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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

To think this is unfair punishment to my DS?

45 replies

SingleMum01 · 03/12/2009 09:15

My DS told me he had to miss playtime yesterday and some of his Friday golden time this week as he had pushed a child over. Fair enough.

However, when I asked him what had happened he told me the other child was teasing him and pushed him quite a few times and he'd had enough. Unfortunately for my DS the dinner lady only saw my DS push the other child and told his teacher that.

From what I can gather neither child were given the opportunity to say what happened to the teacher and as a result my DS has received a punishment but the other child hasn't.

Unfortunately for my DS too, the other child is a girl who is smaller than my DS.

To my knowledge I've never seen or heard of my DS start a fight, he's usually quite a gentle child.

My DS is upset that he is receiving all the punishment and the other child isn't getting any. He understands that he shouldn't have pushed the other child and he should be punished. Now I know I wasn't there so can't be sure what exactly happened, but I feel it is unfair.

My DS wants me to speak to the teacher about the unfairness, so I don't think he's lying as if he was he wouldn't want me to speak to the teacher!

OP posts:

Bucharest · 03/12/2009 09:19

I'd have a word. This recently happened to me. DD kicked a boy (and was justly punished) but she had kicked him because he had spat his biscuit in her face at breaktime and the teacher hadn't noticed.

Go at it gently, acknowledging that ds was indeed wrong, but you wanted the teacher to be aware that it was a reaction not an action. That's what I said to mine, and she said, yes, some of the other kids had told her the same and she would be having a word with spitty's mother.

shopalot · 03/12/2009 09:19

So do you think both children should be punished? Is that what you want the teachers to do? (how old is DS?)

wannaBe · 03/12/2009 09:19

yabu.

He pushed another child. He was seen pushing another child.

Vivia · 03/12/2009 09:20

Exactly, wannaBe. The context is irrelevant. He did wrong.

Brunettelady · 03/12/2009 09:21

It does seem unfair if your DS is telling the truth but unfortunately if teachers had parents speaking to them every time children squabbled, I don't think they would get anything done. Teachers can often only punish what they see as children (not saying your DS) often lie to get out of things and it is hard to know what to believe sometimes.

Why don't you ask your DS to go and speak to his teacher and explain at the beginning of playtime, instead of you doing it?

Stayingsunnygirl · 03/12/2009 09:25

I agree that it does seem very unfair, that the child who pushed yours to the point of retaliation has got away with it, and I would have a word with the teacher - acknowledging that your ds was in the wrong to push the child, but asking that the other child involved should be told that such behaviour is not acceptable either.

Original poster

SingleMum01 · 03/12/2009 09:31

Wannabe and Vivia - what does YANBU mean?

I haven't got a problem with my DS receiving his punishment - he pushed another child and therefore should be. However, if what he says is correct apart from it being unfair that the other child doesn't also receive a punishment then he is also learning its okay to start the 'fight' as you don't get punished for it.

BrunetteLady - my DS says he tried to speak to the teacher but she told him she didn't want to know.

He told me she wants to speak to me (so it maybe more serious than he has told me), but at least this gives him the opportunity to explain his side of events.

OP posts:

Original poster

SingleMum01 · 03/12/2009 09:32

Shopalot - yes I think both children should be punished. My DS is 7, the other child is 6.

OP posts:

shopalot · 03/12/2009 09:38

YANBU - You are not being unreasonable
YABU - You are being unreasonable.

My ds is 7 and he knows that it is unacceptable to hit/push girls under any circumstance. Are we old fashioned!????? If the teacher wants to see you then you should discuss it with her/him. Otherwise I would leave it and let the school deal with it if this is the first time he has been wrongly punished. I am afraid ds will need to wise up and not get caught next time....

handbagqueen · 03/12/2009 09:39

Its a really difficult one, let me share a recent experiene with you. My DD and her best friend have fallen out. Last week DD sobbed her heart out and told me about how her former best friend spent play time shouting in her face with another girl and was generally being horrid to her, DD went to tell a teacher and her friend ran to the teacher and told her DD has thumped her, so she was told off. I was horrified and quite upset by this so I spoke to the mother of this girl (who I know really well). She spoke to her DD who told the opposite and it was my DD who was excluding her from the game - she believes her DD and I believe mine. I don't think we'll get to the bottom of it. I have learnt from this experience to not get involved, children are upset by something one day and forget it the next.

If you feel strongly you can talk to the teacher, but each child will only give a certain amount of information so the teachers, unfortunately can only react to what they see not what they are told.

