Partner wants another child, I don't - advise please.

[FamilyGuy]

First post on here as a dad (I hope I?m allowed?) so treat me softly : )

I wanted a bit of advise from a broader anonymous audience, so I hope the kind folk of this site can help me. I have been together with my partner for thirteen years and have been married for nine. We have two great kids a boy and a girl (5 & 2). We have a great house, family, friends, extended family and live in a great community. We both work, enjoy our jobs and have no real ?worries? about life.

When we meet, I was not bothered about marriage or children, my partner was. Over time it was more important for my partner to get married than it was for me not to get married and after all, all I wanted was for us to be happy, so we got married ? which changed nothing.

After a few years my partner became pregnant (not planned) and we decided that this was as good a time as ever to start a family, we had a boy. I kind of wanted to stick at one, but my partner wanted another and I could understand the various reasons why so we had little girl, which is fantastic.

Our family is lovely and I wouldn?t go back for anything in the world, sure it?s hard work, but it?s great. Not far after our second was born my wife started discussing another child? I was happy with our nuclear family and think we are incredibly lucky. We have many friends who have had MC, as we have, or cannot conceive so feel very blessed we have our two children.

Over the months my partner has kept on and on about having another child, I said I was quite adamant that I didn?t want another child and bar a hamster or two the family I thought our family was perfect. I even talked about having the snip, which she was totally against.

This has taken over our lives, neglecting the warmth and fun we should be having as a family and that we should be having in our relationship. I can 100% say I don?t want another child and considering my thoughts pre marriage, I think I have given quite a bit. Again I reiterate I wouldn?t change anything and glad I have my wonderful family, as I didn?t realise how rewarding it could be.

I am quite active in our local community helping with summer festivals, school fetes etc, I also have a good network of friends and colleagues and see them regularly. I try very hard to spend time with my wife either out or cooking a meal and sitting down together, this often doesn?t work out. I also try and encourage her to see more of her friends, locally and in other parts of the country; she has the support from me to do this and can go away for the evening or weekend and I can look after our children. I am here whenever she needs me.

I am an active dad and play that role as much as possible, I do the morning shift, breakfast, get them dressed, take them to school/nuresery etc. My wife does the late afternoon shift and we share the bathing, evening meal duties. Having said that I would say my wife is definitely the primary carer.

Am I being unreasonable, is my wife being unreasonable, how can we move forward on this? Any views would be gratefully received.

Many thanks
Proud Dad

counselling?

the desire for another child can be intensley and over whelmingly strong with no "logic" - the same as you are adamant you don't want another, your wife is adamant she does

this is one issue you cannot compromise on so you may need outside help

I wish I could help; you sound as though you're both being entirely reasonable and just want different things. Did you talk at all about any of this early on in your relationship? It sounds as though the marriage and the children just sort of happened rather than being a 'plan'; possibly your DW believes that having been happy with the other changes you hadn't anticipated, you'd be equally happy with another child. Possibly she's right, but if you're not sure, that's not worth gambling on. Apart from talking it through - which it sounds like you're doing plenty of - I don't know what to suggest. Unless you think it's causing enough unhappiness for you to benefit from bringing in outside mediation, in which case remember that Relate is about solving apparently intractable issues like this just as much as make or break situations.

Can you put in to words why you don't want another one?

Having another one wouldn't detract from anything you describe you like doing or add to the workload proportionately. Is it that or money or something else?

It's not a question of being reasonable or unreasonable - you both want what you want. Would agree that maybe counselling is the way forward, because as things stand whatever happens one person is going to be resentful...

You sound lovely - assuming you are telling the truth
I think the desire for babies is different for men and women. Men are more rational generally (about this, not about everything!!) as women do have that urge to make babies that even women with plenty of kids, who don't actually want anymore, still have.
I assumed you were a woman before I opened this and my instict was 'you have to carry the babies, you get to choose if you have one' but that only really applies in the opposite scenario to yours.
Ok, I'd say you are not being unreasonable, you have been clear with her, you have budged on certain things to make her happy, but you are drawing the line at 2 kids. Fair enough.
But...2 kids would not be enough for me (I mean by choice) and I want 3. DH would prefer 2 but we talked about it a long time ago - difference was he was always up for having children so we could have the convo before we got serious - and he has always known I want 3.
It's hard, I'd say you should try counselling if it's affecting your marriage. Did you say whether your wife works? That might have a bearing on things - if she doesn't, could she start? Or if she's doing something she doesn't love, how about looking for something more stimulating? Further study?

I'm intrigued with the flipping between referring to her as your partner and then wife and then partner - usually people just stick to one....

