AIBU - to be really pissed off that epidurals are being restricted?

[christmasmum]

Was just reading an article in Mother and Baby magazine saying that epidurals are classed as an 'abnormal birth' and that they should be restricted in the future to avoid women having caesareans.

What is this all about? Why should women not be free to make their own decision on pain relief, while being aware of the risks involved in every form of pain relief? And is it not the case that women having diffcult births in the first place are more likely to BOTH have an epidural AND end up having a c-section anyway??

Before giving birth to my DD I bought into all the information from the NCT, books and magazines etc and was determined to go for a 'natural' birth. I ended up being induced and despite being told by every woman I have ever spoken to who has been induced, that I should have an epidural the midwife advised me that I would not need one. After 10 hours of intense contractions and finding out I was a huge 2cm dilated I decided enough was enough and had an epidural.

I was instantly relaxed and started to actually enjoy the process, 2 1/2 hours later (despite the consultant arriving to prep me for a c-section) I found out I was fully dilated and delivered my wee girl after 5 minutes of pushing to a room that was full of people laughing and singing Christmas carols.

I obviously only have my own experience to go by but I am absolutely convinced that the relaxing effect of being out pain helped me deliver my baby naturally.

What is this pressure on women to be in pain and suffering to be 'real women'. And why is that every new Dad I've spoken to with wives who did not have pain releif seem so proud of them? Is this just another example of male oppression of women? Even subliminally??

AAGGGHHHHH. Rant over.

I had my 1st baby absolutely naturally - no gas and air, no nothing - despite being induced. At the time I felt very smug for having "managed" the pain, but now, years on, I realise I was simply very very lucky on that particulr occasion and it was nothing to do with my "skills" as a labouring mother.

My 2nd birth was entirely different and despite having experienced other sorts of pain for other conditions requiring morphine I had absolutely no idea of the utter terrifying agony that washed over me like a tidal wave I could do nothing about. That time, gas and air were useless, so was pethidine ...... after 14 hours my mudwife more or less insisted (okay, she couldn't force me) that I have an epidural because not only was I totally exhausted, I was on the verge of having a full scale panic attack (plus, probably, my screams were horrifying the whole hospital). I resisted for a long time, not because I wasn't terrified and in agony, but because I felt I was somehow failing in accepting this help ...... but my god, to have an epidural was like someone casting a magic wand over me. I couldn't thank the anaesthetist enough.

I honestly don't know what would have happened had that not been available for me. Sure, I'd have survived, but I would have been mentally scarred I am sure by the barbarity of being forced to endure such relentless agony ...... just as several of you have reiterated in your stories.

When someone is in any sort of pain, who among us would stand there watching them, when all other efforts at relieving that pain had failed, and deny them the one thing which would bring them relief ? To do so really is barbaric and horrendously cruel. Enduring agony consumes so much of your physical (and mental) reserves ..... is that really a humane way of treating a woman in labour when she's going to need all the energy she can muster for the 1st few weeks of her baby's life ?

belgo - well I have had biliary colic for two days without pain releif and some doctors say that is like childbirth. I don't want to get into that arguement but I can tell you now if someone had offered an epidural I would have ripped the needle out of their hand and done it myself.

Does anyone know which person or group is actually advocating or advising this 'no epidural' policy'?

Sadly Abetadad, it's women/mothers... doula types. Midwives are more openminded I HOPE, although they are being pressured from management to keep costs down, and so in one way, the fashionable thinking (god help us) that women should just suck up the pain, suits the hospital managements down to the ground.

Well Maggie you campaign for what you believe in and i'll do the same.

why would you want to campaign for other women to endure pain?!

I just want to have a society where women's wishes are respected. I shouldn't have to campaign for that. It should be a given.

Epidurals increase the costs by causing damage to women and babies what part of that do you not get ?
The £500 is neither here nor there, it's the longer term implications for the sake of 12 hours of your life.

Good for you, ABetaDad, for standing your ground when your DW really needed you.

I deplore this sliding scale of holiness, with a drug free 'natural' birth at the top, sliding dowm to an epi, with a cs at the bottom, somewhere near left of Hades.

Someone further back said it was the NCT pushing the policy. Nuff said.

"A lot of the other women in my pre-birth group were asking really questions such as "can I bring in my oil burner?" and "nelly furtado or dido?"."

Hahahaha just read that. I may be an old cynic, but [explosive laughter icon]

I didn't have an epidural, the first time because I was in Italy and despite begging for it I wasn't given one , the second time (I was in the UK) because i had a quick and easy labour.

But I'm totally in favour of epidurals. A study here in Italy highlights that regions where it's easier for women to get an epidural have a lower rate of c sections.

ha you're so naive. The five hundred euro is the very heart of the matter.

The risks are tiny. There are risks with any operation. Every time any child is anaesthetised to have its adenoids out, there's a risk. It's a risk worth taking.

betadad paisleyleaf's link from earlier cites a document called "Making Normal Birth a Reality, drawn up by the National Childbirth Trust (NCT) with the backing of the Royal College of Midwives and the Royal College of Obstetricians and Gynaecologists. "

Kathy, for the umpteenth time, if a woman is given the information and makes an informed choice, THAT IS NOT YOUR BUSINESS.

I did a lot of reading, I made an informed choice to have an epidural, and both DS and I are fine thank you.

Campaign for better information and training by all means, but not to close off women's choices in line with your own personal beliefs.

