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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to have taken my daughters dolls house off her for appalling bedtime behaviour?

63 replies

MissMoopy · 20/12/2009 20:41

My dd got the most beautiful dolls house off my Dad yesterday. It is an Xmas present, he has built it and gave it to her yesterday as my parents live a long way from us and won't see her on Xmas day...SO, last night dd (5) had the most appalling tantrums between 7 - 11pm. She has never behaved like that before, I understand it is result of over excitement and tiredness, but I cannot tolerate that behaviour. Tonight she started again, so me and dh took the house out of room and left her screaming. She is now fast asleep but I feel awful
I think we have to make a stand though, so we have decided to tell her in the morning that she has to show us she can do at least 2 fuss free bedtimes before she can have it back! AIBU or is that fair?

OP posts:
CirrhosisByTheSea · 20/12/2009 23:30

I agree I wouldn't have removed the dolls house unless she'd been bashing it up or refusing to stop playing with it.

I think the consequence for tantrums is to have yourself ignored. I don't think there needs to be more. Being placed in your room alone is enough imo.

I also think 2 fuss free bedtimes is too much. I think the taking away of it was the consequence and I would give it back to be played with and enjoyed during the day. Can't see why not really.

ChippingIn · 21/12/2009 09:06

MissMoopy - you did the right thing - no doubt about it. If it makes you feel any better, 2 nights is quite lenient in my book

It makes no difference whether her bad behaviour was linked to the dolls house or not.

There will always be some people who say otherwise and that of course is up to them. However, I don't know anyone who'd think what you did was unreasonable, that has badly behaved children and plenty who'd think that what you did was wrong, who do have badly behaved children

yummyyummyyummy · 21/12/2009 11:50

I think YAB a bit U .When a child of 5 gets so tired they are totally 'past it' they can't control their behaviour.they are not like adults.However i would have not given her the dolls house before xmas in the first place !

wannaBe · 21/12/2009 12:02

yanbu.

muppetgirl · 21/12/2009 13:40

ChippingIn -let me introduce myself. I don't agree and I have well behaved children.

I do believe it is up to the op though and she should do as she sees fit.

I also believe we need to be careful and put ourselves in the place of our children and look at things from their point of view. We make connections between crime and punishment that our children may not which can, in turn, create further behaviour issues that we, as adults, can attribute to the origional naughtiness. 'Look, dc is still being naughty and hasn't learned her lesson, let 's take the dolls house away for another 2 nights'

Also, what is the op going to take away next if this path doesn't work? Will the little girls Christmas presents be taken away? If not why not?

We see the connection but children may not.

We, in our house, view everyday as a new day and really try not to carry punishments over. This little girl may wake up happy and refreshed (I also recognise she may not!) and get out of bed ready to play, she could then be very confused as to why she's not allowed to play with her dolls house that Grandparents have just bought her. She may not remember the last nights tantrum (I am well aware the parents will!)

I am a mum to 5.9, 2.1 and 6 month old boys. Also an ex teacher with experience of difficult children.

Hey ho, the difference of opinion is one of the things I love about mumsnet

mistletoekisses · 21/12/2009 13:55

YANBU.

3 nights ago, DS (aged 2.3) played up horrendously at bathtime. He has never done so before. He got 2/3 warnings very calmly warning him that he would get no books before bedtime if he continued to act up. He didnt stop screaming, so he was put into his cot without his bedtime stories, which he loves.

Last 2 nights, he has been back to normal with not one 'no'. At 2.3 DS totally knows what he is doing (pushing boundaries etc.), so at 5, your DD is both fully aware of her behaviour and absolutely needs to learn that there are consequences to playing up.

asdx2 · 21/12/2009 14:03

I too wouldn't have removed the dolls' house nor carry on the punishment for two more days which is a very long time for a child of five especially at the end of term in the run up to christmas when tiredness and excitement is at an all time high.
Far better to have a calming bedtime routine and an incentive and reward for settling down to sleep quickly.
I usually say to dd "straight to sleep now because you don't want to be too tired to ....... tomorrow" If she isn't straight to sleep I just emphasize what a shame it would be if she had to miss an activity because she and I were too tired. That is usually more than enough incentive.
I am never keen on any punishment that is dragged out especially when a child is so young because you have to question why should they behave when they are being punished for two days anyway regardless of the behaviour on that day.

NightShoe · 21/12/2009 14:05

I completely agree with muppetgirl.

It is very important for a child to have boundaries and for there to be consequences to their actions. Mistletoekisses example above is a good one because books before bedtime are part of going to bed that her DS likes, he was warned calmly of the consequences of his continued behaviour and then she carried out what she said. So now he knows that this behaviour equals no stories at bedtime. She will be able to do this again should he test the boundary again, therefore she can be consistent.

I think that taking away the dolls house is just too abstract and abit mean. I say mean because it was obviously a very special present which her Grandad made for her and I think it now has some negative connotations which it need not have had. If she had been playing up on Christmas Eve would you have told that Santa wouldn't come for her? I think that punishments and consequences are neccesary, but it doesn't need to be a grand gesture on the part of the parent. It is hard to present consistent consequences because she won't be bought a doll's house everyday.

MmeherewegoawassailLindt · 21/12/2009 14:09

I agree with muppetgirl, that the punishment was too severe.

Your DD was tired, overexcited and just plain grumpy.

That was why she tantrumed, nothing to do with the dolls house.

I would be interested in what you did, MissMoopy when your DD was tantruming. How did you respond to her?

