to wonder if British people who go on holiday in the States deliberately seek out the stupidest...

[AtheneNoctua]

people they can find so they can come back and tell everyone how stupid all Americans are.

Re: the friend's labour. We thought that might be the case. But that's still a problem with the set up of the health system, no?

the Regan world view. Scroll down to the map.

'I have to say that this is one of the things that I like most about Americans. There is a real "can do" attitude in the USA that puts a lot of moany Brits to shame. But I don't think that it is a universal panacea. There will always be those in low-paid jobs who can't afford insurance. Because you have to have low-paid jobs. Society needs cleaners/hospital porters/clerical staff etc., but isn't willing to pay a load of money for them. Not everyone can be a professional.'

Stands up and applauds, MTM

Agree. The other thing I like about them is that they are so incredibly polite, helpful, friendly and nice.

Stands up, bows and then profusely.

i can't ever see this happening in the uk. DH is desperate to move to the U.S and i refuse to go purely because im scared of the medical system.

Just a quick question about American healthcare.

What happens if you are skint/unemployed whatever, have no savings or available money and you fall down and break your leg? There must be some provision, isn't there? (Hope so). And if you do get emergency treatment do you have to pay it back?

I am woefully ignorant in these things - would be interesting to know the answer.

Hear hear to MrsTittleMouse. Most if not all Americans I have met and been positive and forward thinking in thier attitude, far more so than (cynical) brits.

Also, do not understand that attitude of a lot of brits that America is a cultural black hole. Any country that can produce Seinfeld, Curb Your Enthusiasm, Edith Wharton, F Scott Fitgerald, Quentin Tarantino and the Marx Brothers amongst others can't be devoid of intelligence, humour and creativity. Any English person who automatically bangs on about the superiority of UK TV and film needs to be reminded of Hollyoaks, Guy Ritchie and Last of the Summer Wine.

You go to the ER and get treated, Get. And then you pay full whack for it. If you can't afford it all at one go then you get on a payment plan. In other words, you are instantly in a large amount of debt.

Athene, I think you are right about hygiene standards in the UK (or rather lack of). I don't know why the hospitals are so dirty here. Is it because of the old buildings?

DS goes to a brand new Children's Hospital. Purpose built about 10 years ago. It feels cleaner as opposed to the Victorian hospital next door. Same cleaning standards apparently

DS has to get formula which is about £400 a month . I said to our GP that I felt bad as far as consuming NHS resources, and he said the alternative, i.e. DS being an in patient was infinitely more expensive.

Thanks for the answer expat. Christ almighty. Doesn't bear thinking about.

And what makes it worse is that the poorest are penalised again by paying more for their treatment. We had a bill from the hospital when DH went to ER (he had to be admitted for treatment) and it was huge. We then had another statement, and the lawyers in the insurance company had beaten the hospital down to 2/3 the original cost. If you can't afford insurance then you sure as Hell can't find a lawyer to barter down your bill.

If you have no money, you get welfare -- at least in Chicago. Mys sisters and their kids get free medical treatment. My nephew has sidif (no idea how to spell that) and he goes to docs at U of Chicago and some other really good hospitals. My sister is not billed for the treatment. My two sisters have had three children between them in the hospital in Chcago and not had to pay anything for them.

Granted, my two sisters is not exactly a fair sample of the population. Perhaps it is not as good elsewhere. I believe Expats experience was in Texas.

Texas has shit provisions for anyone who doesn't have insurance. Many states do when it comes to adults, although some have provisions in place for children.

Of course, it's all your fault if you don't. You didn't work hard enough, are a lazy scroungers and just need to pull yourself up by the bootstraps, because if one person can, everyone can.

There are County Hospitals where people who are poor/uninsured can get treated.

Some people qualify for medicare/medicaid which is a government program. It's actually quite an efficient system as the administration costs are something like 2%.

Another one who has found Americans mostly polite, helpful etc when holidaying in the US

the healthcare system and the lack of holiday time and the live-to-work culture are some of the reasons I'd never live there again.

also, the constant boasting and bigging up a good many of them engage in under the guise of being 'competitive' and ambitious.

You can barter them down yourself. My sister used to live in Mexico City. Just as you can fight the NHS fob off system here by being a pushy parent.

I agree that billing departments and unhelpful insurance companies are not the shining stars of the American Medical system

CORRECTION:

You can barter them down yourself. Just as you can fight the NHS fob off system here by being a pushy parent.

I agree that billing departments and unhelpful insurance companies are not the shining stars of the American Medical system

Agree Athene -- being pushy does make a massive difference to your child's health as far as getting treated.

DS would probably still not have a diagnosis if I hadn't insisted, albeit politely, that I wasn't happy with the A & E assessment of matters, and wished to have DS reviewed by a consultant Paediatrician. And then on a regular basis being referred to as 'that difficult mom...'

heavens, it's the Americans you have to watch out for on this thread.

Health care is a mess, but at least measures are being taken (FINALLY). Massachusetts, for example, has introduced a universal healthcare program. I'm not saying it's perfect, but it's a start.

Most states also have really great walk-in medical centers now, where you pay very reasonable prices for common ailments and procedures. (usually administered by a nurse practitioner, a qualification that is becoming increasingly important in the US healthcare system.)

There are great things and horrible things about both countries. I give the US a lot of credit for its optimism and that "can do" attitude MTM mentioned. Also I think a strong sense of patriotism has done the U.S. very well, for the most part, as it has France, Italy, and other countries that have a strong sense of national pride.

That pride is not easy to find in the U.K. (particularly speaking of England here.)

goodnightmoon - I agree. The can do attitude is the thing I admire about the USA.

the notion that you get better service in America is a complete myth though. What you actually get is the same shite service you get here but with a smile and a sunny disposition.

nancy66 - second that as well. It seem s very superficial in some cases but only in some cases. In other cases (like the UK) service is really great.

I had a wonderful service from a taxi driver in Washington and from the Park Rangers at the monuments near the White House. Put the UK to shame.