to think my CBT therapist is living in cloud cuckoo land?

[othermother]

I actually want to tell her to just fuck right off!

She's very lovely and all that,but I don't think she has much life experience at all, and she's telling me that I am supposed to replace my negative feelings with positive ones. My main problem is my youngest son who has asd and he's extrememly challenging, and my biggest gripe is that my dh just cannot handle him and so I end up dealing with all his behaviours (on top of work, housework, looking after the other kids etc) and she expects me to turn my neg feelings round by thinkibng that dh "tries" to help.

I want to fucking knock six something or others (far too stressed to even remember the phrase) and ram them down his throat NOT praise him for fucking trying. I'm sick of being the one doing it all, and then now I'm supposed to feel I'm wrong for feeling angry and am supposed to find some positive somewhere out of all of this. I'm not best happy.

I'm sorry for those of you that have had negative experiences of cbt and as I've said i don't see it as a cure all and think it is sometimes applied far to prescriptively.

However categorising all cbt as rubbish based on your individual experience is unhelpful and unfair. It really does work for some people, actually turns their life around. I've had people close to me have some terrible experiences with counselling but i'm sure it's a valuable approach for some people and in some circumstances.

Research indicates that regardless of the approach used the therapeutic relationship is the most important factor with regards to change, it sounds that this might be anissue in the ops case.

Don't give up on it - there WILL be things you can learn and while it might not solve any of your immediately issues, you MAY learn some techniques that will help you in other areas of your life at other times. So make the most of it now that you are doing it - try to keep an open mind and take what you CAN from it. You can always think about different approaches afterwards.

numnumnumnum i can't beieve what your therapist told you. I am so sorry for that and what happened in your childhood

On a brighter note I am on waiting list for CBT, really looking forward to it now!

CBT seems a very odd choice of therapy- You have a need which needs to be met.

I have a DS with ASD and he can be very challenging. DP doesn't always help as much as he should and we are getting couples therapy to work through it. If I was referred to CBT I would feel like my real life experience and feelings were being invalidated. Surely if you need more help, you need more help. Whether that comes through working with your partner to work out what works for you or getting outside help. Its bloody ridiculous to offer you CBT. Its like feeling hungry, telling someone you feel hungry and then them patting you on the head and saying "there there dear, you just think you feel hungary, you dont really need to eat."

CBT is realy effective particuarly with anxiety disorders and deprssion- becuase these are often assocuated with people who have developde negative thougt patterns and negative beliefs about the world and/or themsleves and others, that they view the world through which then affects how they feel and behave/interact, and for some poele becomg aware of this, realising that can be changed (often slowly-many poele initally beleive they cannot change how/what they think) will make them feel better.

negatie and fearful thoughts patterns are often at the root of depression/ anxiety and CBT is very helpful in these cases.

Obviously though, if someone has died or your circumstances are so negative, then you need a diffrent type of therapy or support.

A problem with this is often depressed poeple will beleivce that their circumstances are alawys awful and that life is terrible for them and there is nothing they can do about it, so this is a judgement call for a therapist.

You need to tell your therapist what you are feeling about the sessions and then maybe stick with it for a while longer to work out with her, what your problems are and how you need to adress them. Would you just feel better if you could access more support? Is there a repeated interaction between you and your DH? what is your role in it? what is his? how can this be addressed? Do you have automatic thoughts and resposnes which are negatibe and which make you feel bad?

You and she can then begin to make a decisions on a way forward for you. Sounds like she has just assumed CBT is for you and is ploughing on, you need to disuss this with her.

CBT is not about blaming you for negative patterns, but helping you reconise if this is the case and helipng you change that so you feel better. It's not a punitive 'stop that' therapy but ading a realistaion that there is a differnt way of being that will make you happier; and most poele state their aims on enetring therpay as wanting to be happier.

happiness is rarely acheieved by jsut a change in extrenal circumstances (althouhgh unhappiness can be removed instantly by this) but is often something more internal that we can work upon and recognise and it will increase our happiness.

I think CBT is a very buddist approach to life.

Unfortunately it's now been medicalised and is being trotted out as a simplistic cure all.

Minx - I have had a really positive experience with CBT, don't worry, its not all negative on here .

I just said, earlier in the thread, that it doesn't seem like the correct treatment for the op's problems.

