to be so peeved that we spend approx £1400 a month on childcare

[couture1]

I know I have to pay for the service but it leaves me with little left over each month and we need to salaries to get by. I dont want to give up work as 1 cant afford to and 2 Im hoping that when 3dc are at school in 3 years time we will be better off each month - but how do we manage until then?

Rant rant rant

Princesstoadstool - Look at it a different way.

Half the people think you are a great mother, unselfish and non-materialistic and the other half think you have ambition and self-worth.
Much better way of looking at it. You win all round.

why 'hairy handed'?
Am having all sorts of unpleasant mental images now.

the oddballs,proclaiming their vision.they wouldnt be doing any grooming or frippparies.that would be materialistic and denying wee maximus precious moments.

leave all that dolling yourself up to the leave in in the fridge mums

dal21 THANK YOU
I am new to this site and am amazed at the bitch fighting and negativity. and it most often seems to be coming from the SAHMs. FFS its 2009 and there is a massive recession, of course in many households both people have to work.

couture1- I feel your pain. But all you can do is apply for tax credit (asume you have?? If not DO SO NOW) and hang on in there as once all at school things are easier.

really evmw? I find its people who claim sah must be super rich to be able to a'fford' to SAH. Thats annoying given I don't work because I could never earn enough to afford childcare (if it could even be found) and we live on dh's part time wage.
I think childcare is an expensive barrrier to many women working.

This thread is making me think I can't afford to have a child there is no way I would be able to afford even three days in a nursery at the prices quoted here.

fuck sake both sides battle it out like daft harpies

the sterotypes abound
working mum - loaded and avaricious.doesnt care chimera nurses watch her children

sahm- live in leafy suburb fanny about all day. loaded husband

fair comment TheDMshouldbeRivened, but most of the SAHM I know do so becuase their DH works full time and earn well), and they cant justify leaving the kids 4 days to earn a pittance... Also unless you are on benefits there is child tax credit, so unless you are on the minimum wage there is always an incentive to work. Lots of people work for fxxk all but do so cos once the kids are back at school they have their foot in the door

anyway, am emboiled in the bitch fest despite my best efforts not to!!!

How many hours a day do you need care for?

A nanny may be cheaper. My friend gets paid £6 an hour net, however she does get paid for 7 weeks holiday.

have to say find expression bitch fight/fest loathsome

and well AIBU always evokes a strong response,so there will be many more humphy faces and well i every never, on this topic

I have'nt read the whole thread because I knew exactly what it would turn into so if my point is way off then excuse me.

If you are paying out £1400 on childcare which is leaving you skint, could you if possible give up work until children are at school?

Surely the bulk of your wage is going to childcare thus meaning you are working for practically nothing.

On the other hand, I got a job working around DP's so that when I was at work he could look after DS would this be an option for you?

I realise that some women go out to work for the sake of tehir sanity (me includec ) but if the money problems are causing you stress then is it really worth it?

mamadiva - i agree with this thread totally.

you say you only have a bit left over each month so is that "bit" worth it?

Until they are older you could do without a few things to make life less expensive. Not sure if you have two cars but just have one etc.

We just have one car and I walk everywhere or ride with my kids.

Or get a part time job and the money left over will probably not be much different.

Or work in the evenings.

Or get a childminder and work part time.

I can not understand why people spend this much money on childcare - of course if you are loaded and its not a problem then it does not matter but then why do these people have children and put them in full time care when they are loaded and could easily afford to work part time or not at all??? They could just wait a few years at least?

I know one woman who tried 8 years for and fell pregnant after three failed private IVF attempts. Her baby is only a couple of months old and she wants to go back to work full time????? All this time she waited for her baby, makes you think it was just another accomplishment for her and that her career is more important.

Of course I know people who have debts and mortages and need to work full time but again there is not much left over when they get paid. Does not seem to weigh up really.

I guess in your situation a childminder would save you alot of money and maybe you could cut your days down too.

It must be very stressful for you making you feel like you work for nothing.

Good luck x

When I got pregnant DH and I talked about who was going to stay at home with the baby. I had been working as a nanny and I wasn't about to pay someone else to look after my child while I looked after someone elses. Dh earned more than me and my wage wasn't enough to keep us, so I stay at home. We have managed on his wage since I was 9 weeks pregnant with DS1 so we have never had 2 wages since being pregnant then having the child so in a way it has been easier as we didn't have to get used to the change.

Compared to some I expect he earns a good wage but it is all relative. We go without lots of things that other people have but for us being at home is more important. I never had a mum full stop never mind one that worked so this is what we feel is the best for our family.

Hello, I hope you haven´t gotten scared by the replies!

I think you may have to bite the bullet, and pay up and reap the rewards later when they ae at school, nd you WILL have money left then.

Also, you may want to reevaluate your child care arangements. It might be better to get a combination of a local "Playgroup" (you get 15 hrs per week free childcare there, per child, after age 2.5)and an au-pair (if you have a room for her) or a Playgroup-child minder combination. (Most CMs would be happy to drop off and pick up at Playgroup)

Good luck, ...it must be so frustrating!

Can someone explain, why countries such as France, Holland or Scandinavian countries, are able to provide excellent and affordable childcare, while Britain can't?! We have to lobby the government to subsidize childcare more. If it means spending less on benefits for chronically lazy and permanently unemployed, then all the better. Subsiding childcare is how my taxes should be spent.
Only in this country you have a situation when various perks, such as employing a chaffeur, can be tax-deductable, but you can't deduct your childminder's fees, and you are expected to spend your entire after tax salary on childcare. It is insane and Mumsnet should lobby Sarah Brown and the female MP's to change this sorry situation.

