T o let my son chase pigeons

[mrsruffallo]

DS loves chasing flocks of pigeons. Every time we go to the park he and his friends scream with delight as they fly away.
Woman in the park today got very angry and told me that 'pigeons have feelings too' and that IT WAS CRUEL.
Funnily enough there was something along similar lines on CBeebies the other day.
AIBU to think it's just a bit of fun?

I don't agree that it's because ducks are cuter. I think it's because ducks, if chased, seem more bothered than pigeons do, and don't get out of the way and re-settle as quickly or sedately.

Also not really convinced that running towards a group of pigeons is using living creatures as a plaything. It's playing, sure, and it's interacting with living creatures nearby. But I don't think that it's "using" them. It's being in the same environment and realizing that they respond to your movement. I don't see that as inherently disrespectful, assuming (as I am doing) that the pigeons aren't troubled.

Perhaps the difference in my mind is that I am imagining a tiny boy like DS trundling along towards birds and them fluttering off. If it was a case of bigger kids doing a lot of persecution-style chasing over and over, it probably would strike me differently.

I don't mind if any toddler chases birds (ducks , pigeons or otherwise). DS used to do this a lot as a small toddler. He no longer does it as he is that much older (nearly 5). I never stopped him because it didn't occur to me, though I didn't like him getting too close to pigeons as they carry diseases.

DS is kind to animals generally and learnt (and is still learning) to be so with gradual guidance from dh and I (in particular the example of dh who is fanatical about not hurting any living things if possible)

Even dh (who looked up humane ways to get rid of an infestation of ants without killing them) didn't object to ds chasing pigeons.

In fact chasing ducks seems much more sensible to me as I vastly prefer roast duck to pigeon (only had pigeon once though)

My dd's chase them shouting ' dirty pigeons' horrible diseased, junk food crazed, rat-like creatures.

I hate them. Squirrels too.

Down here in Devon, we only let our children chase game if armed with a knife. We's feral down 'ere. If they aren't going to catch, kill it, pluck it and eat it, it's not worth the chasing. Specially duck, that never go tough no matter how old they are...

Tethersend - there is an element of predatory behaviour in any sheepdog or herding dog, but the breeds have been so highly modified over the years to eliminate the ultimately destructive predatory behaviour - the biting and the kill. Sheep(when they are used to a dog) aren't afraid of a well trained sheepdog - they react instinctively to the controlled movement that the dog makes under instruction from a handler - in pretty much the same way that a human being would move to avoid an onstacle. Put a poorly trained sheepdog in a field of sheep and sure - the dog will cause chaos and the sheep will go beserk. But sheep themselves are dumb animals - they see a gap (ie a gate) and inevitably they will go through it with the minimum of persuasion from Lassie. I am actually endlessly fascinated at how the sheep themselves will respond to the handlers instructions even if the dog isn't there! Aplogies for sounding a bit stroppy - we take great pride in our approach to animal welfare, from the peskiest pigeon to the biggest bovine

I have to say, before I had kids I hated the ones who chased pigeons. Partly because of their lack of respect for animals but mostly because they were noisy and in my face when doing it and made the birds flap about all over the place.

I still dislike it even though I have 2 noisy boys who would love to chase birds. It depends where you are. What I don't like is when groups of mums are so busy chatting they don't keep an eye on their kids behaviour and whether they might be bothering people by running around e.g. a cafe area chasing them. I think if you are in the middle of nowhere it is fine. I know how noisy and mad my boys can be and I try to be considerate of others around cafes etc. to make sure they don't chase birds and bother others.

Are you deafened by the sound of disapproving tutting when your children do this to the pigeons smallorange?

I chase pigeons, my children chase pigeons too. Neither they nor I are dysfunctional, or cruel to animals. They are gentle, loving children who treat living creatures with respect. I was told I was cruel for killing their nits a while back.

Chasing pigeons is one of the pleasures of Childhood and I'm not going to deny them that.

When they try and chase geese, and the geese chase them back they will soon learn that there are creatures you can get away with chasing, and animals you can't.

Some people take these things waayyyy too seriously.

I couldn't give a toss. And the ones in the Botanics deserve it.

Jamie ans his magic torch- I find that story about your son with the plants quite disturbing.
How far are you going to take him with this?
Will he refuse to eat veggies or salad because it is cruel?

LOL small orange
And I do agree with the poster who said she wondered what they would do with one if they actually caught it?

Dirty, dirty pigeons

I've enjoyed chasing pigeons for most of my life. Back when I were a wee lass it was the highlight of the year, going up to the big city of Exeter to do Xmas shopping and chase pigeons.

Pigeons carry more diseases that are life-threatening to humans than rats do so I will actively encourage DS to scare them as soon as he is able to walk. And seagulls (or shite-hawks as I like to call them).

Would never do it to 'good' birds though as, esp during the winter, they'll burn up lots of calories that they really need. And I'll never let DS hurt a pigeon, or even a sea gull (although I did laugh a lot at DH throwing a bottle at a St Ives sea gull that stole his pasty one time )

I let DS chase pigeons but constantly remind him that it's not ok to chase other birds. The resason being that the pigeons round our way really do behave in a way that suggests they are enjoying the game as much as the child is - they fly off, they come back, they regroup, they shuffle about cooing and giving fake-belligerent stares at the DC till the DC gives chase again. Think for a minute about how kids love to chase each other. WHo's to say that pigeons don't actually find being chased by toddlers the pigeon equivalent of an aerobics class?

I'm only on page 2 but would like to respond already

at this thread - never thought I'd be so firmly on the 'no nonsense' side of the fence on a mumsnet thread. Must be because of the moral compass i lack, being an atheist and all . Seriously though, most people I know think I'm a bit of a soft hippie, I'm not veggie but only eat 'happily farmed' animals and fish, have utmost 'respect' for nature but don't agree that means treating it with kid gloves.

Whether urban pigeons are part of 'nature' or not is debatable - wild animals but veering on the domesticated. But yes deffo let our DD chase them because its a great way for her to feel some interaction with them and see that her actions have an effect. She is not a sadist and is very respectful of mammals and invertebrates alike - I think she sees it as playing a game with them, and frankly they don't seem that arsed, they're just getting out of her way.

that said at least this gives me something to ponder and reconsider, and something non-domestic for DP and I to discuss over our saturday night takeaway

Can anyone tell me anything positive about pigeons. They are sky rats. Yet you guys seem to think one should doff one's hat at them. You wait till we start getting bird flu, you'll all be out there gunning for those grey terrors

Its really not much worse than when dogs and cats chase pigeons, they are used to it and that is classed as natural, although i would discourage my ds as i dont like it when they fly over my head and i want him to learn that no matter what animal it is its wrong to scare it.

Besides which it's not like the pigeons are defenceless, have you guys never been shat on from a great height from the disease ridden monstrosities?

I just can't be bothered even reading most of these "pigeon-chasing is cruel" posts. What a load of rubbish - if the pigeon is pissed off at being chased about, it can just fly off and find a quieter corner. What is WRONG with you all??????

Shooting at them, trying to hit them or inflict damage in some other way = quite clearly wrong. But a toddler just running into a crowd of pigeons......get a grip, some of you.

Hang on, this is SURELY a joke thread?