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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

AIBU to think it is weird to need passports when kids aren't emmigrating?

89 replies

looneymum · 20/05/2009 18:52

Hi Guys. My soon to be ex is emmigrating to Aus... he is at present filling in visa application forms... is it normal for the non-migrating children to need to have a medical and provide passports in order that he can fill in his visa application. All words of wisdom gratefully received. It is bad enough that he is leaving them... and leaving us in a poor financial state... never mind me having to go through all this trauma and bloody well assist with his visa crap! xx

OP posts:

Original poster

looneymum · 22/05/2009 20:08

Hi Guys... well, here's the thing. Rang the Aus Embassy today in London and when the kids have their medicals the parent that is present needs to be in possession of the original passports... certified copies will not suffice....So, that was me told in no uncertain terms.... thanks for all your great comments. xxxx

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TeaOneSugar · 22/05/2009 20:35

In that case, I'd want to go with them for the medicals.

oldspotraver · 22/05/2009 20:43

Looney... I dont want to worry you but can you really trust him NOT to take the kids away ??

AnarchyAunt · 22/05/2009 20:48

In that case I'd tell him that you will take them for their medicals at his expense, or they won't be having any medicals at all and he won't be going to sunny Aus.

Really, please don't hand over your kids and their passports to him.

thumbwitch · 22/05/2009 22:25

yes that is true - their passports are the only accepted form of ID for the medical (makes you wonder what they do when the children don't have a passport but hey!) - so, yes - you take them for the medicals and HE pays for them.

FYI, this is the approved list of doctors that must do the medical.

This is part of the info I have just had through from the panel doc who will be doing my medical in 10 days' time:
In order to complete the medical as quickly and easily as possible please note that
applicants need to bring:-

? Passports
? Form 26, passport photo attached and completed as indicated
? Name and telephone number of your G.P. (written on Form 26, page 6)
? Reports relating to any operations or significant illness (to include, diagnosis, treatment, prognosis, and follow-up requirements, if any. (See below)
? Details of any current medication
? Child health documents (Red book for children under 5)
? Payment by cash or cheque only, no cards
? Cost - Adult over 15 £155, Adult over 65 £190, Child £65, Temporary Visa £120
? Postage to Australia £15 ? Courier to Australia £65 Postage to London no charge

Form 26 can be downloaded from the Australian Immigration website here.

I am so for you that you are having to go through this - it's bad enough having to go through it when you actually want to go to Australia (I mean my family) but to have to put up with all this bollocks as well for no good reason is a bit much!

Original poster

looneymum · 23/05/2009 11:13

Hi TW. A massive thx for this info. I have decided to let him take them for the medicals. I gather he is taking his parents with him for the week tosser DH and lovely DDs are in CentreParcs. The girls get on very well with his parents...although after a massive fall out, I don't have anything to do with them anymore. This is gonna be interesting when he goes to Aus as I am unsure how his parents and his brother and his kids intend to maintain a relationship with the DDs without my buy in... still, like most of the rest of the horror inflicted, he has not thought through the implication of sodding off and leaving his children. I know he won't take the girls out of the country as he doesn't want them.. barely wants to pay for them and doesn't care about their schooling. Should he do anything illegal, I will have the police on him so fast he will never get to fulfil his dream of running off to the otherside of the world! xxxx

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FabulousBakerGirl · 23/05/2009 13:02

But if he gets the kids to the other side of the world it won't be as easy as just phoning the police.

luvoneson · 23/05/2009 13:11

I agree with BIWI, Really dont want to worry you, but if the kids are staying with you all this is not necessary. Please be careful men can be crafty B>>>>>ds.

luvoneson · 23/05/2009 13:13

Looneymum, I have been thinking about all of this. I dont trust the bloke.

expatinscotland · 23/05/2009 13:39

Why on Earth would you trust this bloke not to take your kids when he's proven himself a liar and a cheat to you?

NO WAY I'd let him have the kids' passports.

I'd accompany him to the Embassy when he needs to show the passports and then immediately take them back.

Actually, fuck that. He wouldn't be going to Oz at all because I wouldn't submit my kids to medicals all so he could swan off.

