To want employer to help with some of my childcare costs??

[cheekymonk]

Hi There
I work for Civil Service and have a 4 year old ds. I work 4 days per week and do 26 hours. DS is at nursery whilst I work.
DH is away on 7 month deployment with navy, no family to help out.
We don't get working tax credits as income too high (supposedly!!)
We both get the vouchers which have saved us some money.
I got promotion in 2007 and ever since I have noticed the odd having to pay extra so I can attend courses on non working days, occasionally stay late and help out with recruitment etc. I knew promotion would mean working harder/giving more which I don't begrudge. I do get paid more obviously so thats fine and to be expected.
I have just paid out and taken it on the chin so far but got another £10 charge on monday as late (after 6 so pay out of hours charge) and the boss I was helping (not usual boss) refused to let me go dead on time despite me saying I needed to. I did think I would make it but due to traffic didn't. I am with same boss tomorrow so will go on dot whether he likes it or not. I had already paid another £18 for the 2 extra hours on that day I had to take so I could help out.
I have worked it all out and have paid £280 over a year due to things like this. Its not a fortune but money we could do with and at the end of the day, I don't go to work to be out of pocket.
I can put a business case to my boss to ask for help with childcare costs. AIBU to do this???
Some could say I took the promotion, I had a child, I married a forces man etc so therefore it is my fault and I should live with it and not expect someone else to pay for my decisions (I'll say it before someone else does!) BUT why should I be discriminated against for being part-time, a mother and having some ambition?

they can't force you to stay and be late for pick up. you should have just gone.

Sorry YABU.

Look into whether HR do any childcare help at all, such as taking it out of your gross salary which might help.

Are you generally doing more than your 26 hours per week?

If your income is too high for WTC, then it's upwards of £56,000, right?

But I don't understand what the difference would be if you were full time vs part time?

I had a letter - as did everyone at the after school club advising us on what charges would be implemented for being quarter of an hour late, and then what action would be taken for being over an hour later and an hour and a half (two people had in the previous term been an hour and a half late) which would result in SS being called.

I was forever trying to rush from work to after school club due to work being late clsing.

i took the letter to work and gave to my line mamager and explained that I couldn't afford the payment. My line manager went off and came back with a solution and having implemented this I never have to rush any more.

I am in the union and would they would have been my next call but this was not needed.

I would ask for a letter from your child care provider setting out the late payment structure and the proceedure for later parental pick ups.

Take it to your line manager and ask them to find a solution.

If not getting anywhere eeither contact your union or contact acas.

Keep all your reciets for late charges aswell.

There are some holiday playschemes whith slightly subsidised rates but no day care facilities/creche whatsoever.
Yes, I know now I should have just gone. I'm trying to keep everyone happy but I worry that I should be more ruthless with work. I don't want to play the got to go-childcare issues card all the time as I feel it sounds a bit pathetic/reflects badly but of course I don't wish to do this at my son's expense.
Men rarely have these issues do they?!!

YABU - but I suspect you know that!

But your employers are also being unreasonable by not letting you go when you have finished your contracted hours.

Definitely talk to your bosses about this. If they aren't sympathetic then go to HR and talk to them.

Generally I do do the 26 hours. My usual boss actually suggested looking into the issue but I just would hate to be judged as money grabbing.
No we have joint income of about 36K I think. Sounds alot but we have an IVa so things are tight.

If someone has forced you to stay after your leaving time and this has cost you a late charge at the nursery, I would put this as an expense and claim it back. Just like at my old office, if you stayed past a certain time, you could put a taxi fare in your expenses.

I don't think it is expecting other people to pay for your decisions. It was someone else's decision to keep you late, not yours.

Oh honestly, that is so not helpful saying men don't have these issues. Of course they do. This is not about you being a woman at all.

Do you do more than your 26 hours?

"BUT why should I be discriminated against for being part-time, a mother and having some ambition?"

Why should you get extra special treatment for the above? Do you think your colleagues get extra if they stay late? OK, so you want childcare costs incurred to be covered rather than being paid overtime but it's not just childcare that incurs extra costs if you're not there on time. What about colleagues who have a horse and need to pay for it to be done because they're working late, or have a table booked at a restaurant and incur cancellation charges, or a dog sitter who charges extra after a certain time, etc., etc. It sounds as though your promotion does incur the odd bit of overtime (as many do) and as such I think YABU.

You're not being discriminated against though. There has to be a cut off point, it's a benefit to help people on low incomes.

I agree you're boss can't make you stay late.

Men sometimes do, my dh for instance as he's the one in our family who does nursery pickups. I don't think it does anyone any favours to see it as a women's issue - it's a parents issue.

You have to be very clear with your boss and be confident and not embarrassed about leaving on time. Make it clear you are happy to take on extra work if it's more flexible (eg tasks you can take home).

This isn't really answering your "AIBU" but have you considered a childminder? The childminder who looks after DS took us on, on the understanding that we needed complete flexibility, due to my unpredictable hours and DH's working pattern. She was happy to accommodate this and as a result pay out a lot on childcare fees than we would have needed to with a nursery.

I've been able to change my working days to go on courses, and change the day we put DS in with our childminder. Obviously not all are capable of this.

I'd be surprised if your employer pay out. You need to think of a better solution.

Even if you weren't part-time this would happen. The problem is that if you have childcare issues (therefore have to leave work on time) then you can't pursue the career path you'd planned before you had kids.

I think you have to accept that if you leave on time, that will be the end of your career trajectory. It might not be fair but it's about who's the primary earner - I presume if it were you, it would be your husband who'd be dealing with the childcare issues.

