Uniforms in Primary Schools

[GrumpyYoungFogey]

I know this has almost certainly been done before but the search feature on MN is not that great, or else (more likely) I am too dim to use it.

Being a child of the 1980s, I naturally grew up with no school uniform in the infants, and a rather loosely defined one in the juniors, which was only compulsory on the usual special days (photos, trips, that sort of thing).

So when did the practice of putting 4 year olds in grey pants and skirts and identical badged jumpers and shirts come in? How many infant schools are left that don't insist on this regimentation?

For me, the worst thing about it is how scruffy uniforms are, being nearly always based on polo shirts and sweatshirts, the effect of which is to make the kids look like they are working in a DIY superstore of for a firm of plumbers. Then there are those schools that go that bit extra and add trackie pants (for boys and girls) to the ensemble. Yuk!

I do my bit to undermine the concept by refusing to buy the official badged things and instead send the kids off in knitted jumpers and cardies in approximately the right colour. The net consequence being they stand out from their classmates by actually being smart!

But really, is there any campaign out there against uniforms, particularly for under sevens?

I didn't know that but it seems to make sense with blazers and extra pe kit. Uniform is much cheaper now than when I was a child... my parents just couldn't afford it. All my clothes were hand-me-downs from my uncle (7 months older). Good job there wasn't an obsession with pink in the 70's!

Both my dd's are at state schools which have school uniforms as did the schools that I went to.

Their uniforms are black pinafore/skirt/trousers, white shirt, school tie and a grey jumper/cardigan. They are also bringing out new blazers and raincoats and a scarf in the school colours. There is the option of getting the school jumper/cardigan from the school with the schoool logo on it but I've never bought those as they tend to fall apart in the wash after a while, at least that's what happened to the cardi's my friend bought for her dd, so I was glad I didn't bother. The uniform can be bought from anywhere, M&S, Asda,Tesco, school outfitters etc

I don't have a problem with it as I think they all look very smart in their uniforms.

I have to admit I do prefer them in shirts and ties, I tend to agree that polo necks and sweatshirts can look a bit scruffy. No schools in my area have tracksuit bottoms as part of the uniform.

Having young children, or any children, in any kind of tie is just bananas IMO. Imagine if ties didn't exist and someone came up with them as an idea for childrenswear. They'd be laughed out of the room. They're hazardous, pointless, get lost easily - just stupid.

shockers our council here in the SE dont help at all with uniform costs anymore. was in the literature on what I could claim as a single parent when ex-H left.

I don't care if they look smart or not. I care about a. getting them dressed more quickly in the morning to save rows and b. them not worrying about what they look like and whether they fit in or not, so they can concentrate on learning.

my kids have always worn uniform, which has been grey trousers white shirt, tie, grey jumper. girls can wear grey skirt of pinafore too. the result is that my boys both learnt to tie a tie at a young age, unlike me, who didnt learn how to do it until i had to tie ds1's tie, aged seven. the blazer in secondary school etc, means that my kids are perfectly comfortable in formalclothes. and as a result, actully look good in what they are wearing, unlike kids who wear polo necks and jumpers to school, who, when dressed properly look indredibly uncomfortable.

Why put any child in a tie - but particularly, why put girl children in ties? Bizarre!

DD's school changed the uniform for September. They now wear white shirts, school tie (elasticated), navy trousers/pinafore/skirt, navy jumper/cardigan.

I tend to look at the children coming out of schools as I feel that if they are coming out smart at the end of the day, then the staff are hot on making sure they look the part/represent the school kind of thing.

We recently took the children on a trip to the local cinema which also included Y1 children from other local schools. All the other schools favoured the polo shirt look and our children were commented on for looking so smart from random people in the cinema/on the street.

DD's state junior school has a summer and winter uniform. Tomorrow is the start of the winter one. This involves a proper shirt and tie and seems very uncomfortable - at least she moans about it a lot!

Summer is either polo shirts or summer dresses. Much better imo.

The infants only allow jogging bottoms for Year R as some of them have trouble changing for PE. Very few of them wear them though.

Personally I couldn't bear the arguments about what to wear everyday if we didn't have a uniform! So I like it

I am SO envious of those who have a uniform. My dd is 8.5 and very aware of what she wants to wear rather than what I choose for her to wear. The class she is in is a relatively wealthy one and she often feels a bit sad that her clothes come from H+M and her friends come for Gucci or Ralph Lauren. I am a bit that one girls parents have made a choice to buy her logo'd stuff.
She used to wear a uniform when we lived in Thailand, it was smart and practical. Only a couple of days ago she told me she wished she still had it - although cotton shorts wouldn't be practical for our sub zero temperatures at the moment. Even shoes become an object of envy and desire. She has a pair of fake Ugg's, her friend has real ones. I found her sellotaping a label on the back of hers sos he could be like A.

of course it is about minimising individuality. that is why it is called UNIFORM.

I am so pleased my DD has to wear uniform. There are no arguments about what she is going to wear in the mornings. The school encourage recycling, by having a 2nd hand uniform sale every year.

I am happy that my DS has to wear uniform.

• Its relatively cheap
• No arguements about what to wear in the mornings
• Most importantly, no-one has better clothes than anyone else, which was a big thing at school when I was there.

I can see both sides really

I grew up in a coutry where children do not wear school uniforms and it was never a problem.

DCs have a uniform to go to school (the polo shirt version, not the tie one) and I find it fantastic in the morning not to have to spend hours finding smething that they want to wear and undeed that is more affordable IMHO than regular clothes.

I do have to differ with you though, Marioandluigi, there are quite a bit of differences in uniforms, especially for the girls ones. Every shop has their own "design" with differents buttons for exemple or differents sleeves for dresses. There are also little jewelry type of thing dangling from the trousers waist (heart shape, star shape, pretty beads) and they do complare them in school. According to Dcs, there are some that are definitely "better" than others.

