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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To not want the school to educate my child that disabled people did something bad in a past life?

94 replies

Kimi · 28/03/2009 16:43

DS1 age 12 came home a bit miffed that while learning about the Hindu faith the teacher said people who lived a bad life came back as something bad like a snake or where given a disability .

Fair enough if this is what those of the Hindu faith want to believe then so be it but I think it is something that needed a deeper discussion as to the whys and hows, not just put out there.

I really feel like having a chat with the school would that be unreasonable?

OP posts:
SoupDreggon · 30/03/2009 07:53

As Saadia says, there are many "unpalatable" things in many religions. In fact, I would imagine there are things in every religion which are unpalatable to those who do not believe. That does not mean they should be glossed over or missed out when being taught about that faith.

Yes, there should have been more discussion about it though. Maybe there will be i nthe next lesson?

2chocolateshoes · 30/03/2009 08:20

the sad thing is that some brats young people will hear this and use it as another stick to beat disabled peers with.
having seen what my ds has had to put up with, the digs about his spaz sister, anything like this imo should be banned.

nooka · 30/03/2009 08:49

I wonder whether part of the problem is that if the school is CoE and the teacher a Christian they don't have a good enough understanding of other faiths? I would have thought you could have an interesting and thoughtful discussion about reincarnation without a blanket "Hindus think that having a disability is all your own fault". I say this purely because I have experienced some terrible RS teaching by people who were very blinkered, and personally couldn't see anything good in any other religion, and so might rush them all off quickly in order to get back to the one they personally believed in (and possibly because they didn't want to show them in a good light). I would go in and see if you can talk about it, not all guns blazing, but to find out what sort of approach is being taken, and to take mitigating action if required. I should also say that some RS teacher are fantastic at helping children to understand an consider ethical dilemmas, and how the great faiths came to evolve.

lou33 · 30/03/2009 09:12

Riven i was thinking the same as you wrt how they will be teaching ds2 and his class about it

to be fair ds1 is doing the hindu faith right now, (we were researching Shiva last night), and he hasn't mentioned anything about disabled people being punished for a past life through their disability in this life

i do hope this isnt going to be taught to be the case , i will be having words if it occurs

Sassybeast · 30/03/2009 09:25

I'd definately want clarification of the lesson but I wouldn't go so far as to say the school taught your kid that disabled people had been evil in a previous life

2rebecca · 30/03/2009 09:28

C of E and methodist teaching is that hell is for those who don't go to heaven. Roman Catholics are maybe different as they believe in purgatory which Anglicans don't. Most non Catholic Christianity, especially the US brand of Christian fundamentalism is very strong on going to hell unless you follow the teachings of Jesus and believe he is the son of God.
I went to church regularly until I was 18. Most religions are fairly jusdgemental and have unpleasant aspects when you look into them. If most people go to heaven/get reincarnated as someone rich then you have no bribe to persuade people to behave in the way the particular faith wants you to believe. If you go to hell or get reincarnated as a spider if you misbehave it's more of an incentive to toe the line.

2chocolateshoes · 30/03/2009 11:18

lou33 I wouldn't worry ds is 17 and no body has ever told him this stuff in a lesson. the only time he has heard it is when glen(I hope he dies soon) hoddle said it.

juuule · 30/03/2009 11:36

"glen(I hope he dies soon) hoddle "

Seems a bit extreme.

FairLadyRantALot · 30/03/2009 11:42

My initial reaction just now was ...but I don't know much about Hinduism and googled and in a way it does seem that the teacher is correct....however, after reading this I don't feel quite so about it....

Jux · 30/03/2009 11:43

Haven't the Catholics recently rescinded purgatory?

I think this is pretty easy to deal with: when dd comes home telling me things like this about what a teacher said, I either laugh or remind her that people believe lots of different things and that doesn't make any of them true. Otherwise, I'm making a mountain out of a molehill. (I'm disabled btw.)

Gracie123 · 30/03/2009 11:47

Nooka makes a good point. I am a christian, but I'm also aware that some christian schools do not give the best RS education.
It's probably worth exploring what was actually said and ask the school to be more clear in the future.
At the end of the day when you put your kid in school, you have to hope that they will be taught what you want, but you can't guarantee it. I always think parental input in a school is important.
Living in a boarding school I know it can annoy some teachers ('mrs. so-an-so is always complaining') but at the end of the day it does make a difference. I think it's my right as a parent to liase with the school and ensure that my son gets the best education possible, including on small matters.

2chocolateshoes · 30/03/2009 12:06

i do wonder what the reacytion if they had been talking about "black" instead of "disabled"

helsbels4 · 30/03/2009 12:08

Surely, if the class are being taught about Hindus and their lives, religion etc, wouldn't it be wrong to not point out what their beliefs are? I don't imagine the teacher was for one second telling the class his views but merely the views of Hindu religion? He could have followed it with something like, "Of course Christians/Catholics etc don't hold these views....."
I would find it fascinating to learn how different religions and cultures affect their people. Shame I didn't when I was actually at school

FairLadyRantALot · 30/03/2009 12:11

but 2 chocoalteshoes...as far as I can see saying black instead of disabled would actually be incorrect information, wouldn't it?

onagar · 30/03/2009 12:46

Well I've just been trying elsewhere to make christians see the downside to teaching religion in school.
I imagine their take on it would be that you have to respect those who believe things like this and that after all they might be right and disabled people might be getting what they deserve.

