To think my DD would be much better off without me?

[ToAshamedToUseMyName]

I know this is probably not the right place to post in but bh I don't know where else to turn.

I have a DD, a DS & been with DH 7ish years.

I am so over the place right now & don't know what to do for the best.

I feel like the only person I'm of any use to is DS.

DD is my eldest but I feel no connection to her.

There I said it, let the stoning commence - let's face it what kind of mother says she feels nothing for her own child?

A monster, that's who. Me, I'm a monster. I shouldn't be saying that about my DD, I should be saying I love & adore her.

I had PND after DD was born & tbh I don't think I've ever bonded with her. I feel very detached from her & feel she hates me.

Don't get me wrong I don't ignore my DD or treat her differently. I do everything I should as a mum, I make the right noises when she comes home from nursery with a new painting, I feed her, clothe her, play games with her, read to her at bedtime etc etc but I do it all on autopilot because I feel I should.

DD & DH are very close, they have a lovely bond & when DH is home DD is literally glued to him & I find it a relief that she's looking to DH for things rather then me.

She's going through your typical toddler stage at the moment, tantrums, saying no to everything, throwing things at me, laughing at me when I tell her off, slapping me when she doesn't get her own way etc & tbh it's pushing me away further.

I just feel so distant from her, she's going to grow up hating me I just know it.

I have a very different relationship with DS, I felt bonded to him the second I laid eyes on him. I love to be with him, spend time with him, I do things for/with him because I want to - it couldn't be more different.

DH isn't as close to DS as he DD just yet but he generally finds older babies/children easier then smaller babies.

I just feel so lost right now, I feel like I'm a useless mum & even more useless wife.

I keep thinking that DH & DD would be far better of without me, but I'd want DS with me. I know I can't do that as it's wrong so I'm plodding along feeling more down everyday.

I love DH, but constantly worry he'll just one day up & leave - who'd want to be stuck with me especially feeling the way I feel.

Surely DD would be better off without me as a mum?

You are not a monster and you are not a bad mum. If you were you would not be so upset about this.

I just want to add my support and say that you are being so brave, to own up to the feelings you have must be very difficult but you are doing it. Well done, both to you and to your DH for supporting you. I hope that you get the help that you need and that you can begin to enjoy the company of your DD more.

Thanks to everyone again, I'm astounded (in a good way) at the support I'm reciving & can't thank you all enough.

Frumpy I did have some counselling when DD was about 6 months old but I only had 6 sessions & they were more like an informal chat. We started to dig deeper in the last session so I was left with all these issues having been brought to the surface but no way of dealing with them.

I want things to be different, I want to be a better mum, I want to feel some kind of connection to my DD but it's so easy to just step back & let DD run to DH.

I've tried simple things in the past like making cakes, but DD just seems so disinterested & goes running off to play with DH leaving me feeling even more disheartened & like I'm no use.

Sorry, I know I'm moaning alot here - I just feel able to actually talk to someone about this all for the first time without fearing the reaction.

TA, you are not moaning a bit! Talk on, its the only and best way IMHO.

So I wonder if you doctor could arrange more counselling? Or if you have the cash to spare I would highly recommend seeking out a reputable psychologist centre and digging deeper. Maybe its for you, maybe its not, session one could determine that (I didn't really make any progress with my first counsellor and it took me another 2 years to build myself up to going back, what a waste of precious time!).

Do you ever say to your DD something like..... "hi honey, I have to cook dinner soon, but I have 10minutes/half an hour free, is there anything you'd like me to help you with or play at?" and see what she says. Sometimes she might just come out with something random but, hey, if it makes her day..... Cake making is great but it takes time and when they are little......it has to take about 5/10mins before the attention span is GONE!

The other thing that helped me with my DD1 (she was 3 when my DTs came along and I felt I was spending no 'quality' time with her) was that at bedtime I would ask her if she would like to make a wish to the fairies. I told her she'd have to say it out loud so they could hear but that I would put my fingers in my ears so it could stay between her and the fairies. Of course, I could hear everything One night she said she'd love to go to the park, with mummy and daddy and the babies. Up until then I thought she was happier going to the park with me or DP and certainly without the screaming DTs!!!! Anyway, it helped me understand what was important to her and it was easy to organise the trip.