Hmmm. It's very hard when your baby starts growing up ... there is this urge to have another so you can have those 0-3 years all over again ... but then rationality kicks in and I realise that for me, 2 is perfect.

I suggest counselling as no idea how you resolve this one.

This bit of your post concerns me slightly though: "I am quite active in our local community helping with summer festivals, school fetes etc, I also have a good network of friends and colleagues and see them regularly. I try very hard to spend time with my wife either out or cooking a meal and sitting down together, this often doesn?t work out. I also try and encourage her to see more of her friends, locally and in other parts of the country; she has the support from me to do this and can go away for the evening or weekend and I can look after our children. I am here whenever she needs me."

Kind of sounds like you are 2 individuals sharing the responsibilities of child-rearing. I know when you break it down that is true, but it just sounds a little bit like your wife is something you fit in to your life along with PTA meetings and evenings at your friends' houses.

Maybe he still thinks of her as a partner - I feel my DH is more a partner than a husband, maybe that sounds weird but I often say my partner to people that don't know us. I don't mean he's less than a husband or anything, but partner seems to fit my feelings more. 2 years in I still feel a bit funny saying husband

Agree with wishingchair. Not sure why I feel uneasy over that part of your post.

Do you think your wife feels you don't spend enough time with her?

Maybe you feel uneasy because he's a man???
I don't see any reason to think the OP sees his wife as someone to fit in with his life, he just seems to want her to have a social life and some interests outside the home? Why should he feel guilty for having an active role in the community? (and it's not like he said 'I like to get pissed with my mates 4 times a week, and encourage my wife to do the same' is it?)
Perhaps he feels that if she had more goig on she might not be fixated on having another baby? Could be a wrong but it seems innocuous to me.

Nothing about him being a man FFS. Just that it was written in a kind of detached way.

Actually I read that paragraph as him saying because he does all it makes him a good husband and so it justifies his opinion of stikcing at 2. Whether he does or doesn't do all that stuff is irrelevant. The dilemma is still there.

I think the op needs to clarify exactly why he doesn't want any more. What does he think will happen if there is a 3rd dc, and why would a 3rd one be such a bad thing. Similarly his dp needs to clarify exactly why a 3rd would be a good thing, although as a female a lot of that is just down to overwhelming desire - nature has a lot to answer for!

Kat I felt weird saying husband for a few years myself and I agree his comments seem fine to me also

Thanks for your comments, it gives us something to chew on and gives me a broader perspective on the issue. Sometimes opinions between one another can become so polarised.

My family is a priority, that doesn?t mean we cannot enjoy aspects of life that don?t involve our children or each other, the vast majority of the time it does.

I don?t want another child as I feel my family is great the way it is and to be frank I think it?ll be very hard, financially, physically and emotionally. Why stop at three, four, five? We both work very hard, I run my own small company, my wife works four days a week and it is tough at times, as it is for everyone else.

Sure I don?t have the natural urge to have more, I?m just grateful of what I have and want to carry on enjoying it. From my perspective some people always look at what they don?t have instead of what they do, which could be applicable to anything of course.

@ wishingchair & Uriel:
I am at home most evenings and weekends with my family although I do help out in community affairs (as does my partner) I feel we benefit as a family because of our close, active and involved community. I am out maybe two evenings a week, after the children are in bed. I do not think that is extreme? hardly a top socialite : )

Just out of interest is there any etiquette for using wife/partner in the same text? I use both all the time?

Did you say your wife had a mc? When was that? Was it before or after your two children? Just wondering if that is a factor for her.

OH

Inbetween, but we supported each other as it was a tough few months.

I really see where you are coming from. My DH was really happy at two and didn't want any more (we also have a boy and a girl)but i wanted a third.. I eventually agreed as I felt it was more important for me to give up my urge than force the issue and have my DH resenting me and a poor unsuspecting baby. I was so angry at DH and I can't be certain that over time it wouldn't have caused damage to our relationship.

This was all turned on it's head when I fell pregnant by accident (genuinely!! He was there when I took the MAP which failed to work!!). HE suggested that we shouldn't have the baby but I couldn't have ever forgiven him if he had pushed that. We now have an 8 week old and it's bloody hard. I love baby to pieces but really do wish I had stuck with two!! I'm sure that DH feels the same but I'm also sure that in a years time we won't be able to contemplate life without her.

I wish you both well and agree that counselling is the only way forward. One of you is going to have to give in to the other which could lead to terrible resentment.

In the meantime, be careful...

