...to not go back to this playgroup?

[fattybumbum]

To cut a long story short, I have a 6 week old baby and a 3, nearly 4 year old boy. I'm finding the whole thing hard anyway and am quite hormonal but had discovered a way of making my life easier by getting out every morning as it's the only way the baby will drop off (in his pram) and stay asleep so I can have some close time with my older son (the baby cries all afternoon).

Anyway, I'd started going to the local playgroup on Mon and Wed mornings. It is v close but not popular as it has mainly childminders at it and they aren't friendly to others. Also I am from another country so it's a little harder for me to 'connect'. However, it is local, I can't drive and I'm desperate at the minute, so we've been going religiously ... even if no one talks to us!

Anyway, near the end of the group, my son was playing with a toy kitchen and started banging the door of the cupboard over and over again. The woman who runs the group (who is at least 60) was sitting with all her mates near him. I was much further away, jiggling the baby. She told him to stop banging the cupboard door as he would break it. He didn't stop so she got up, pointed her finger in his face and shouted 'I said no' then sat down again without looking at me (she had to face in my direction).

I felt really upset as they obviously thought I hadn't told him off so was being a bad mother but tbh I think that it is ok for a kid to open and shut a door repetitively. It's a toy for feck's sake! I feel like they didn't like the irritating noise as it was ruining their chat, rather than being bothered about the toy.Also they are not friendly and I feel (rather paranoidly) that they see me as 'different'. Also DS is very large for his age (and very boisterous and loud) and so his behaviour always looks worse. I've also wondered that if the childn=minders and leaders are all older that maybe they're coming from a different mentality of child rearing.

Now I'm stuck with the dilemma of going back (feeling bullied) or not going in which case I'll have to walk the streets to get the baby off to sleep. In this weather I find the idea lonely and depressing. I'm feeling very lonely at the minute anyway. There aren't any other local playgroups on on those days so I've no where else to go. I wish I had more mum friends but I don't. I'm possibly being unreasonably sensitive about the whole thingso would like so unbiased opinions.

Do you know, maybe they just felt he needed to be told to stop and weren't blaming you? They probably saw you were busy with your younger child.

I'm being nice about them because what you're doing is good for you and your children and I don't think you should stop going. So, YABU but very nicely as you're hormonal

It's just the way she shouted and pointed her finger plus avoided eye contact with me afterwards too. It did feel aggressive.

Also would you tell off a child for banging a toy kitchen cupboard door over and over again? You see I wouldn't as it wasn't hard enough to break it and I would see it as him 'exploring' the toy in a way he wouldn't be allowed to with a real cupboard door. Maybe I am being precious though.

Ignore her. There was a woman like this at the parent and toddler group I went to. She was and still is a busybody.

I would expect a nearly 4 year old to stop when asked though. And maybe it was the irritating noise she didn't like - is that such a bad thing? She shouldn't have told him off, but I think it was fine to ask him to stop and to be firm with him when he didn't.

I don't think the age of the people involved ( apart form the child, obviously) is relevant.

hmmm maybe a little U, because it'd drive me crackers and maybe she didn't want him to hurt himself? but understandable you're feeling down and think they're a bit mean for not coming to talk to you. Have you tried conversing with them? I know its hard, but at least if you try and they're ignorant you'll know.

Otherwise how about mumsnet local for meeting people?
Does Ds attend nursery yet? if not, then maybe you could see about getting him in for a couple of hours a day for you to have a break and also meet people.

To be honest I find that sort of noise incredibly irritating and yes I probably would want the child to stop doing it. However, I wouldn't have done what she did in the way that she did it. I'd have probably tried to distract him with something else. SHe probably didn't think anything about your parenting skills at all. SHe probably didn't even know who be belonged to!

Don't stop going to the playgroup. I find it hard to click with those sorts of groups and I wonder if it is because I never go often enough. I think you need to keep at it really. You'll soon pick up other mothers.

I probably would have stopped him, tbh, because if there were other children around I'd be worried they'd get fingers caught (and you did say he was very boisterous!)

You're not being precious and you're probably soooo tired, so go back and act like nothing happened if you can.

Failing that, hunt out another group - I do appreciate some groups are better for the "livelier" kids (have 3 myself!!)

Best of luck. Do give them another chance though, it would be a shame to leave and your son won't remember any of it.

Banging something repeatedly after being asked not to is naughty. You should have stopped him, or at least have the grace not to moan when someone else does.

You are being oversensitive, but it does seem this group is not for you.Do you have a Surestart group near you? They are generally friendlier than average.Being lonely sucks the big one, I really feel for you.

Go again, no one is going to remember which child was making a racket last week, there will be child or 3 making a racket next week and teh week after. sometimes its your kid sometimes it not.

YABU. Totally agree with Colditz. You should have stopped your child reapeatedly banging the door. It's not what the toy is design to do and he should be told that. If he was 18 months you old that sort of behaviour is expected bu not at nearly 4.

However you're cutting your nose to spite your face if you don't go back and as you say no one will remeber next week. You're blowing up a minor incident into something it's not.

shame you feel lonely and bitty cut off esp with new baby and toddler.well done for dragging yourself to group that takes resolve it really does

tbh,unlikely lady will recall an individual boisterous wee boy.do keep try going

go on internet, see if any other groups you can attend

Fattybumbum, I really feel for you. Playgroups are hell and you are certain to be super sensitive and knackered at the moment. And dark weather too. Please don't give up.

It's not really just about this woman and the door is it? but about you feeling lonely and isolated. I have been there and it sucks. How have you tried to make more mum friends? Can we help with this? eg. local meet-ups, NCT meet-ups (you don't have to be a member or on your first child), any other playgroups you haven't explored yet?