If he didn't like, well, tough.

luvoneson · 23/05/2009 13:50

EXPATINSCOTLAND you are so right. He sounds like a wrong-un. DONT TRUST THIS MAN.

Original poster

looneymum · 31/05/2009 21:23

Hiya all. So, here is the latest. Soon to be ex tosser of an H advised my solicitor that as his partner's "right to remove" her kids to Aus court hearing is not til mid June, then he is going to put the "settlement deal" on hold. I advised my solicitor that as there is obviously some doubt as to whether they will go to Aus if she doesn't get the right to remove then I will not be passing on the kids passports. I have always been wary of giving them over but he needs the originals in order for him to let the kids have non-migrating medicals for him to secure a visa. Anyway, he picked the kids up on Fri and I didn't hand over the passports - the medicals are booked for Tues and he has the kids all week. He has threatened to issue court proceedings to make me release the passports. I am expecting to receive this thru my solicitor either tomorrow or Tuesday. Am v scared although am happy to give over the passports once his partner's right to remove court case has been given the go ahead and I know for sure they are going to Aus..... should I be scared? xx

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clam · 31/05/2009 21:44

Not scared, just careful. The more aggressive he is about demanding the passports, the more wary you should be about letting them out of your sight. As others have advised, if he wants them, you go with them, show them to whoever needs to see them, then leave. It could be, of course, that he's just getting frustrated because he sees you as a barrier to his get-away plan.

But surely he's just making empty threats re: court proceedings? Others might have knowledge on this one, but I cannot believe that anyone can force you to hand over personal documents. But I confess I don't know for sure.

Good luck.

expatinscotland · 31/05/2009 21:46

The court is going to laugh in his face! Empty threat.

He knows damn well she probably won't get to move those kids out to Oz if her ex is already going to court over it.

Bullying tosser.

Stick to your guns.

Original poster

looneymum · 31/05/2009 21:50

Thx Clam. He is taking them to CentreParcs in Nottingham this week so has booked the medicals at a "visa approved" surgery somewhere near there. I live a long way from Nottingham and so attending with them is not an option. Anyway, I gather he is going to be seriously out of pocket for their non attendance... ooo how my heart bleeds for him! You are right, he is desperate for the passports and also for a certified copy of my passport. We do not speak and so he needs my buy in... which is difficult when he is a complete shit and I have no particularly desire to help him "escape" as he is going to leave us in a financial pickle. My solicitor is not back in the office until Thursday... hopefully he will have some suitably supportive advice... let's hope so... he has had a fortune in fees to date! x

OP posts:

Original poster

looneymum · 31/05/2009 21:54

Hi Expat... my sentiments exactly... twunt! Still, his partner is from Aus so it is classed as a "return home". At the second court hearing for the divorce the judge seemed to think her right to remove was just a formality. The thing that has really pissed me off is that he set a timetable for getting the settlement sorted by end of June and now he is moving the goal posts... probably in order to chip a bit off the meagre settlement he is offering me... I think he thought he was being tactical but I didn't see why I should jump to his tune and hand over the passports if he thinks there is any doubt they are going to Aus. Why should my lovely girls be put thru the upset of a medical just cause their tosser of a daddy is pissing off and leaving them.... I wonder if he has told them yet that he is going.... thanks for comments everyone. x

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expatinscotland · 31/05/2009 22:38

That doesn't matter that she is, looney. I'm from the US, although I have British nationality as well.

If I tried to remove our children without my husband's buy in it would not happen.

Because the UK has fairly strict child abduction treaties with nations like the US, Canada and yes, Oz and NZ.

Don't kowtow to him or let him bully you, it helps that you're going through a solicitor.

And his continued harping on you about handing over original passports when the deal's not done screams 'abduction risk!' to solicitors and judges.

Original poster

looneymum · 01/06/2009 06:59

Hi ExP. Thanks again. He is such a bully... although is playing it just within the law and wording all his messages very carefully. I also gather thru friends of friends that his partner is involved in some heavfty dodgy financial business dealings... but I cannot get any firm facts and perhaps should not muddy the "divorce proceedings" waters with pointing a finger to her acting like an "escaping criminal"... no evidence your honour! I am just worried today that I will be "forced" to provide the damn passports (the medical is tomorrow).

