To have taken my 19 month old DS to the first 45 mins of a carol service?

[aarghhelp]

(This is my 1st AIBU thread so am feeling a bit apprehensive but here goes).

Just got back from a carol service. We have 2 churches in our village, and 2 carol services. We go regularly to one or other church. The 3pm service suited us best timewise, but was at the slightly more old fashioned church. The feedback we've had from regulars in the church is that they think it's lovely we take DS to church.

The carol service today was packed out and actually the standard of music was v high and if anything better than I expected. DS is used to being in church and was pretty good. He didn't cry and was fairly content but, being 19 months, occasionally burbled and shuffled a bit where we were sitting. If he started burbling during a relatively quiet bit of the service I took him out (we were deliberately sitting near the door). We stayed out during more lengthy spoken bits.

When we came in again in time for a hymn DS was on my knee and put his hands on the backrest in front. The woman in front shifted and I whispered "Sorry" . Her companion turned round to me in the snippiest way and barked "You should take him out". Since we had only just been out for a break, and actually he was being rather good, apart from holding onto the backrest, presumably she meant we shouldn't have darkened the church service at all.

I was at a bit of a loss what to do then really. I didn't want to flounce out. After all, this was only one person and probably other people didn't think the same way. Also, this was a person I hadn't seen at church services before. (That in itself raises various issues about who should be the more accommodating and how).

I did leave the service after about 45 mins as DS was getting more restless and I thought 45 mins might be long enough. That also avoided the whole thing of what to say to said woman if she was nasty to me at the end of the service.

I searched this as a topic on mumsnet and I found a thread from last year on the whole topic of taking children to carol services but from the point of view of someone who'd been annoyed by a "squalling infant". I wondered what you would say to this scenario though.

I often used to take my dc to part of a service. Nothing wrong with staying right thru or leaving when you think they have had enough. Very rude of the chap infront to ask you to leave.

Perhaps you should have pointed out that the infant Jesus wouldn't have been very quiet at his first Christmas celebration.
Horrible man. Lovely Christian attitude there.

Not a very Christian response from the person in front. Our church positively welcomes children.
Not taking DD2 (almost 18m) to the carol service tonight as she not 100% and a bit grumpy, but normally would.
YANBU, she was.

Actually the companion was a woman (older woman and younger woman).

I wonderd whether the scenario was that this is someone who lives in or near the village but doesn't go to the church all that much (in which case we'd be likely to know her).

So she might not be all that interested in being "Christian" but might see it as being very much "her" church if she has grown up locally (which is how some people in small English villages would see it).

I'm not a church-goer but if I was, I would not be in the least offended by children making noises in Christmas services.

Unfortunately, the reaction you got from this lady makes me even less likely to want to attend a church service any time soon.

It's a shame though, everyone has a right to go to church, young and old, and it shouldn't 'belong' to anyone. There's no wonder the church isn't so popular nowdays with attitudes like hers.
Does your church do a special Christmas kids service, our's does on Christmas eve about 3pm. It's great, all the kids can dressed up and they do an impromptu nativity. Last year there were 8 kings and many sheep and shepherds!

I think you question should have been AIBU to have told this woman to piss off!

I've just been to the carols service at our local church with my DSs - 2.5 years and 6 months. It was full of children standing in the aisles, jigging away, a few shouts and younger siblings calling out to older ones on the stage here and there. Everyone was involved and it was lovely - a real feeling of community. It adds to the magic of Christmas if you ask me and I wouldn't have it any other way. I guess it depends on how 'formal' the service is but what a stuffy cow.

A church should be open to everyone. Sod the old fart, she should maybe look into what being a good christian means!

(PS I don't consider myself one and therefore am allowed to call old people farts!)

No, murmuring and shuffling is fine. In fact, any normal child behaviour is OK, but if the volume reaches a level that it disrupts the proceedings, time to leave.

And a carol service is very different, to, say a memorial service, where you'd expect stillness and silence.

Our church is a bit unaccomodating - very lengthy, formal service - so we don't go. But at Christmas, they are very good with families.

