...to feel like I burden the nursery workers with my child?

[gobsmackedetal]

I'll try to keep this short. DD (3.4) started nursery 3 months ago. There were a few tears to start with, but I didn't think much of it, most kids there were crying and it was the firs time for her to be cared for by someone other than myself, DH, GPs or her nanny. We went through the adjustment period, like all the other children did, but as the other children were slowly adjusting, mine wasn't.

She now seems to have accepted the fact that she'll go, she still pleads in the mornings not to but goes, with a few tears. She always pees herself while in nursery, although some times she uses the toilet as well. She most of the time joins in activites that are managed by the "teacher", like singing, dancing, but she follows the teacher around and hasn't formed any bonds with any children. When I go to pick her up she never plays with the other kds, just sits in the corner looking out of the window, anxiously awaiting to be picked up. The main teacher is very nice to me, but I feel that her "helper" is getting a bit short with us as time goes by (possibly because she's always the one to change DDs wet clothes).

I feel that the situation is beyond normal. I am well read concerning parenting, I've tried several ways to help DD, anything any book has eevr suggested, she just doesn't seem to want to be at nursery.

I know for a fact she well cared for there. She was now given a line to sya in the christmas play and I know she's not going to (forgot to mention she hasn't spoken to ehr teachers yet, although she's a little pleasant chatterbox when with us). The teachers have to involve her in everything they do, but she refuses to take part or talk to them, making their lives and the lives of the other children more difficult.

AIBU to feel terrible about her behaviour and like I'm burdening them with my child? I hate droping off/picking her up now because I don't want to look at them (although I'm sure they'd never say anything bad -but it only takes two braincells to understand how difficult dd makes their day)

PS: She only goes 5 hours a day, 5 days a week and that's the minimum we can do. Can't afford a child psychologist and I keep saying to myself we don't need one, but deep down I think we do

No childcare alternative I'm afraid. I said "only" 5 hours meaning that I don't work full days +commuting so she doesn't do 8 to 6 like many children there.

She seemed to be adjusting a while ago. And it's a good place, she learns so many things and she's genuinely happy she knows them, comes home and tells me evrything the teacher talked to them about at school. But it's the wetting and the refusal to speak that worries me that they might have had enough of her..

I so hope IABU

why is there no alternative?

are there no childminders/alternative nurseries/nannies in your area at all?

can you invite a child over / meet up with parent and child and allow your DD to get to know the other children when she's with you?

My ds3 didn't speak when he first when into a fairly formal nursery (which was stunning as he is extremely loud at home). He was bordering (imo) on selective mute and when I saw him at nursery I was staggered at how mouse-like he was. Suddenly he started talking and now doesn't stop.

I would talk more to the staff though. It's their job and you shouldn't feel bad about asking them anything. You also shouldn't hesitate to move her. I moved my ds 1 and the difference was astounding.

If there really is no alternative I think you need to be banging down some doors on your dd's behalf. Don't feel she's a burden, you need to stand up for her, don't forget you're a paying customer.

I don't think there is anything wrong with your child other than she is unhappy at nursery. Why not keep her at home another year?
If you need to work then a childminder might be mch less stressful for her, closer to a home rather than institutional environment?
I would find a way to get her out of a place she is clearly finding stressful and not enjoying.

'Genuinely happy' -she doesn't join in with free play, doesn't talk , wets herself and waits for you to return - all after 3 months.
I'm not trying to upset you-just saying that her being an inconvenience is not the problem. Her anxiety needs to be dealt with.
Why are there no alternatives - is it a has to go to this nursery to get into the school situation?

We live in greece at the moment and probably for the next couple of years. She's fluent in greek, so no problem there. The nurseries are public, are only for working mothers with a limited capacity and take children according to address. No private places in the area, her nanny would let her watch tv and eat chocolate all day and lie to me about things. I'd have to look for another nanny that I won't know if I can trust, never heard of childminders here. Not working not an option.

But you guys are right, I have to get over my worries about the nursury thinking I'm being precious!I suppose we'd have to make plan together.