I can see the argument about not having to decide what to wear.

But (old fart rant alert) - what is wrong with people that they are actually cowed by other parents dressing their kids in Gucci? So what? To me this would be an opportunity to teach my DC about conspicuous consumption and how people who feel they have to dress in designer gear all the time are sadly being played for every penny. Not feel awful for them that they can't wear Gucci ffs!

And also I think we underestimate children if we think they can't eventually work this out themselves too. They know what showing off means, they know what being stuck up means, and I would have thought it would actually be useful to get wise to these things at school instead of later. Kids do develop their own groups, some like gothy stuff, some will be indie kids who raid second-hand shops - they will not all be deeply depressed because Gavin has a Gucci shirt.

(Well not if they were brought up with a bit of sense, and parents and teachers bothered to reinforce that it's being yourself and what's inside that matters.)

I really think this terror of individuality says very bad things about our society.

And as for looking smart and representing the school - I always wondered wtf that was about when I was at chool, and I still do now. I thought school was meant to be for learning stuff, not some egotistical cult that has to be represented by the smartness of people who attend it. And if smartness comes at the cost of comfort that is particularly bad, as that makes students suffer and detracts from their concentration.

There is nothing in this word wrong with being scruffy and some of the greatest people ever are/were scruffbags. Look at Einstein.

madame >>>>(Well not if they were brought up with a bit of sense, and parents and teachers bothered to reinforce that it's being yourself and what's inside that matters.)

I agree with you, but if it's what inside that matters, then it doesn't detract from individuality to wear the same clothes on the outside, does it ?

My DCs uniform is not smart.

I have a secret belief that the main proponents of school uniform are those parents who can't quite keep up with the Joneses when it comes to civvies for their dc BUT they get off on apeing the private school thing of school uniforms.

They're kidding themselves. Most state school uniforms look very messy.

Uniform makes my life easier re. what to put on in the morning, and DS likes being told how smart he looks in it. I think they look like individuals within a team and it helps DS feel part of the school.

Um you do have a point there Jamie! But I suppose what I mean is that the whole message of uniform is "it's great if you're all the same, keep your head down".

It's what's inside that matters, but also being proud of who you are and being yourself matters. Non-uniform would IMO be better at helping kids get to grips with all that.

Another thing I've remembered is that the really, really popular and cool kids at school were those who did just not give a shit and did look different (despite uniform) - and I mean different. One was a boy with long hair. he never had the "right" trainers. He made having the "right" trainers that other kids obsessed over and pestered their parents about look lame. With him, it just didn't matter and everyone respected him anyway. Another was a girl who wore red kickers boots. She never got bullied for her style statement - she was just so cool it would have looked ridiculous to even mention it.

The point is these pathetic social rules that develop about the "right" trainers and "best" place to get uniform or whatever only happen to people who grow up thinking that fitting in matters so much. If children are taught from the off that being themselves is best, and really believe it, that rubs off on their peers. Really stylish and cool people are, and always will be, people who believe in themselves and laugh in the face of fashion. If only teaching our children that attitude was a priority.

(I do realise it's not going to happen and I should add that I intend to tell my DS he looks smart in his school uniform and not deplore it in front of him!)

I know of 3 nursery/infant schools that wear tracksuits and all are private. think tehy look much better than the poor wee kids trotting off to school in caps and blazers or straw hats and gaberdine coats. I feel really sorry for the poor kids near where I work that have to run round in long heavy and very impractical coats that impede their movements and thats at the age of 3 and 4.

A friend of mine has been a teacher for years, according to him, having uniforms (particularly in secondary schools) mean that the children have something petty to rebel against - if they have the teacher constantly telling them to do their tie up properly, or tuck their shirts in, they are less likely to be misbehaving in a bigger way.
In the last few years, children excercise their rights more than ever before, so schools can't have as tight a rein on how the pupils look (eg. hairstyles/ neatness/ makeup etc) and behaviour in schools has got worse. My friend says he would welcome the return of strict rules on appearance and uniform, as he's sure the children would then concentrate on breaking those rules rather than more important things.
Primary schools have brought in uniforms mainly because younger children are now aware of differences in brands etc (I think someone else said this) and having a logo'd uniform means they are all the same, and therefore no bullying.

I hate primary school uniform

It does make mornings easier but that's tha only plus ponit.

I had a (strict) uniform at my (state) primary, many moons ago.

Ds' school has a farily flexible uniform/dress code: logoe-ed polo shirts/red sweatshirts/cardigans, red fleeces/windcheater (with dark/grey trousers/skirts)- but you can also choose to buy the cheap alternative at Tesco/Asda (as well as red checked dresses for the girls in summer) - or knitted if you so desire.

The kids so look like they all go to the same school. Ds looks smarter than he would if he chose his own clothing - plus we don't have the hassle of him taking the time to do so.

Apparently the school used to have a "no uniform" plicy, but changed to its current dress code at the request of the parents - before ds went there.

Knowing the demographic of the school (60% ethinc minorities, a large number of "poorer" parents, with only a very small number of supposedly "middle class" parents), that decision was not based on "private school wannabes". I suspect it was simply that parents wanted to encourage the sesne of community - and it does make it easier for the teachers when they are on school outings.

Interestingly, on the summer "fun" trips, where they are allowed dress in "mufty", they are still encouraged to wear a top in the "school" colour (red) - to make spotting the kids easier!

Persoanlly, I think it works well.

My dcs (5 and 6) like wearing a uniform to school. Dd likes it because she likes to be like her friends and ds likes it because he couldn't care a less what he wears as long as it is comfortable and he finds the school trousers a lot comfier than jeans.