FFS.

i'm a doula and i don;t think women should just suck up the pain

i think that in an ideal world, women should be able to have the birth of their informed choice , be it a home water birth or an elective section

or a hospital birth with epidural

but finite resources mean that this is not always going to happen

i would like to see each labour room equipped with a pool and a one to one midwife that the labouring women has met and built up a good trusting relationship with

i never tell anyone birth is just discomfort/like bad period pains.. if they want to talk about epidural, c.section or bottle feeding, we will talk about it and if they choose to go that route, then fine.

there is no one size fits all with birth, but to some extent there is only an illusion of choice and being able to choose and have an epidural is part of that.

Birth doesn't always hurt horribly - I know because it didn't hurt me horribly either time I did it - and telling all women in antenatal classes that they're going to be in agonising pain would be both untruthful and unhelpful (in that their fear would simply add to whatever levels of pain they did experience).

I completely agree that we need much better resources for births all round, and that women who want epidurals should be given them, so long as they are aware that statistically it's likely to result in further interventions, and there aren't serious contraindications.

But writing off all the recent movements towards non-medicalised births is wrong-headed. Women used to be sedated, shaved, given enemas and pretty much tied down during birth. Forward-thinking midwifery practice has stopped these barbaric procedures.

Yes Frazzledgirl, I'm not going to force Kathy to have an epidrual if she doesn't want one. I don't care, that's her business. But to seek to control other women's births, Cheeez.

Unicorn: what have c sections or bottle feeding got to do with epidurals?

i don;t see why it is ok to laugh at women who want aromatherapy or particular music as part of hteir birth experience, whilst saying we can't knock epidurals

surely informed choice should reach across all facets of choices in labour.

music and oil burners aren't for everyone

neither is epidural

have seen women get thrgouh labours with nothing more than massage and breathing.

i would not snort with laughter at someone wanting to aim for that

oh coolma...with my 2. child (who was incidently the best Birth I could have had ....well would have been perfect had they not made me go to Hospital...)I took my Birhting Ball and a CD Player and some good CD's...including Enrique Iglesia (sp?)...it was well good and set the mood rather well...
my friend was with me for most of it, as dh had to travel bac from Norhtern Ireland (Firefighter Strikes at the time, and dh in the Armed Forces....)... and we had a good ole giggle and jiggle (basically I took music that we had been dancing to in Cypriot clubs...)....

ladythompson.. it was in reference to another poster saying at antenatal classes she was glared at for asking about epidural, csecion and breast feeding problems

i think part of good ante natal eduaction is to talk abotu everything openly and honestly

But telling women in ante-natal classes that it won't hurt, and that any discomfort they may experience can be alleviated by whale music, is also untruthful and unhelpful.

What is wrong with telling people that it may well be bloody painful? Anyone in their right mind should be able to see that getting an object the size of a baby out of a hole the size of a vagina is going to be interesting, at best. Why try and persuade people away from the obvious, which would prepare them for what may well be coming, into believing that it's no worse than some period pains? Doesn't make sense.

If something's likely to hurt, best tell people it's likely to hurt, IMO.

Kathy - I had 2 wildly different births. 1, no intervention (except for inducement) and no drugs. I'd even go so far as to say it wasn't painful (up until that point, I'd had far worse pain for other things). At the time, I honestly believed birth was something of a doddle and thought it was because I'd done all the relaxation classes, the nice warm bath in early labour, soothing music, back rubs, birth balls, relaxing aromatherapy, walking about, breathing exercises and similar stuff (which is certainly worth a try and shouldn't be discounted, but isn't a guarantee).

I approached my 2nd birth with exactly the same mindset ..... and NOTHING I did helped even a teensy bit with the agony. I feel a bit stupid - now - to admit I thought I was going to die. I simply couldn't get any sort of handle on the pain I was feeling and I made animal noises I had no idea were within my vocal capacity. Without a doubt it was just horrendous. Going through that my only thought was for myself, not the baby, it was all I could do to keep breathing and I remember pleading (screaming) again and again "make it stop, make it stop". I was desperate.

No-one would disagree it's a good idea to work your way up to major pain relief / anaesthesia, but to imply that women who want or accept this are lily-livered beings who haven't really tried is plainly ridiculous, condescending and nasty. You can't possibly know how bad someone else is feeling .... maybe you have a higher pain threshold than they do, but does it really matter ?

Surely all women know that it is likely to hurt a lot? Since childhood!

Unicorn, the point I was making was that these first time mothers actually believed that whale music and the right oil would relieve their pain. And they weren't disabused of that ludicrous misconception at any point.

That was me unicorn. We were not allowed to speak of such things. There was one way to do it - natural no pain relief and easy BF - and no other scenarios were touched on, even when people asked.

Pain is very subjective...

policywonk....with ds 1, I had just had a m/c beforehand, so, was rather on edge....I experienced extreme pain about half way through, and was , of course, really scared, and honest the pain was terrible...but in the end it was "just" the stretching of the ligaments of teh Uterus, or some such thing...
well, when telling some Friends about the pain they said to me : Oh, if you thought that was painful than you won't be able to cope with the pain of childbirth..." apprently they "knew" what sort of pain I had experienced and decided it can't have been that bad, because they had never experienced it so badly...
well, I gave Birth to ds1 and was able to tell them, that the pain I experienced in childbirth was nothing as bad as the pain I had experienced before...so...
but it is so nice to get hte vote of confidence...