Years ago I tried yoga and the teacher said the positions that were the hardest were the ones we wanted to avoid most and the ones our bodies needed most. She needs you. And you can do this.

Hi TA

This all sounds so familiar at first i wondered if id got up and written it in my sleep. Dd is 4. Our relationship, tho getting better, was exactly as you describe, from the feelings of trying to do something with her for her attention to wonder, then run off to dh (dp in my case) to wanting to having an immediate bond with ds.
I did exactly the same as you with dd, washed her, fed her, read to her, played with but I enjoyed none of it.It felt like a chore and it was always such a relief to get her off to school. She was always doing whatever she could to test me and it was driving me mad. (although this is no basis for my feelings towards her, it just didn't help iyswim)
With my 5 month old ds I adore every minute. Even the sleepless nights didn't feel so bad with him!
I started to wonder if i simply just didn't love her and I felt like the worst, worst, worst mother in the world. No one could be a worse mother than me, how could they? no one else struggled to love their child.
It kind of culminated in me bursting into tears with dp one night and sobbing that "I don't think i love her". Just like you I have a terrible relationship with my mother and always have done and just like you we came to the conclusion that i was so scared of turning into my mother that i just preffered to not even try
In the end i had one of the hardest converstations of my life with my gp who listened with sensitivity and prescribed me counselling and an anti depressent. Unfortunatly the councselling didn't really work out but i am getting better. It isn't easy, our relationship is still not all fluff and kittens but it is easier. Someone suggested trying to talk in a soft "mary poppins" voice and smile at everything. You know, that does actualy help, you start to believe it I suppose. Time out with dd also has helped, having lunch, or a cake out just us and seeing that she is a little girl not the monter I was kind of making her out to be.
Don't give yourself a hard time, this has happened to alot of people and alot of people have got better
Best of luck sweetie, I'll be following this thread.
xx

Thank you all again for all your support,

Park rang me last night & we had a lovely chat (thank you so much for phoning hunni) it was so nice to be able to actually talk about how I was feeling.

I'm finding this thread so helpful, I feel like I can come on here & talk & be honest & not fear peoples reactions.

Frumpy I tried asking DD this morning if there's anything she'd like to do with mummy, she said drawing so I got all the colouring out & she ran off to play outside instead.

I will keep trying though.

The GP I'm due to see on Monday is supposed to be very nice & has young children himself (this is from HV) so I'm hoping I feel brave enough to tell him what's going on, I need to start being more honest otherwise I'll never be able to move forward.

I just wish I could feel the way for DD that I do for DS, the guilt it so massive which I guess doesn't help.

DD's not so nice with DS at the moment either, she has her moments but can be so mean to him (ie she hit him on the head with her toy hammer & grinned at me as she did it) & things like that, that just seem to push me away further & widen the gap so to speak.

I guess the main thing is I do want things to change, I have to keep reminding self of that & that's it me wanting to change it that makes me different my mum.

There's not much I can say that other people haven't especially frumpy who has given some great advice.

I think it's very hard to get over PND, particularly when it's with your first child, as we are led to have such an idealised perception of motherhood.

I felt the same was as you towards my DD for several months and although I was over the worst by the time she was 8 months old (thanks to counselling/antidepressants), even now she is nearly 5 it takes v. little to put me back in that place, albiet briefly.

We had our first family holiday at Butlins recently and she was having a great time dancing with the other kids and the redcoats, but when I went to join her she literally pushed me away, and I was heartbroken but I am able to rationalise it now and now how good our bond is really.

Also I found that rather than have the terrible twos - DD has been much more trying since turning three and I know a lot of friends have felt the same. Also bear in mind that she may be picking up a bit of attitude from other kids at nursery.

Hope things are picking up for you soon.

Just something I've noticed from your last couple of posts... don't expect her to be ready and willing to start playing together, if she's got used to doing her own thing. Even if you have been going through the motions, if she generally has been used to/more comfortable playing alone, it will take a while for her to choose to play with you iywsim.....