Childcare in France may be affordable but it is sadly not excellent.

good point BonsoirAnna - you are paying for a service and surely if you expect an excellent service (and who wouldn't when it comes to looking after your children?!) you should expect to pay a high price.

This thread has got into a debate about whether parents should work or SAH but the OP asked if she was unreasonable to be peeved at spending £1400/month on childcare! It's a choice and if you choose to pay that, then why should you be peeved?!!? There are other options. If no other options are suitable then suck it up and pay it without moaning. (just my opinion!)

My friends living in France say otherwise.
I lived in Denmark and saw it first-hand, and the childcare there IS very good, that's why they have the highest number of women in work, women's pay is almost the same as men's, I could go on.
I was then shocked to see the system in this country and the costs.

Annamaria0 - i agree too.

The less money given to lay-about the better!

There is a 19 year old girl in a 2 bed flat next to me on benefits. She does nothing all day. She even told me she gets everything and even extra money for heating in teh winter.

She got the flat because she had a baby when 16 with a 40yr old idiot (he was too, had six kids with other women.) They moved in, paid first months rent then applied for housing. He didnt work either and still doesnt. He said its his heart but he smokes all day. Both of them around a newborn. The new born was taken off them after a few months as she banged its head by accident and when observed with the baby they didnt think they were fit parents.

Anyway he moved out and has another lovley flat around the corner being paid for whilst he smokes his ass off all day. He has no curtains on his window and you can see his plasma screen tv on teh wall and stereo etc. We have a really old tv and we struggle to pay rent and here are these two lazy asses who waste our money every day.

Makes me sick, the girl should be made to study at college or get a job and she should not be in a 2 bed flat but put in a room in a house share - its just all wrong and makes me sick!

Of course there are people who find themselves in difficult situations and need the help. We were both made redundant and needed benefits before but as soon as we were out of work we looked for more work and got off benefits.

The money should be spent on mothers to stay at home for at least a year and then go towards childcare.

My friend who is a single parent, had her childcare taken away during the first term if her degree - app they changed their mind so she had to drop out! She was doing this degree so she could earn better money to support her and her child. Ridiculous, this country is not interested in helping people who want to help themselves.

Morning all, I see the thread is still going strong!

asuwere - well, imo the OP is not being unreasonable to be peeved on spending so much on childcare, because thinking about going back to work should not be a choice between staying at home and earning nothing or working and earning... well... nothing! Or even less than nothing! But sadly that's the reality many women face. How is she choosing to pay £1400? That's just what it costs. If I could I'd choose to pay, say, £500 on childcare. But it costs a lot more than that. How is having to cough up whatever the nursery charges making a choice?

And I'm not convinced by all these people saying that childcare in the UK is excellent and we should be happy to pay so much for it. MN is full of complaints about absolutely shocking behaviour by CMs and nurseries.

OP, I do think that having three kids is a personal choice.

I am saying that out of envy. I would not have been able to have a career, earn enough money to cover childcare, and look after my children to the level I desire if I had 3 children.

I would have liked 3 children, but I saw that it was just not possible if I wanted a certain kind of life for myself, Dh and the 2 kids we do have. I think it is great that you have managed what I couldn't, but I don't have any real sympathy for you.

anniemac " I expect that most mindee's parents didn't share the full nature of their relationship with their children with you. You clearly chose to read neagtive inferences into the actions displayed by parents in front of you. I don't think that makes it fact."

Im sorry but when you have a child in your care 5 days a week you know how much quality time the parents spend with their child! Also when a child is with you for years you to get to know the whole family very well. Some working parents have children and then seem to expect the child to fit in.

And proberbly the reason why childcare providers are against (wrong word i know but cant think of the right word to use) working parents as someone mentioned in an earlier post is because we see the child when the parent leaves. We have to comfort them when they are upset eg; parents cant attened school sports day, school plays etc.

Maybe the solution is for a 4 day working week then at least working parents would beable to have more time for everything they need to fit in. But i dont think thats ever going to happen.

YAB (a bit) U.
Mine cost £2400pm, for a bog standard nursery in outer london.

I'd love £1400!!

Sorry no time to read all the posts, but I think YANBU to wish that you didn't have to pay so much in childcare costs, but you do need to realise that the people looking after your children when you are at work deserve a good wage (tbh I wouldn't want their job!).
I work part-time although I am currently on maternity leave. When I return to work next year, I will be paying £900+ a week for childcare in the mornings only. This is not a great deal less than what I will be earning. However, it is not as simple as that. I choose to work part-time because:

1. DH doesn't have a very stable job, and I want the safety net of my job should he lose his (he could then look after the kids rather than the nursery!).
2. I have a nice job that I enjoy, with a fairly decent salary (before childcare costs), and an accommodating boss who has allowed me to work part-time.
3. God knows what will have happened to the state pension by the time we retire (I still have a final salary one which is worth its weight in gold!).

Once both of my DC are in school, I will be working when they are at school, and will be able to pick them both up and drop them off. There will be a few hard years in the meantime when I am trying to juggle school, nursery, work, money etc etc which I am not looking forward to. Also, the thought of leaving DCs at the moment, when my maternity leave ends, DOES make me sad but I am sure it is for the best overall. Getting back to the point, I have never resented paying for the good care that my DD has had from the nursery she attended. She loved it there, and I was happy to pay for the quality of care. The one thing I am jealous of though (and this is another thread altogether) is all the friends I have whose parents look after their kids for them whilst they work. They have none of the stress of who will look after their kids in school holidays, when they are sick etc etc and all the benefits of keeping all the moneey they earn. Plus everyone thinks its wonderful that the kids are looked after by family members. It would be lovely to have that sort of help, but our nearest family is 1.5 hours away - sigh!