to think all sahms should be banned

[WouldYouCouldYouWithAGoat]

if they have nothing better to do than sit on mumsnet thinking up unpleasantries about working mothers and their childcare arrangements to justify their own life choices.

bah!

They should all be sent on 5 week sailing trips

Why is the debate always reduced to SAHM vs WOHM?

When the point is that some nurseries are fantastic (and I would send DD2 to DD1's preschool tomorrow if they would take her and I could afford it)but others are terrible.

I wish the government would invest in state provided nurseries for babies and toddlers and pay nursery teachers more for advancing their training and qualifications.

Some of the private nurseries I looked at were being run on a shoestring and I felt the facilities were really inadequate.

It makes me angry that some parents are forced to put their children in childcare they are unhappy with.

And that the debate about SAHM/WOHM are always dominated by women in the media who have access to fantastic childcare and can go on preaching about the benefits of working knowing that Tybalt and Jocasta are being looked after by a fantastic Montessori, multi-lingual, nobel prize winning nanny.

I've been both, I was a sahm with dd but a working mum with ds. I must admit I got a better deal first time round. I felt I spent more quality time with dd. Whereas poor ds has been to 3 different nurseries and I've hated every minute of it. I used to spend my working hours thinking of him and worrying about him - esp after I'd had to leave him screaming my name.

Unfortunately many of us work because we don't have a choice. And I suppose it does have it's upside. I never got a tea-break as a sahm, I could never go to the loo on my own, my confidence was zapped and the comments you get from men esp, about not really working or having a proper job really get you down.

I think sahm's should be paid by the government to be able to stay at home - after all why pay someone else to do the job you do better?

Today, Clara, I have done washing, planted 200 snowdrops, mumsnetted and eaten rather too much chocolate... it's been tough

If we ban toddlers then this argument will be irrelvent and we would all have more time to mumsnet

Brilliant idea. According to someone on that other thread, because I work full time I am not actually bringing my child up anyway, so it would be no different for him.

I think actually we should ban children altogether, now THAT would definitely sort the SAHM/WOHM problem as well as the nursery/childminder one!

I'm busy trying to avoid seeing my children or having anything to do with them. As soon as they're old enough I'm sending 'em out to clean chimneys. Luckily for society, as chimney sweeps they will be deemed to poor to be allowed to breed responsibly.

But then I'd have to go back to sodding work Gorionine!

Oooh, not seen the other thread - am I a horrible monster for having had DS in nursery 5 days a week and now DD 4 days a week? I bet I am worse for having left at 6:30am to the sound of DD wailing and getting my father to take them to school/nursery.

Can we not establish once and for all that most SAHMs and WOHMs are illogically jealous (and therefore critical) of each other and logically know full well that the grass is not in fact greener? No, on second thoughts, as someone said, where would the fun open and frank debate be in that?

I'm on maternity leave so getting a taste for being a SAHM.

I quite like it wish we could afford to make it permenant.

Off to change the TV channel and have a nother cup of tea. Not sure where the kids have gone

Good call Stealth. However I am only jealous of SAHMs if they have a nanny or housekeeper. And then I am really green.

I did point out to dh that in years gone by his job would have meant that I could have been a SAHM with STAFF and then I would be technically at home but working through supervision of the cook, the maid, the housekeeper and generally making sure that I could swan about a perfect household doing the lovely things and leaving the mess for someone else

My friend's mum is a SAHM with multiple staff. She is lovely and I am very jealous!!

I think children should be banned.

I knew a SAHM with FT nanny, housekeeper, personal trainer, and she sent her laundry out to be washed & ironed. I liked her but knew that I could never invite her back to our tiny mouse-infested working mother slattern flat so we didn't stay friends. Had nothing to do with my being as hell, of course.

Expats that I know that are SAHMs with Nanny's are lazy, self centred and weird. The children are precocious and spoilt. They have far too many material possessions and no interpersonal skills.

As a SAHM I am busy and creative with my child free time.

I have to say I am jealous of women who still maintain their career but would not miss out [can't think of how else to write it, don't mean that women who work do miss out emoticon] on being at home with my children whilst they are young. If I could split myself in two I would.

stealthsquiggle: You are soooo right. I don't want to get up really early and have a long commute, and would love to spend more than 3 days a week with dd. That said, I KNOW that both she and I would stark raving mad within a few weeks if I didn't work, and I would be bitter and snipey with people.

I am sure that SAHMs are the same (in reverse IFYSWIM....)

No, no no, small orange, here is the beauty, no children = less expenses, less expenses means no need for second wages so you can stay at home and do nothing but painting your nails. With this scheme, you become a SAHI (stay at home individual and have much less irining and cleaniong to do is that not great?

Anyway, if anybody ask, you cannot go back to work because you would then become respondsable for the recession and you really really care far to much about the world economics to even envisage that! ( and so do I!)

I think most of us understand that we're all trying to do our best. I'm WIHM too, and I have had comments from SAHMs, but more through misunderstanding than malice I'm sure. (Didn't stop it hurting at the time, but hey ho, I do realise it probably wasn't intentional). And I've had comments from WOHM's who assume that i'm just 'pottering about' with my business at home. But again, I'm sure it wasn't intended to hurt my feelings.

It never kicks off in RL like it does here at least!

Get over to the other thread then Madamdeath Stare, where I have been told I am not actually bringing up my son because I work.

If someone pays my childcare which I can't afford I'll give up being a SAHM.

I am too frightened of other thread. There are some scarey mothers out there.

To true MDS!

Another reason I think SAHM/WOHM threads get to me is that few of us are rarely either one for the whole of our children's lives. Most of us do take maternity leave and SAHM mothers do usually get some sort of work outside child care.

Which renders the whole argument pointless.

If the argument/discussion is about childcare then surely we all have something to say as most children will have some sort of pre-school education at some point regardless of what their mothers do with their time. We all have a vested interested in ensuring it is the best it can be surely.

(Didn't read the other thread - just gleaned it was about childcare so if I am wrong - shoot me and then I won't have to be banned)