Not to say that she won't, just that it might not happen the first time you make that concerted effort, it might be unusual for her.

does that make any sense?

You're doing so well, just acknowledging it (as you say, unlike your mum), that is a very good place to start.

Keep going.

PS Frumpy - your last post was fantastic! Love the fairies idea, and the yoga analogy....

TATUMN, I have no experience of what you are trying to deal with, wrt to your dd. It sounds very hard & I am so sorry you are feeling what you do. I think you have had wonderful support here, and I sincerely hope you discover how much you do love your dd, because I really believe you do, you just don't know it yet!

The part of your posts that stuck with me is..

"I don't understand why he bothers with me & I certainly don't understand why he married me"

I used to feel this way. About everyone. Not just dh. Someone had a crush on me several years ago, made advances & I just couldn't understand why, why they even liked me, let alone in that way! Same with friends, cannot understand that they like ME for me, not for some ulterior motive.

After all, my own mother rejected me over & over, so if she couldn't love me, how could anyone else? I only ever got good responces from her when I was good, or did something for her...which meant that I wasted much of late teens to just a few years ago (am 35 now) trying to please friends/family to make sure they loved/liked me & being so badly used in the process.

I saw a councellor for a seperate issue recently & realised just how much my relationship with my mum dicates my relationship with my girls. I was determined that my children wouldn't feel how I did & the counsellor said that it sounded like I had turned it all around, in spite of the emotions my mum withheld from me. She said to do this took incredible strength & I should be proud.

I am sure I am waffling...I am not sure what I am trying to say, tbh. Just that I recognise the difficulty you are facing wrt your mum. Did something happen in your relationship with her just before/after dd was born? Are you scared of getting close to your dd because the other important female in your life is pushing you away, are you scared dd will too? You know, mums are supposed to love us unconditionally & it is very hard for me to accept that mine didn't. My dd (5) was the first person (I kid you not) that taught me I could be loved unconditionally. That I could be who I was & still be loved for who I was. Who I didn't need to shower her with anything other love to be accepted. The councellor thought that was very sad, that only in the last 5 years I feel that I have had unconditional love.

I think if you got to the bottom of your feelings for your dd, her behaviour will either improve or you will see that she is just a normal 3yr old. I wonder if her behaviour is her calling out for you to help her.

I also think that once deal with your mother, you will be in a better place to start sorting your feelings out for your dd. It sounds like your mum is a really over powering factor here.

Hugs! I wanted to send some encouragement - my DS1 and I had some bonding problems when I was back at work full-time (and had mild PND after a horrible delivery). He started associating me with chores and routine and DH with fun and therefore had a marked preference for DH. It was very upsetting and left me in tears a lot. I felt like a crap mother and things kept getting worse. DH and I made a conscious effort to break the cycle though: if DS1 was hurt, DH would refuse to comfort him and give him to me or if DS1 was bad, DH would be in charge of punishing him. It helped a bit (but didn't change fully until I was off on mat leave with DS2) and maybe you could try this with your DH. It sounds like he'd be willing to help change the balance.

I've had an easier time with DS2 for all sorts of reasons; longer mat leave, no PND, easier birth etc. We're still making sure that DH isn't just in charge of fun though - I'm not willing to always be the bad guy who enforces rules!

Morning everyone,

Thank you again to everyone for your continuing support, I honestly can't tell you what it means to me.

I have my GP appt this afternoon & I'm getting really nervous, I have to see him anyone about some other mundane things but getting really nervous about talking to him. I just hope he's nice, I'm so scared of what his reaction might be

Frumpy tried the fairy thing with DD last night, didn't quite work out, she sat & giggled for ages then after I'd left the room & was half way down the stairs I heard her shout "Fairies go park with daddy"!

We did have a slightly better day yesterday, on our way back from the shops DS had fallen asleep in the pram so we stopped in at the park & she ran around for about 10 mintues whilst we chatted which was actually quite nice.