I'm not saying it doesn't suck big time but that's the reality. As your DS is already 4, won't he go to school quite soon? If you move to a childminder, you will probably find that s/he is a bit more flexible re being 5 mins late on the odd occasion.

By the way, I'm part-time and in a similar position to you. You have to set boundaries. How assertive are you in negotiating your availability workwise?

If your son is settled at nursery then it's probably too late too suggest this but I think the best plan for a working mother is to have a childcare solution that is close to work. That way you may have a lengthy commute with the child in the morning and evening but you're not hurtling through traffic clockwatching. I am very lucky to work within a mile of school, nursery and home. My husband is never available for pickups because of his work and I simply couldn't do the hours I do - full time - from any greater distance away.

I do sympathise - it is very hard. I do feel though that it's not for your employer to pay towards your bill. It is their responsibility to ensure that your job can be done within contracted hours. If you have to work overtime then they should be paying you for that and you can of course then redirect that payment to your extra childcare. I think you could do with an emergency childminder who could do a few hours at the end of the day. If you can find somebody local to the nursery you might be able to set something up and reduce all your stress levels?

YABU to expect employer to pay childcare costs but You would not be unreasonable to expect to be paid for your extra hours work - so speak to them about being able to claim for occasions when there is unavoidable overtime or if there is a course you need to go to on a day you wouldn't usually work.
(You will probably find, that once they have to pay 'overtime' (I would expect it to be your usual pay rate, not time and a half) then they will be more respectful of your fixed hours).

Blimey- have just put ds to bed so lots to catch up on!
I feel it is full vs. part time issue as if I worked full-time then ds would be in nursery full-time and it would only be the £10 charges I would incur (Have only ever had 3 and 1 of them is not works fault).
Nursery let it go when I am 5 mins late but over that I get charged another hour's fee which I would not get if full-time.
I choose not to go full-time as I want to enjoy that one day (have only recently increased working days to 4, it was 3)and money wise there is not alot in it after tax and nursery fees so 26 hours seemed to make sense.
No perhaps I was being sexist saying about men and thats just my resentfulness coming out at dh being away! SORRY. It is a parents issue.
I don't get paid overtime. As I work under 37 hours, it just gets added to my flexi-time. Even in the summer when dh looked after ds and I worked a couple of saturdays, I got flat rate. Again this is because I am part-time.
DS is happy at nursery, he starts school in Sept so don't really want to uproot him. This is the problem as promotion was based at office further away (didn't know this when I applied). Nursery is about 4 miles from home. Work is about 10 miles from nursery so it is a nightmare.
Maybe it is not being discriminated against per se, but I am juggling a hell of alot (like many people) and could just do with some slack.
I could definitely do with being more assertive work wise. We have a new boss who makes it clear he finds part time workers a pain but suprisingly he has been ok with me and I think because I do give alot seems happier to help. As I said it was HIS suggestion to look into it but when I was writing up the 'business case' I wanted to consider my argument hence coming on here.
as I say, I just want help with stuff over and above, not the contracted hours.

I think some of the posters are being a bit mean on the op.

Working part time does mean that employers tend to think they can dump courses etc on you for you to do in your own time.

If you have a reasonable boss, you can claim overtime. If you have an unreasonable boss - hard cheese. This is more apparant in public services/civil servant type jobs.

Speak to your boss and explain the situation. I hope you can work something out. I also know what it is like to have a forces dh, and have no practical help at all.

I am an Army wife! And a civil servant. There is definitely some money available in the system for odd instances of extra childcare costs. I have apporved it in the past.

There are also advances available. I will dig some stuff out for you next week if it helps.

Thanks cheshirekitty and those of you that seem to understand where I am coming from. Its never dull on here is it?!
I do appreciate everyone's input.

Oh great, thanks hf128219. Yes, the intranet says there is but it sounds like it is all based on manager discretion.

I'm in a similar situation - I work 19 hours (officially) but often find myself in the situation where there are courses on the days I don't work, or things run on a bit.

I now take the approach that these are my contracted hours, and make it clear that I have to leave at X time. I also make it clear that I cannot come in on my days off - it's not a case of swapping a nursery day, I have to pay for an additional day, and I'm not doing that. It's a fact of working p/t I'm afraid.

If you feel that you are incurring additional costs then you have to build that into your business case and get them to accept it, otherwise (and I would also add this to your business case), you would have to strict rigidly to your hours, which may be a threat to their business.

I understand where you are coming from and I do think if a boss is making you stay late over and above your contracted hours, then some kind of agreement needs to be in place to make sure you don't loose out.

In terms of:

"I think you have to accept that if you leave on time, that will be the end of your career trajectory"

Why is that/should that be the case? Even before I had children, I never reguarly stayed late - only did it when I had to. I have always had a work life balance and it has done me no harm whatsoever. i think its a shame that we just accept that to get on in our careers we hve to work hours we are not being paid for.

Sorry, slightly off topic

YANBU - In my old job, when I had a childminder. I deliberately booked the cm for slightly longer than I needed (which it sounds like you already do). But I refused to stay after that so didn't have to incur any late penalties.

BUT if they wanted me to work or go on a course or similar on Fridays, this would always be dependant on my childminder being available and she would produce a seperate invoice for that day which I would submit as an expense. However this was agreed in advance - in fact it was written into my application for part time working after having DS 7 years ago.

However, I was flexible about taking work home. In fact, if they needed me on a conference call, I would be very upfront about having this before I left the office or after the school/childminder pickup (saying ignore the cbeebies in the background).

Actually, I was very flexible about doing evening or weekend work, which worked to the companies advantage as that was the best time to do server upgrades or software installation. Especially as I preferred to do the extra work after 8:00 when the children were in bed as that was when most of the stores were also shut, so there was no chance of me bringing something down during trading hours.