I am hopeful that the abduction worry will indeed hold weight with the legal system but I feel horribly let down to date and he seems to call all the shots. I am so sorry for my little lovelies and do not want them to be put thru giving a wee wee sample and then told and by the way daddy is leaving you.

OP posts:

Original poster

looneymum · 01/06/2009 07:15

Hi ExP... can I ask the outcome of what happened with you taking your children with you?... v cheeky of me to ask and in any event I hope everything went the way you wanted.

I am convinced my soon to be ex doesn't want the children and so is happy to leave them... but you are right to point out that his partner's ex may be fighting to keep his children here.... all will be revealed in time!

Have a good day. It is beautiful weather here. I am lost without my girls tho... a whole week to fill without them. Perhaps a spell in the garden with a good book (whilst I wait for the henchmen to enforce the court order!) could be on the cards! xx

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rodgershawk · 01/06/2009 07:25

LM, just scan read this thread and want to confirm about the medicals..
We had our medicals to emigrate last December and they only needed the passports to confirm ID.
They looked at the form and the passport in the entrance hall, copied them both and then handed them straight back.
If you can then you should go with them them just for the confirmation of ID then you can take the passports away with you.
The visa application form had to include all dependants whether they were travelling with you or not..

Original poster

looneymum · 01/06/2009 08:47

Hi Rodg. Thanks for your post. After everybodies fab threads on here, I am now happy that he does need the original passports. The thing is, he is relying on my goodwill. Unfortunately, due to the way he has behaved and more recently by making me remove the children from their private school.... I am not feeling very generous. I have no issue letting him have the passports now I understand the process for his visa application. The thing is he advised his solicitor there is some doubt about whether his partners children will be allowed to leave the country and on the back of this he wants to put the financial settlement on hold! He is basically messing around with the deal but still wants to carry on with the visa application. I too can play dirty. If his partner does not go to Aus then neither will he so when he knows they are going I will hand over the passports for the medicals..... I sound like a mad and raving woman.... !!! I am so cross and hurt for my children that there father feels able to leave them in the first place but he is making us all suffer financially.... sorry ... sound like true Looney! xx

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pjmama · 01/06/2009 09:21

I have no sympathy at all for anyone who thinks it's okay to leave their children and sod off round the other side of the planet - what a selfish bastard. Don't let him bully you, and if I were you I'd wait until you ARE forced to hand over the passports by the courts - if that ever happens. He sounds like a lying slimeball, don't trust him.

expatinscotland · 01/06/2009 12:58

I'd also ring your solicitor today to discuss what action you can take to try your best to ensure he gives you your settlement before he tries to leave the country.

'He is basically messing around with the deal but still wants to carry on with the visa application. I too can play dirty. If his partner does not go to Aus then neither will he so when he knows they are going I will hand over the passports for the medicals..... I sound like a mad and raving woman.... !!! I'

No, no you don't sound that way and you aren't.

You are a woman who is doing her best to ensure her childrens' futures.

His children are his responsibility, too, no matter if the marriage has broken down.

Don't let him run roughshod over you.

Fuck that!

clam · 01/06/2009 14:23

So, have I got this right? He wants to emigrate to Aus, leaving his DDs here in the UK with little or no financial support, and having been ousted from their school because he no longer wants to pay the fees. He's mucking you about in legal games, threatening all sorts and generally being a bastard.
And you could stop him simply by denying him access to the passports?
And the dilemma is.....?

Sounds simple enough to me. He can have the passports WHEN (and only when) he has signed and committed to a fair financial settlement sufficient to your DD's needs. Otherwise, take a hike.

Original poster

looneymum · 01/06/2009 16:58

Hi everyone. Thanks again for posting.

Clam - I so hope that it is just that simple. The problem seems to be that the law view the visa application and the settlement as two entirely separate entities. I gather that I am not allowed to vito his visa application in any way. I have not spoken to the solicitor as he is away until tomorrow. I imagine the line is going to be that if he gets a court order to force me to hand of the passports then I must do so irrespective of whether he is a tosser who is fannying around with the settlement. It seems that he can just adapt everything to his own selfish heartless needs.... arrgghhhh.... it is so frustrating/scary/heatbreaking... xxxxx

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