I'd definately be speaking to a teacher about helping her does she mix with other children out of nursery? If she doesn't then maybe even somewhere like a softplay centre would help her to be "around" other children. Is she timid in doors? does she jump at noises or cry really easily? My friends little girl does and her mum made her that way a little bit by reacting like that! My friends DD won't get messy either because when she was weaned she wasn't allowed to if a little bit of food was on the edge of her mouth she would make a fuss and clean it immediately! Susquently it took her a lot longer to settle at nursery than some of the other children!!
She had a little boy that we used to socialise with in her class so that helped but even now in social situations it takes her a long time to leave her parents.
Not all of this is my friends fault, some of it is her DD's personality but my friend now has to make more effort to get her to socialise!
Personally if she is having trouble adjusting to nursery after 3months I would look for a childminder and see if you can do half and half? If that works better then switch to the CM. CM in my opinion are a lot more focused on individual needs as they only ever have a max of 3 under 5's to deal with, whereas nursery a key worker may have 5 children over the week period to deal with iykwim?
I don't think she needs to see a physicologist that might make her worse, talk to her and ask what she does and doesn't like about nursery?
Is there activities you do at home she would particularly like?
Also I would arrive unannounced middle of the day or an hour later to peak through and see how she is doing, you might find its an act to a degree children can be manlipative from a young age without realising it or doing it nastily!

what happened to her nanny? i would find another one or a childminder tbh

Have you checked her hearing recently?? She may have glue ear and can't hear what's going on so is isolated from others.

A good nursery would pick this up. I am concerned the nursery aren't coming up with some solutions to this issue.

It's the helpers job to be nice to your daughter. If she can't deal with wee, then she is in the wrong job and loads of children wet themselves at this age so is utterly normal. It's probably due to her not feeling able to communicate her needs - in time or at all.

I think you need to speak with the nursery and your health visitor, if not improvement in 3-4 weeks then change your childcare.

i don't know so much about the other stuff but who honestly cares about the wetting, so long as it's not bothering your dd? it's just a bit of pee. my dd peed her pants a surprising amount at nursery, they told me it was par for the course because the kids get the toy they want and are damned if they're going to give it up... until... oops.

i'd consider a 'special nursery pull up' if it's bothering her and i do think you need to pull your socks up and speak to the teachers about how she's doing.

Does she socialise with other chldren outside of nursery? What is she like with them? And what is she like when (if) you leave her with other people, is she happy enough?

If she is ok in other settings with children and being left, maybe you should look at the nursery and that she's not happy there in particular.
If she had true seperation anxiety she would generally be like that whenever you left her.

You must speak to the staff, it's vitally important for your dd that you know what's going on and how they deal with it. Do not be embarrassed, this is all part of 'teaching' and caring for children and if you feel that they cannot handle it effectively to help your dd find somewhere else.

And make sure you speak to the helper too. It's making me v annoyed that she's a bit short with you. Does your dd like her?

she does sound so unhappy, could you reduce her hours maybe? So she doesn't have to go in everyday?

My dd has been in nursery part time since she was 8 months old through neccessity as i had to retutn to work. Although she's never been unhappy with it she did go through a stage of wetting again whn she changed rooms having being trained for a while (she's 3 now).

I'm afraid the longer you leave it before putting them in nurseries the tougher it is for them to settle and the harder the separation. It sounds like she needs a more individualised plan of care for when she's there, some 1:1 time with a key worker and some work around her anxieties.

Play therapy may help with this although this is a scant resource nowadays unfortunately. It's not about how it's bothering them, it's about her emotions, that is the primary concern here. I think you need to work with the nursery comprehensively to address this. If not ry alternative care. If the same problems occur then maybe consider a child psychology referral.

I do feel however at the age she is it's essential she has some social contact with other childern of a similar age a couple of times a week. Otherwise school will be v difficult for her. I speak from bitter experience, I hated nursery (was v like your dd) and then school was even more traumatic, can remember not kicking off or fighting but just going in feeling so anxious for years. I don't mean to frighten you but please don't let this happen to your dd.

best of luck

I can't tell you all how grateful I am for your replies, I felt so alone in this before.