I don't think she was being particularly Christian!!

I take DS to Church, normally we go to the 9:15 service which has a creche, so not a problem but occasionally we go to one with no creche, and if he does make a bit of a fuss, no-one is remotely bothered - there is generally a few babies and toddlers at these services and everyone is made feel welcome.
Jesus said "Suffer the little children to come to me" and I think this woman had forgotten that!

I hope you and your DS enjoyed the service

They sound unreasonable. You did take him out, and that's my biggest bugbear, parents who let their children scream and run around and do nothing about it. A bit of toddler burbling is actually adorable!

Amazing isn't it that people who call themselves Christian and go to church regularly, don't seem to have grasped the some of the fundamental Christian values.

Of course you should be allowed to attend with your DS. You were doing your best to minimise any disruption by taking him out during the quieter parts.

I would suggest to your Minister that he hold a special service next year for pre-schoolers and their parents (and anyone else who cares to attend of course). Our church is having one at 4pm on Christmas Eve and it will be lovely to not have to be on high alert the whole way through (DS always makes a runner for the altar on Sundays!).

YANBU (and it seems unanimous - well done!). Woman in front sounds like she doesn't know how to behave in church and the way you dealt with DS sounds ideal.

I meant 'some people' in my first sentence.

Of course you should have taken him I bet her loved it!

My mum took dd to my dads churches concert last year and ended up next go some woman who'd taken her kids and let them play on their ds's the who way through !

A bit of toddler noise isnthing in comparison to that !!

You would have been well withing your rights to tell the miserable so and do to take herself out if she was that bothered by it !

Sounds like your lovely DS behaved better than the woman But a happy Christmas to her anyway, perhaps she was having a crap day?

Exclamation mark overkill then

Sorry..

YANBU. Churches are for everyone and it sounds as though you were being more than considerate in any case.

Mishy, I wouldn't assume that these people were necessarily Christian or regular attendees - all sorts of people go to church at Christmas because it's traditional.

Gosh what a miserable woman.

St Peter has no doubt noted her actions...

Church is a family. Children are ALWAYS welcome. YANBU. sounds like you have a very well behaved little man.

I took my 2 dc aged 2.8 and 4 months to church this morning and it was full of kids. Most being quite loud but no one minded they encourage children at church

YANBU. I take all 3 of mine to our local church, everyone is welcome and toddlers are known to wonder during the sermon. When it comes to the prayers the vicar says "a moment of peace, but please don't expect silence." That seems to be the general feeling, but I know his view is not always universal. My feeling is that we and our children are the future of the church. We have as much right to be there as anyone. We are going to Christingle on Thursday. They make 250 and give them out to the under 16's. My lot will definitley be contributing to the general din!

We always go to the carol service, DS1 was fine and slept through it first two years, last year he was quite noisy, we ended up going into the little room at the back of the church to listen from there and not disturb anyone, afterwards there were refreshments and the vicar / old ladies serving tea / etc were all lovely to us - every time we go there they are incredibly welcoming and tolerant of children. They are attached to the cofe school round the corner where ds1 goes to preschool, so that might explain why, come to think of it!

YANBU at all! This is one of my greatest bugbears.

We have been "shushed at" before and it is not a pleasant experience. Neither is it remotely appropriate. Babies and toddlers can't be held remotely responsible for the noises they make - they are babies! 19months is far too young to be able to sit still and quiet for a whole service!

I have a theory about these miserable people who comment - they either have never taken their kids to church or have conveniently forgotten what it is like!

The same people who grump about noisy kids tend to harp on about children being "The future of the church". No they ARE NOT the future, they ARE the present, they are valid church members in their own right!!

Sorry... went all ranty then!

YAdefinatelyNBU

Apologies mowcop that was not aimed at you at all! I have just read through the thread! I should read first . You obviously know the place of children in your church family. My comment was aimed at those in my church particularly who make the right noises about welcoming children and then complain anyway!

Didn't mean to offend.