Of course it is nasty and quite untrue, but that's religion for you.

JodieO, you say "what a load of shit" and "Are you joking?". Apparently this is because you are under the impressison that hell is only for fallen angels.
Not sure which religion that is, but for 1000s of years religious people taught that people go to hell and many still do. Although Hell is being phased out now of course.

Gracie123 · 30/03/2009 13:07

Yeah, I went to catholic school and am a christian, but I was always taught that hell is for people who don't accept Jesus.

There are several 'hell' type places such as 'sheol' which is for spirits and fallen angels, so maybe that's what you mean?

nooka · 31/03/2009 01:39

Our priest used to be keen on fire and brimstone and gnashing of teeth if you were bad, and we went to a fairly mainstream Catholic church. I have to admit I only remember admiring the dramatics (esp gnashing - what a great word)! I expect I thought Mary would intercede for me, as my Catholic school was. very keen on Mary.

It just sounds like a rather unthinking description of Hinduism to me. I would have thought you could have some very interesting discussions about why Hindus believe in reincarnation (from a cultural/anthropological view point). But then I really think religion at secondary level is taught better as a study of cultures and ethics.

scienceteacher · 31/03/2009 05:50

A couple of points raised...

Purgatory, and hastening through it, is still taught in the RC church. It is Limbo (the place for unbaptised infants) that disappeared a few years ago.

Hell simply means separation from God. If you don't have any relationship with God, then you will be totally separate from him at your death - no more hope for a life after death.

When people talking about going to Hell, they are not using the term in an orthodox Christian context. I think perhaps atheists do believe in their own version of hell because they keep sending people there! In the Christian world, a person can only send themselves there - others have not power over that. Even God won't do that.

onagar · 31/03/2009 14:15

Like I said hell is being phased out now, but we atheists can't keep up with the various revisions and schisms

What DID happen to those poor children in Limbo? were they given notice to quit?

valleysprincess · 31/03/2009 14:39

You are being unreasonable. That is what Hindu's believe. The teacher is teaching about Hinduism. It's your responsiblity as a parent to discuss this with him and help the school develop his critical reasoning skills

scienceteacher · 31/03/2009 18:38

Indeed, valley. A child can't be shielded from something he finds unpleasant. There are loads of unpleasant topics across the curriculum - should mum storm into the school each time they are exposed to poverty (geography), wars (history), loads of unpleasant English literature, pollution (science), etc.?

It's one of the rites of passage. You can't keep them wrapped in cotton wool.

nomoreamover · 31/03/2009 18:44

um I am RE teacher.....and yes I have taught this....and yes it is important that children understand SOME (NOT all) Hindus believe this. Although tbh many modern (not the best word to use but can't think of a better one - no offense any Hindu's out there...) Hindu's would not like to subscribe to the caste system and the idea of untouchables (of which in some Hindu groups the disabled would be classed as). Indeed I think you will find India declared they no longer had a caste system some years ago

Apologies if I am repeating anyone - but I am rubbish at skimreading long threads......

KimiWantsAnEasterEgg · 31/03/2009 19:00

Wow lots more responses,

I really have no problem with my children learning about other faiths at all, I think it helps to have a understanding of others.

The thing I have a problem with is that it was not explained fully it was just put that bad life 1 = disability 2.
It needs to be discussed in greater length.

DS1 had a passover feast yesterday and had a lovely time, the passover was explained in much more detail then the Hindu faith,

nomoreamover · 31/03/2009 19:11

kimi - in the teachers defence s/he may have wanted to discuss it far more detail and have have sensible valid debate about it but...

  1. may not have had the time in the ludicrusly overloaded scheme of work
  2. may not have had the in depth knowledge on Hinduism that would be required to debate such a matter
  3. may not have had children in the class (not including your DC I am sure!!) bright enough to actually hold a debate on such matters
  4. may not be a trained "specialist" ie is actually an English or History teacher sharing some of the RE teaching (as not all schools consider it worth employing a specialist in the subject) and therefore has no idea how to teach RE sensitively

If it is answer 1 or 3 - YABU - cut him/her some slack

If it is answer 2 or 4 - YANBU and I would ask for some more time to be spent ensuring the teacher actuially knows what they are talking about before spouting off to impressionable young minds

nooka · 01/04/2009 02:45

Scienceteacher I think you will find that that is one definition of hell, but as with all things religious not the only one. I certainly grew up with a much more vengeful interpretation of faith, with the caveat that forgiveness was also on offer through confession - for Catholics that is (ie everyone else would be going to hell).