We have 3 children. Life is quite hard in lots of ways - very tiring and expensive. The kids are great. There's really no reason why we should have another but I have a niggling desire to be pregnant again, give birth again, have a scrunchy newborn again. And it's also so lovely having that close relationship with these fabulous little people that I quite like the idea of adding one more. That said, I expect that we won't, as we want a few years on an even keel, but the feelings are there for sure and I understand your wife. These things aren't logical. You should have counselling as it will help your relationahip to air your views constructively. Have you asked her to go into the details of why and really listed properly, or do you just cut her off with a 'no' if it comes up?

The one thing i noticed was that the op said he had offered to have the snip. In all the "I want another baby and he doesn't" threads the advice has always been to tell your husband that if he doesn't want another baby then he should be responsible for the contraception.

I think that offering to have the snip is a pretty strong indication of not wanting another baby tbh, and I also think that there is a lot of truth in being thankful for the things you have rather than constantly striving for the things you don't.

Familyguy, I can't offer any advice, I'm afraid, we are having the same dilemma in this house! We also have a girl and a boy and are both busy people with work, hobbies, community things.

My husband is happy to stop at what we have in an 'If it ain't broke' kind if a way. In many, many ways I think he's right. Hubby says: 'I've just got my wife back and I don't want to lose you to another pregnancy and newborn'. It's fair to say, I'm hard work when pregnant and also fairly neurotic and over-dramatic when things are tough (e.g. when there's a newborn in the house!). I can totally see why he doesn't want any more children. Our two are lovely and have a great relationship. I'd hate to upset the balance.

And yet I sometimes yearn for another baby. I want to give birth again and breast feed again (will probably be stopping BFing my son soon and that makes me sad). My children are growing up too quickly and it makes me feel old. None of which are very good reasons for having another child so I am currently in agreement with my husband but I can't promise I won't change my mind again!

Just wondered if it might be worth helping your wife examine her reasons for wanting another child. It might be that she doesn't have reasons as such, just a strong urge, in which case there's not much debate to be had. Counselling seems a good idea for you both.

BFG - so right! Someone once said to me: the secret of happiness is wanting what you have, not having want you want.

Well TBH I think you sound incredibly reasonable, reasoned and thoughtful. Which of course helps not a jot in the face of the maternal instinct and a woman's urge to have another baby, which is why you are in this dilemma. Let's face it, most other issues in your lives/marriage (do we go abroad for our hiolidays this year? Shall we buy a new car? Shall I have a boob job? What school shall the kids attend?) would be resolvable with the kind of attitude you have adopted here - looking at it from both sides, being pragmatic and logical, reasons for and against etc. I admire your attitude to be honest.

However, it is an emotional issue that logic cannot solve. I am in the same boat as your wife. I work 4 days a week. My husband works full time. We have 2 children already nearly 3 and nearly 5. My husband was not overly keen on kids but now woouldn't be without them, but absolutely 100% does not want any more. For all the reasons you cite, life is easier, sleep is back to normal, we have our lives back. But I still hanker after another.

I change my mind, inwardly, every day. I reason that all the "inconveniences" of a 3rd would be short lived and put against the big picture of a bigger family, and the joy that can bring would be outweighed. But none the less, life would get dramatically harder again just when we have got it fairly cushti, and the prospect is scary....Have you got her to do a pro and con list?

My black and white view on this:

I think both parties should want a baby before trying for one.

I think both parties should have the decency and respect to listen to each others views PROPERLY (with the pther person feeling that they are realy being listened to) and try to understand the other persons position.

Each should allow the other to talk freely and openly about their wishes without their conversation being terminated or discarded until such a time as agreed by both of you.....

A date could be set where a final decision is made at some point a few weeks / months in the future?

"Why stop at three, four, five?"

Is what you are worried about that your wife will want another after the third? Or are you 1000% against a third?

Family guy, ime, absolutely the hardest period for a Mum coming to terms with the 'no more children possibility' is exactly when the youngest is two.

The baby isn't a quite a baby anymore, and I suppose in basic cave men type scenarios, there would have been another baby on the way by the time the youngest is two. It's a very basic human instinct I think, that propels women on to want another baby.

and that's NOT to undermine that completely legitimate feeling. I felt it. I sort of mourned that I'd only have two children. Although I can only just manage the two I have! two children doesn't feel like enough children, well, so a little voice in the back of my head sometimes mutters.

When the youngest is 3 though, I think that the worst of that baby-yearning has gone. Because you have tasted new (relative) freedoms again!

So, although I feel for your wife too, because YOU are the one looking for advice, I'd suggest to your wife that if she really still wants one when the youngest is 3, then you will agree to ONE more child.

she may find that when she's put the cots and nappies and buggies away, that it is slightly more of a HEAD decision than a HEART decision.

Maybe she'll still want one! But at least the gap will be bigger and then 3 would be easier to handle!