I'm very puzzled as to why you were referred for cbt, to be frank. I wouldn't have thought it was the treatment of choice for either dealing with relationship issues or coming to terms with a child's asd or coping a partner's bipolar disorder, come to that. I'm surprised the GP thought it might be helpful in your situation. Have you got a diagnosis of clinical depression? Or do you think the GP just wanted to offer you something rather than nothing and so referred you because there wasn't anything more suitable?

p.s. Happy birthday!

Phew, I'm glad some people have a good word for CBT, DD is going to getting it for anxiety/phobias so hopefully it will work for her.

Happy Birthday BTW

I don't think CBT is completely useless all the time. I just found it completely useless for my own Anxiety Disorder. Xanax on the other hand, works a treat.

WOW!! Loads of replies, thanks. Thanks for birthday wishes too

I feel lots better today, I think it just really gets to me more of an evening as that seems to be the time of day when ds plays up more and dh is home so I feel kind of resentful that he doesn't do more (he DOES try, but he just cannot for whatever reason handle ds).

I'm not totally against CBT, and I can see that it will definitely help me in some other areas of my life, just it isn't particularly helpful re coping with ds I don't think. No matter how much I try to focus on his positives, and on dh's positives, when you're being screamed at by a child for the millionth time for not answering a question in exactly the right way, or he's winding up everyone else in the household by being very disruptive, or he needs stroking again as his skin has just brushed past something and it needs to feel "right" (all these are a part of his asd), well I just find it impossible to feel anything but stressed, tired, in need of a break etc.

I shall persevere with the CBT, as like I said, I'm sure it will help in other areas of my life, but I shall also talk to her about how I feel in relation to the CBT and the ongoing stress that i don't see any way of avoiding.

Thanks everyone, it's been interesting to read other people's experiences of CBT, both good and bad.

haven't read all the posts but this seems more like an issue for Relate ( marriage guidance.)

Alarm bells rang when you said your therapist was funny and dippy- therapists are supposed to keep their personalities under wraps and focus on YOU. How on earth is she seeming funny nad dippy in a session?

You might also be better off by joining support groups for mums like yourself ( such as hyper active childrens support groups) or trying to find a parenting class or a parentng coach.

CBT is better for phobias, depression and so on- you seem to need something else.

I must say I agree with all the posters who say that CBT is probably not what the OP needs at the moment. It sounds as though you require more support rather than re-evaluation of how you deal emotionally with things.

For the record I think that CBT can play a really important role in recovery from some forms of depressions. However I do think that there is a slight "one size fits all" approach perpetuated by therapists.

I am half way through a course of therapy at the moment and took a good couple of weeks for me to get what I needed from the sessions. And I did that by being quite insistent about how just pointing out the positives wasn't really helping. Without going into too much detail, we have now developed a more despoke model (still based on CBT principles) to work on and it does help. I did need to be quite bullish in getting there though and I know that not everyone is comfortable being like that. Hope this helps....

I've had different kinds of therapy including CBT and I think what matters most is how experienced your therapist is, and also how able they are to cope with you being honest. You are completely right to be frank with her about your doubts/concerns/anger, etc.

If she can't handle it/it feels wrong, then maybe you can get referred to someone more experienced? The NHS is pouring lots of cash into CBT now and lots of young people are being trained as therapists. A student straight out of school isn't necessarily going to be equipped to deal with complex cases like yours.

But it's often good to give it some time before deciding - starting therapy is hard work, especially at first. If you can articulate clearly what you need, it might help her/them to help you better. Good luck.

CBT TrainingI am interested in the assumption that young people are being trained in CBT- as someone who works and is trained in a similar talking therapy, I cannot train in CBT as i am not a dr or a nurse.

CBT training is usually only offered to anyone who is medical and used to take 5 years training- I have looked into the courses for myself.

If anyone knows differently tell me as i want to learn!

"Research indicates that regardless of the approach used the therapeutic relationship is the most important factor with regards to change, it sounds that this might be an issue in the ops case."

minx, this is just what I was going to say!

purplepeony - I think what CocoK is referring to is the gov's new IAPT scheme (Improved Access to Psychological Therapies). There is a Low Intensity and a High Intensity training programme, both a year long with BABCP accreditation after completing HI.