Brunettelady · 03/12/2009 09:39

Thats not a very nice thing for the teacher to say to your DS. If he said the teacher wants to speak to you then yes, go and see her after school. Even if she didn't say that, at least you can explain the situation to her.

And I wish people would read the bloody posts properly before saying that YABU! I could clearly see that you had no problem with your DS being punished, and that was not the issue.

Vivia · 03/12/2009 09:47

OP, I meant that the teachers - even being made aware of the context - will still punish your DS according to the plain fact that he did wrong - and was caught. His true account of the events leading up to it probably won't count for much. So YABU to think that the context matters much. Your son would have been disciplined regardless. Though a pity, it's probably a good (though sad) life lesson for him. You can't just lash out, even if provoked, because you're doing wrong and you'll probably get caught. It's not fair or equal, I know.

2shoes · 03/12/2009 09:50

yabu
he was seen hurting a smaller child
I doubt if he now says days later that she hit him first that it will make much difference tbh.

Original poster

SingleMum01 · 03/12/2009 09:53

I don't believe the context should be irrelevant - if it was you (not saying that you'd push someone) wouldn't you want the opportunity to explain before punishment is given out.

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Sassybeast · 03/12/2009 09:56

I think I'd wait and speak to the teacher before you decide how unfair she has been. Whatever the context, he was aggressive and received a punishment. He's hardly likely to tell you that he was in the wrong is he ? Get all the facts before you start blaming the teacher.

shopalot · 03/12/2009 09:58

It must have been quite a push as no playtime and no golden time is a tough punishment. Us teachers never want to have to keep children in at playtime believe me as we end up having to supervise them There is more to this than you realise. Let them deal with it. Let your son know that it is up to the school and you won't be leaping in at every chance. He is 7. He is playing you perhaps!!

Original poster

SingleMum01 · 03/12/2009 09:59

2shoes - so its okay for a smaller child to tease and push (quite a few times) a bigger child and for the bigger child to take it?

OP posts:

Original poster

SingleMum01 · 03/12/2009 10:00

PS - the other child plays rough - I've seen her punch her nan and uncle in the playground.

OP posts:

Original poster

SingleMum01 · 03/12/2009 10:02

Shopalot - I suspect there maybe more, and am quite happy to listen and take on board what the teacher has to say. However, as my son is also quite happy for me to talk to the teacher (he would be quite adamant he wouldn't want me to if it was all his fault!)I don't think he was the instigator and only want fair punishment for all.

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Brunettelady · 03/12/2009 10:06

"She punches her nan and uncle in the playground"!!!! What a pleasent child. I get soooo pissed off that there are people out there who let a child behave like this.

shopalot · 03/12/2009 10:07

Fair enough. Say to the teacher that your son said you wanted to see me. Is everything ok? Let her explain. Will put your mind at rest. at other child punching nan and uncle.

MillyMollyMoo · 03/12/2009 10:07

Honestly, it will not kill him to take the punishment and he did push which is not the way you want him to react when he's a 6' teenager so he might as well learn now.
On the other hand if you go whinging to the school over every decision they make, they will stop taking you seriously, teachers do take the piss out of parents in the staff room and have their favourites and the ones they dread seeing coming up the path.
I would leave it, really I would.

Original poster

SingleMum01 · 03/12/2009 10:12

MillyMollyMoo - he understands he earned his punishment as much as he dislikes it. I'm really not saying he shouldn't get it - he totally should.

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shopalot · 03/12/2009 10:15

We do roll our eyes at some parents in the staff room

tethersend · 03/12/2009 10:18

I think, in a way, this is a valuable lesson to learn for your DS- school is not always fair.

Teachers are human, and go on what they see. They make mistakes, just like he did.

He was seen to push another child over. This was wrong. He could have avoided this. What should he have done? Told the teacher the minute he was pushed. Had he done this, the other child would have been punished. Because he didn't, she got away with it and he was punished. This was a direct consequence of his actions.

There's nothing wrong with expecting him to be better behaved than the other child.

It may be good for him to learn that once you engage in behaviour such as pushing or hitting, you lose the moral high ground regards 'fairness' IYSWIM. In other words, no-one will listen to you. It's a good opportunity to discuss remaining calm when provoked, and how to manage this; it's a good life skill to have.

If you get involved at this point, he will have nothing to learn from the situation other than you and the teachers disagree. Believe me, this will not be the only instance of unfairness in his school life- brace yourself for the long haul if you want to right every wrong. If I were you, I'd pick my battles, and I'm not sure this would be one of them.

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