DD is at nursery this morning, so plan on doing something with her tomorrow morning just me & her. I'm going to ask her & see if there's anything she'd like to do.

Jackaroo yes totally get what you're saying, I guess for so long I've just stood back & let Daddy be her leading man so to speak it will take a while for her to get used to wanting to do things with me instead.

Sandcastles I have some major issues re my mother that I know I need to overcome, my HV keeps teling me I need to close the chapter on it & walk away - trouble is she doesn't have a clue about my issues WRT my mum & so it's easier said then done.

In a way I think I'm so desperate not to become her that I keep myself distanced from DD.

I barely spoke to my mum when DD was first born as so much came to the surface & I couldn't cope with it, it made me realise just how dysfunctional & damning our relationship is. She (mum) makes me feel so insignificant, so belittled, so unwanted & unloved that I feel like I can't breathe sometimes.

I often wonder had DD been a DS would I feel this way?

I so want things to be differet though, I want to make things right. I want to be the person she comes to, I want to be a better mum for my DC then my mother was for me.

I guess I just find it hard to make that leap with DD & instead just find it easier to step back, let DH be the one she builds the relationship with.

Sorry - self pittying waffle again!

Ah, well you aren't waffling are you, you're being bloody brilliant at perceiving the problem and trying to do something about it.
I was already in therapy when I found out I was pregnant and it was incredible how much of the subsequent 3 years (yep) was about the mother daughter relationship... bizarrely, mine is the exact opposite to yours, so fused at the hip/smothered that i couldn't see a way of extricating myself and having my own (better?) ways of parenting. Weird isn't it.

and I think you are probably onto something as I had a DS and it was hard, but I suspect could have been much tougher. My mum has already made it clear that I am missing out on so so so much by not having a daughter, and I have to say I'm pretty relieved I'm having another DS... wimpy, but true.

Keep going, you're completely inspirational.

J

Thanks Jackaroo that's really sweet of you to say.

Well I went to the doctors & saw a new doctor, he was really, really lovely.

He actually really listened & just let me talk, he was very down to Earth, he actually acted like a human being & not just like a robot.

He himself has young children which probably made a difference too.

He said in his opinion I'm not depressed but am dealing with guilt issues. He said he doesn't feel I've done anything wrong & that if I didn't care I wouldn't have been sat in his office.

He said that girls & boys are different, boys are chilled & laid back where as girls are harder, he then said "girls are devious, I'm not meant to say that I'm meant to say they're smart but they're devious" (this made me laugh).

He went onto say that he thinks that I'm looking for there to be a problem where there isn't one - which I guess is right.

My life up until I met DH was pretty damn crappy & had a lot to deal with, since DH has come along my life has been better, something I only ever used to dream about so I guess I'm waiting for it all to go wrong.

He said that his personal opinion is that I just have different relationships with my children (he also has a son & a daughter & said he does too) but it's the guilt that's dragging me down. He's refferred me for counselling which I'm pleased about, he said it shouldn't take to long to come through.

I feel really relieved, he was a genuinely nice GP & I actually breathed a huge sigh relief as I walked out & felt much lighter.

Oh he also said realisticly he thinks I shouldn't worry to much about dieting til DS is at least a year old, (I've been dieting for a few months & was going well but last few weeks have gone to pot) so on that note I'm having a takeaway tonight with DH

TA, I like your doctor Great, wonderful that he listened. I think counselling would be a fab idea, just to voice what needs aired can help you see things in a different way. It doesn't have to be big to make a big difference.

Hope you enjoy your takeaway and your night with DH

You are already making changes, even if your DD1 hasn't caught up with you. Keeping chipping away x. You are not moaning or full of waffle, we're interested and happy to hear it all.

(p.s. thanks jackaroo, kind of you to say)

Hi TA,

Sorry I've been AWOL for a bit, but pleased everything went ok.

You're welcome for Friday too

And well done for the docs as well; can't really add to what other posters have put, as they've summed it up nicely

You've done the right thing, and just keep at it. It'll come right one way or another.

Speak to you soon, x

TA well done for seeking help