The LI's are not 'students straight out of school' but most likely have worked for a few years in support work/assistant psychologist/research assistant type roles. In our place of work they are aged between 23 and 55. The HI's are generally more experienced, often counsellors or counselling psychologists, sometimes just experienced assistant psychologists.

Basically they get a very intensive CBT crash course, covering anxiety disorders and mild-moderate depression. The DoH has decided that sticking everyone on ADs and giving them disability benefits has got to stop, the whole point of IAPT is really to get people off benefits and back into work. As CBT seems to have a good evidence base (unlike a lot of other therapies) this is the method of choice, 6-20 sessions and on your way. This is obviously far from ideal, but it has to be better than only giving someone meds and sending them away again without any offer of talking therpay, which is a story we hear all the time.

It is a different approach in that CBT therapists are able to be a bit more 'human' with their patients and be humourous, show their personalities a bit more so the fact that the OP's therapist was 'funny' and 'dippy' would be acceptable as long as she was professional. I understand that therapists from other discipline's are supposed to more of a 'blank slate' for the patient and to keep their own personalities out of it.

OP, I also am struggling to see what the CBT referral was for, but like others have said, you may learn some useful coping techniques and strategies, or you may not! Personally I would have recommended couples therapy too.

why not give hypnotherapy a shot, might get on better with that than CBT!!

Jayceybee- I am still puzzled by the training you talk about.
My research showed that to be a CBT practitoner you had to have a degree in psychiatry or mental health nurse and undertake a long training.

alos, IME of knowing lots of counsellors, professionally and privately, none is able to access CBT training as it is something very different.

How is the governt. advertising this training?

CBT seems to be working well with my son, who suffers from self-esteem issues and has been the target of bullies.

CBT is helpful for some problems (allegedly) but I have never found it anything other than useless.
Ime, it involves denying the problem exists.
It is a 'quick fix' and often there are short term results, but long term, the results are poor.
It's the current 'cure-all'. It'll be out of fashion in about 10 years time.

purplepeony - there are certainly therapists in my service who are have trained as mental health nurses, none of us are psychiatrists as they mostly work in secondary care and we are a primary care service. We almost all have psychology backgrounds, honours/masters degrees in psychology. LI IAPT is basically a post grad certificate that enables you to practice CBT at a basic level in GP surgeries for the NHS, HI's are BABCP accredited, this means they practice more intensive formulation-based CBT in the NHS with more severe/complex patients than the LI's, possibly could take private clients too but don't quote me on that.

As far as the advertising for the training, I have seen nothing in the mainstream media, the LI's and HI's here were notified of the upcoming positions through their existing jobs in the PCT or they saw them on the NHS jobs websites. IAPT is always being discussed in the health section in wednesdays Guardian too, and my bosses have been on Radio 4 discussing it a few times.

Have a look at this link, might have some more relevant info

www.iapt.nhs.uk/workforce/

Of course, this will all be redundant when the Tories get in and slash mental health funding to shit!

abra1d if you don't mind me asking, did it take long to see an improvement in your son?

I'm a bit yeah but not but about CBT in this instance - as I think that you get the best support about behaviour/SN from people who have lived with it in their own families (or from people who can either offer you useful suggestions or even respite) - but I can see that CBT could have a role in dealing with the ?bipoloar/?bipolar tendencies, in learning to cope with both ends of the mood swings. my own experience of CBT was very positive.

I've been considering going to the GP for help with depression. I don't think I'll bother now. I'm definately not a CBT type and it wouldn't suit me at all. I have imagination enough to be able to see all sides to something, but sometimes that only increases the sense of hopelessness because seeing all sides isn't a solution iygwim.

I'd prefer any method that give ms a kick start to help myself, rather than turning to someone else and telling them all about it. They would never understand in a million, zquillion years and 20 sessions won't even scratch the surface wrt the problems, let alone contribute to any solutions.

Anyone have any suggestions. I reckon Meds, or a holiday/respite.

Purple, mate of mine is training in CBT. (Presumably under the IAPT scheme Jacey's talking about.) She's not a nurse or anything, has some qualifications in wibbly wobbly stuff I don't understand (Neuro Linguistic Programming was one of them IIRC) but is studying for a Masters, with supervised clinical placements.