I don't mean to run but it's 11.30 here and I need to go to bed, but please keep posting, will be back here a couple of times during the night with DS

I'll try to make an appointment with her key worker at drop off tomorrow

You are mentioning that she is a chatterbox at home. So what does she say about the nursery? At this age you probably can have a good dialogue with her.

I would ask her -in a very calm and natural way- what she likes and what doesn't like about the nursery, who she likes and who she doesn't, who she trusts and who she doesn't, if someone there upsets her or intimidates her etc.

There are many ways to do this. One way is to do it like a game, everybody says something about his day. You can start by saying that you had good or bad day at work, problems with a colegue, good friendship with another one...Then encourage her to do the same.

And don't worry too much about what other people think or what the books say.What does YOUR DD say?

i would have no qualms about finding a new nanny.

the thing is, it's her happiness that is key! i would rather my child sat around watching tv and eating crap happily all day, than went to a nursery where she was so unhappy she refused to talk and wet herself.

sorry, but i tyhink you want her there because it's convenient and you don't want the hassle of finding a new nanny.

You say you've read a lot of books.. Maybe some ones about emotions and children.I know there's a hell of a lot on Amazon.
My feeling is that this isn't a matter for a child pyschologist, but needs more care from the nursery and maybe some rejigging of your childcare.
I do feel for you and your dd.
Could she do part nanny/other childcare and part the nursery? Then it wouldn't matter so much if she ate chocolate and watched tv.Obviously you can't have a nanny who lies. Do you know any sahms you could have as unofficial (paid) childcare? Sorry if that's not something you would do-it's just something I and some of my friends do and I'm trying to think around the problem for you.

Are her grandparents in the country? Could they help?How about English Tefl teachers that work at the night schools in the evenings-some of them are probably experienced in childcare too.

What about an au pair?
Could you work from home at all?

You could do a shout out on here for any mums living in Greece as they would understand the childcare situation in Greece.

What's your dd like with other kids when you're with her? If she's fine then you know it's a problem with her feelings in her nursery setting, if she's quiet when you're with her then you know you can work on her socialising at home/taking her out and about and meeting other kids.

Thisisyesterday, OP doesn't live in uk, she is in Greece. I lived there for 8 months and nannies are not good like in uk, and cm don't exist. So i don't think op just want 'to avoid hassle'.
Unless she gets a live-in nanny from uk if she has the space....

Who looks after your son while you work, Presumably your nanny? Why can't dd stay at home with them? You are expressing empathy in you posts with the nursery workers more than with your dd which seems a bit back to front to me.
The nursey doesn't sound like they are trying to help your dd much, is it really a good place to leave her?

Not ideal as she is the nanny you have sounds an infinitely better option than the nursery.

I think some people are being unduly harsh here. It doesn't sound like gobsmacked has a lot of childcare options.

gobsmacked, I think you are a slight disadvantage in that your dd is your eldest and you don't know what is "normal" and what is not. All my 4 boys have gone to nursery and one nursery in particular caused ds1 a lot of stress. I actually thought at the time that ds1 was being "awkward" as he was clearly very intelligent but had trouble potty training. In my mind, at that time, an intelligent child should have no trouble figuring out when to use the potty! In actual fact, it's not that simple, you can be intelligent but still have an immature bladder. It was only when we moved nurseries that I saw how poor the first nursery had been and that even if ds1 was "different" or "awkward" he should have been looked after with kindness and empathy.

I also wonder if your dd is upset that she is at nursery while ds gets to stay at home? A friend of mine had problems like this with her dd which improved once her ds started at nursery.

Don't know if it has already been said, but if she isn't talking, is she wetting because she isn't asking to go? when ds1 was wetting himself (in his case he just wouldn't put his toy down) at nursery they just used to inform him it was time to go to the toilet from time to time.
I'm sure ds1 was at least as much "trouble" as your dd. He still hasn't really mastered playing with other children (he is 4.10 and has a little brother), I don't think that's unusual at all at 3.
His nursery didn't feel his behaviour was a "burden". They took the time to work it out and recognise what it meant, and helped him to interact better with other children. When we had his leaving report it was obvious they knew him well - the good and the bad. I think a good nursery should be like this.
And they still accepted ds2...