MollieO · 21/12/2009 14:09

Golly I completely agree with muppetgirl and don't understand ChippingIn's comment at all.

I always relate the punishment to whatever ds (5) has done and I am told he is very well behaved.

I've never thought of doing something different as I wouldn't expect a 5 yr old to understand a tenuous link - maybe he is just thick .

CirrhosisByTheSea · 21/12/2009 14:30

I notice that the only person who has tried to justify their view with "well people of another opinion have badly behaved children" is ChippingIn.

I don't agree as I said yesterday - and my ds is extremely well behaved. He knows that if he does things wrong, any consequence is immediate and related to the problem. totally agree that as muppetgirl says it is better to 'treat every day as a new day and not carry punishments over'

PotPourri · 21/12/2009 14:33

good on you. wish I could be as strong with my 5 year olds tantrums

Original poster
MissMoopy · 21/12/2009 15:03

She is an intelligent child and she CAN understand consequences of her actions and behaviour. Sometimes behaviour is so unreasonable it cannot be ignored.

And we did not remove the house after just one night of this behaviour, it was after 2 nights when we had made it plain to her what was expected. We had told her that if she had behaved like that then her dolls house would be taken out of her room.

And the house was given to her early because as I said in my OP, my fther built it, lives a long way away, delivered it at weekend and wanted to see her reaction. Think only fair to allow that don't you, yummuyummyyummy?

Would the people who think I am being unreasonable allowed her to behave like this without consequence? Tiredness, excitement contributed but is not an excuse.

OP posts:
Original poster
MissMoopy · 21/12/2009 15:05

Muppetgirl, she understands fully. She is bright and clever and if it doesn't work the period will be extended. We are not strict parents, but as I would imagine you realise, sometimes you have to make a stand.

OP posts:
Original poster
MissMoopy · 21/12/2009 15:07

And her behaviour was very extreme - 4 hours of tantrums is out of charchter, cannot be ignored and she was like a wildcat! This was not done in response to something tiny.

OP posts:
TisTheSeasonToBeHully · 21/12/2009 15:09

Wouldn't take away the doll's house, it's an arbitrary punishment. How would you like it if you had a bit of a PMT snip and someone took your car (for eg) away for two days? What would you learn from that?

Original poster
MissMoopy · 21/12/2009 15:13

You keep saying "how would i feel" - I am an adult! It is our jobs as parents to teach children about CONSEQUENCE! And if i behaved as badly as she has over last 2 nights I would expect a consequence. I think it is more about making a consequence understandable for a child. And by the way, 2 minutes after we moved the house she went to sleep, so maybe we were right?

OP posts:
TisTheSeasonToBeHully · 21/12/2009 15:14

Consequences should be logical.

MmeherewegoawassailLindt · 21/12/2009 15:29

What did you do when she was tantrumming?

Original poster
MissMoopy · 21/12/2009 15:56

We kept returning her to her room, asking her to calm down and trying not to engage in any argument etc. We made it clear that the consequence would be her dolls house being removed.

TisThe Season, it IS logical. Her dolls house is important to her, she wanted it in her room and we agreed even though her room is quite small, and it was a massive treat to get it in the first place. Treats are relaint on good behaviour surely?

OP posts:
Original poster
MissMoopy · 21/12/2009 15:59

Reliant, not relaint!

OP posts:
muppetgirl · 21/12/2009 16:10

I understand MissMoopy and appreciate your opinion. We have a very tantrum prone 2 year old at the mo -shame as his 5 year old brother is extremly reasonable and always has been -so we're kind of at the rough end of this too.

It was just that this is in AIBU? I don't think you or your expectations of behaviour are but I think the taking away of the dolls house is when you had managed the situation by walking away and leaving her to it. I don't feel anything more is needed.

I am of the opinion that disciplining your child can take many forms -ignoring, reasoning, bribing etc but sometimes it can be as simple as an adult exerting power over a child. I feel taking the dolls house away has nothing to do with the non-desired behaviour it's more just an adult asserting their power and control over a child.

I am not looking for a bun fight and are not aiming a personal attack I am just offering up a different opinion. I belive intelligent children should be given strategies to deal with others undesired behaviour as much as strategies are used to deal with theirs. You delt with the situation calmly having the intended effect, just not in the time frame you wanted, by saying through actions 'We don't like this behaviour so we're leaving you to it until you change.' I'm sure you explained what you were doing along the way. This can then be related to their own life in that they can deal with undesired behaviour exactly the same way. 'I don't want to play that game/don't like what you're doing so I am going to play with someone else until things change'. This links with what is done to them can be done to others. I feel the dolls house is somewhat irrelevant and not useful for an intelligent child to get their head around. Are they to take other children's toys away? Why would this not be acceptable?

As I said, not looking for a bunfight, just expressing a differing opinion. We both agree on the idea of taking a stand but just have different ways of how to do that. I'm sure we'll all arrive at the same point -well behave chidren- anyway!

TisTheSeasonToBeHully · 21/12/2009 16:12

I thought it was a present? Presents, once given, shouldn't be taken away again unless they are mistreated. Otherwise, what else might she do that would mean a present being removed? And what other sanctions might you use? What will you do if she keeps on tantrumming? Empty her bedroom?

She must have been tantrumming for a reason, wouldn't it be more sensible to find out why and deal with the cause?

Pitchounette · 21/12/2009 16:39

Message withdrawn

Pitchounette · 21/12/2009 16:41

Message withdrawn