bored to tears at school; should he never have access to any learning that he can enjoy? Is that fair?

One reason why my parents taught me more languages was that I was trying to teach myself anyway, the other was that I never had a language lesson at school where I didn't grasp the concept long before the teacher explained it. If you are bored all day at school (as some gifted children will be), then being bored at home as well is a bit risky; it can lead to the child switching off altogether. (gosh, I'm sounding like DadAtLarge).

It's funny how we have these phrases "pushy parents" "helicopter parents" in developed western economies, whereas in most of the world children are pushed and encouraged to achieve as a cultural norm. Why is it considered wrong here?

There's a balance isn't there, and where that balance lies depends on a lot of factors.

I always think it's funny when my parents slag off pushy parents (and they do - it's a heinous crime in their book), when what they actually mean by pushy is parents who were pushier than them.

Their level of pushiness wasn't pushy at all, it was perfectly normal and what anyone sensible does for their children, natch.

I suspect that is a fairly universal feeling

Like most on here, I think what matters is whether it's the child who enjoys the activity and wanst to do it, or the arents pushing them when they have no real interest.

My DS "virtually lived at" all his musical activities - he was a chorister, which came with a place at music school, played violin, piano and bass guitar. It was a fulltime committment and left little room for anything else in his (or our) lives. But we asked him regularly if that was what he wanted, and he knew he had the choice.

And now, at 16, he wants above all else to be a professional musician and get to spend the rest of his life carrying on with these things.

Should I have stopped him from doing something he loved, just because other people might have though I was being pushy?

I would say though, that sometimes there can be a little bit of jealousy from other parents, who then label parents of a child who has a particular talent/love for something as pushy.

I think there is a difference between say, parents in the developing world- or less well off here- pushing a child academically. This is understandable, even desirable, because the stakes are high in terms of how that child 's life will pan out.

There is acertain type of parent however, who regards there child as some sort of accessory - what does my child' lifestyle indicate about mine? - andalong with the organic food, there will be opera, ballet, etc

Although I had a musically gifted friend at school who coukdnot do anything else. It was all he lived for and his parents didn't push him in the slightest - a bit like cory's experience. I aldk gave a relative who is a very successful actress and her family did not push beyond what is normal- school shows , studying drama at college etc

I agree with kirsty young's comments about parents treating children like mini genius's.

That said, there is alot if pleasure in music, drama for it's own sake. And I say that as a very poor bur enthusiastic pianist!

Sorry... Their child

There are plenty of parents in the "developing world" who are wealthy and still "push" their children. It is a cultural phenomenon, not an economic.

I agree My daughter is in reception and there is one parent in particular who pushes her daughter really hard with reading and writing. Lessons at home, spent a fortune on books etc. The little girl has spent quite a bit of time at my house and I can tell you she may be able to read and write but she is far from being a member of mensa (which her mother is convinced she should be lol).

you can push a child as much as you want but in the end some children have talent and others dont. I feel its better to let children find their own interests and then support them in these (and if this includes lessons, clubs etc thats fine). It is wrong however to push children just for the sake of it or because you WANT them to be interested in a certain thing.

Why is it? Again, in plenty of cultures professions are divided up amongst children: one is to be a doctor, one a solicitor and one an accountant etc. What is wrong with direction and pruipose. And the vast majority of people don't have a clue what their interests are or what they want to be and end up wasting half their lives dossing about or doing something dull and menial because they weren't pushed/encouraged (pick your term).

I would rather risk the accusation of 'pushy' than 'laissez faire'.

Surely it's possible to be somewhere in the middle - give your child exposure and experience of many things, and then if they show interest, take it further. But also realise that bumming around at home with their siblings is as valid and important as a structured lesson in anything.

Hully - there is something wrong with pushing direction and purpose onto your children if it is a specific direction of your choosing which makes them miserable.

From as long as I can remember, I was told by my mother that I was going to become a doctor. I was pushed and pushed to pass my 12+ to get into grammar school, where I was miserable, as I only just scarped through the exam, due to all the tutoring and I couldn't keep up without going through vast amounts of stress and sheer hard work. I left school at 16 as I felt so burn out and depressed, so that backfired.

I am not a doctor, I never ever wanted to be a doctor, not that that mattered to my mother. She died not long after I got into the grammar school - and wrote me a letter on her deathbed, which of course which was all about how I had to become a doctor to make her proud, and nothing else. Luckily I was the sort of child who could just laugh at such a thing and think 'no way'. If I had of been of the mindset that I must make my dead mother proud at all costs, I would have been a miserable student, I would have probably failed to get on to a medical course anyway, and even if I had of managed to get through with determination (I probably could have succeeded if I worked really hard and set my mind to it) I would have been a shite Doctor because it wouldn't have been what I cared about and wanted to do, and utterly miserable doing it.

If my mother had lived, I have no doubt I would have been pushed all the way through uni and would have ended up hating her for it.