You should have stopped him before someone else did tbh but I dont want to say YABU because your post just sounds as if you are at the end of your tether so might be making something out of what the others there thought of as just a run of the mill telling off.

If you genuinely dont feel comfortable in the group, is there another one you could attend? Some soft-plays do M&T groups which might be good if your DS is boisterous - let him burn off some energy.

Someone else mentioned Sure-start, their groups are really good.

It is knackering having 3, but I promise it DOES get easier as they get older.

I have run playgroups, brought the toys etc & your attitude....

"I think that it is ok for a kid to open and shut a door repetitively. It's a toy for feck's sake!"

...is terrible!

Maybe if it is YOUR child's toy they are intent on breaking, that YOU paid for...then yes, you can think it is OK as much as you like, but when it is a shared toy that was paid for by someone else for the benefit of others, it is not ok!

Yes, I would definitely tell either of my dds off for that behaviour, banging anything that isn't really designed/built to be intended to bang shouldn't be treated with such disrespect, unless you own it yourself, which clearly you do not.

You mentioned this woman was about 60. Obviously not a parentof toddler, maybe grandparent. Keep in mind her parenting style is different to todays parenting style and she has probably completely forgotten the episode. Probably raised her children in the days when mum had all the authority and was obeyed without question. Maybe when you go back next week go directly to her and have a chat. She may turn out to be a really lovely lady and if not at least you know you have tried.

I think you should continue going to the playgroup, dont worry about this little incident.
I think you should have stopped DS from banging the door, put I think the way that lady told him off was unnecessary.

But honestly, just forget about it and keep going.

sandcastles, surely a door on a toy should withstand being opened and closed, however many times?? DH tells DS off for dropping his toys, telling him he'll break them, they're toys, if they can't withstand a fall of about a foot then they're not fit for purpose IMO.
OP, I can see the repetitive noise would have been annoying for them, but I'm completely on your side about toys - kids should be able to play with them in the manner they want!

have you been going there long? Sometimes it just takes a while to break into regular groups.

within reason of course, but most toys are built to withstand plenty, and if a toy kitchen door was capable of trapping fingers I'd be worried!

I agree with coralanne, it may be worth just trying to talk to this woman next week. You need an ice breaker, with a dash of flattery like, "This is a great playgroup! but do you know if there are other groups on the days this isn't on? DS has so much energy to burn up..."
I don't think you had to get up and stop your DS from banging the door, but I do think it was in this woman's right right to tell him off for potentially breaking a toy (sandcastles makes a good point), even though the way she did it sounds a bit harsh. Maybe she didn't make eye contact because it's a little embarrassing to tell off someone else's child, but to nip it in the bud was better than going and interrupting you & baby and making a huge deal of it.

The other people don't talk to you, but do you try to talk to them? I have been in what must appear like cliques ; sometimes someone new comes along who perhaps feels like you, but to mask it they often appear so wrapped up in their kids and the message they give out is "I am here for my children to play, not for the small talk", and in the process they scare us off trying to engage them.

What do you do on the other days? Do you see any local mums who you might be able to "recruit"? Even if there's someone you see around quite a lot with her pram, she may be lonely too, and it might be worth trying to spark up a conversation with her, perhaps asking if she knows of any groups. (even if you've done your research already and know there's nothing!!)

Had you thought about going along a bit early one morning, and simply saying to the person in charge that you have felt somewhat excluded, and maybe ask her to introduce you to one or two of the other mothers...
Sometimes people can seem a bit cliquey when they are just being shy themselves....

Hey OP. I'm so sorry you're struggling and lonely. I can totally understand why and I think I'd feel the same as you, although I accept that the woman might not have intended her actions as you felt them.

I didn't do any antenatal classes of anything like that and none of my friends have babies the same age so I felt a little like you. I went on netmums - they have a find a mum section - and met my now best friend - we live 5 mins from each other and have boys born a day apart. I'm so thankful I posted on there and met her!

Also what about contacting the nct? They will do gatherings of Mums in your area - either in coffee shops or people's homes and they're usually up for new members.

Or tell us where you are -I'm sure there will be other MNetters near you!

I think you should try and go back to the group, at least short term - whilst at the same time maybe explore other avenues for friendship too.

Good luck

I think people should be able to tell off one another's children; it eases the pressure on individuals, and children realise they are in a society and have to take account of others.

Having said that, this woman's outburst was a little OTT, and not as effective as it could have been if she had gone up to him and told him in a quiet (though potentially deadly) voice not to do that, perhaps gently shut the door and held it ("modelling nice behaviour" sort of thing), rather than sitting with her mates, as you put it (how did she dare? when my 19m son is out and about, I follow, trying not to interfere, but watching..... (does that make me a helicopter mummy, or do you have to swoop in gratuitously to be one of those?)

If they haven't asked you to stop coming, DON'T stop going; you will be spiting yourself, as many other posters have pointed out

The lady sounds aggressive and though she was possibly just trying to stop any accidents etc, she should have gone about it differently. She should also have been more sensitive to the fact that you have a tiny baby and are probably tired and very hormonal - so on that basis YANBU.

i have to say, i too would have found the banging of the door incredibly irritating, and had it been my ds i would have stopped him, but then i'm not that patient, and had it been someone elses child. I probably wouldn't have said anything unless i knew the child well. You said he was banging the door. Implying force was used. I agree that this might damage the toy in the long run, spoiling the use for others. That said, do go back to the group. They probably wont remember next week.
You said baby screams all afternoon. Have you tried colief? Worked wonders for ds when he was a baby.
See about getting a free nursery or preschool place for your ds, you are entitled to 5 sessions a week.