to think it is rude to persistently refer to God/Allah/etc. as an "imaginary friend"

[AtheneNoctua]

even after asked not to by several posters who have stated they found it offensive.

No that's the fun of religious threads on Mumsnet. Perhaps the true value of religion is the great conversations it can engender

I agree ruty we are all guilty of it, and these discussions would all be a lot more interesting if we directed more of our energies to understanding the opposing point of view rather than repeatedly shouting out our own.

I have to admit that for a long time my prejudice was that atheists were more sophisticated in outlook than people with religion, and somewhat more evolved in their thinking (probably because I felt I had "evolved" from a Catholic into an atheist). Recent threads on Mumsnet have certainly disabused me of that notion.

Agree with wehaveallbeenthere over the black hole/dead zone/toxic waste issues though.

Two of my children have imaginary friends. They talked about them since they could talk, they play with them every day. They incorporate each other's friends into their joint games.

Maybe they are real..not a real invisible child but an aspect of each child that they see as separate from themselves for some reason. (like their spirit perhaps?)

It's a common thing but what is the purpose?

Good point Nooka, bad analogy. It seems like this thread has gone from the courtesies of discussion to critisism of others beliefs and practices.
How does one establish if there is something greater than ourselves, or after death?
Since it is just pleasant conversation between intelligent people I suggest we use the "death" analogy.
It has everything...myth, scientific establishment (although the EMT calls are now revised in the USA because of a person being prepared for autopsy after being pronounced dead) and no one is immune.
It is a common ground.

Oh,btw, before we get really worked up again, the case of losing Earth's polinators (the focus is on the bees but all the polinators are rapidly disappearing) can I suggest trying to colonize "mason" bees. They don't sting and are seemingly fairly immune to whatever is taking out the honey bees. The only thing wrong with them is they don't produce honey.
K, had to squeeze that in.

Sorry - probably being dence, but what is the analogy? I certainly agree we all die!

Not sure I see death as a mystery at all. No more so than a broken machine. You can fix a broken machine just as you can revive a person near death. The reason you can't fix the person weeks later after sending off for a spare part is that other bits go through changes in the meantime.

Oops dense.

wehavebeenthere, yes lots of things to worry about. Lots of things to take joy from too (the beauty of the world, the fellowship of friends, the love of children etc)

Well you can, but there's not much point suggesting it to us, unless there's someone influential from DEFRA lurking on this thread. Is interesting though - do you have a link?

Death as an entity example. There are many documented proofs that people that should have died did not and those that shouldn't have ...through extroidinary circumstances, did. Like it has an agenda.

Sorry, what is DEFRA? If I can figure out how to open another window on this computer I can look it up, if I know what I am looking for.

Pretty sure there is no proof that anything impossible happened in the way of people not dying when they were supposed to. I'd have heard about it.
And if only possible things happened... well no surprise there.

Department of Environment, Food and Rural Affairs - sorry was just a joke. Do you have a link about the mason bee colonisation plan?

Okay, I got the Department for Environment, Food , and Rural affairs. Is that the one? What is it you want to look up?

The bees.

No, but after watching KLRU on the dying colonies of polinating bees...that is just one of my suggestions. They seem to think that partial problem of the bees just wandering off and dying is from a parasite from the bee imports from China...wax, honey, and royal jelly.
There is one province that is already having to be polinated by hand as they have no polinators now.
So they gather together and use these little feather wands to dust the flowers to produce crops.

There is also a massive declination of polinated veggies and fruits. Once all the polinators are gone...it is only a matter of time before we are down to nothing but grains.
I can't remember how many storage facilities there are in the world where they store different grain types..I know there is one in Antarctica (huge massive underground vault system) so if a plan is made to replant they have the seeds.
They site the difference in apple types from the 1920 to know. We only have so many viable types now when we have countles types more then.

The documentary is titled "Silence of the Bees" but I haven't been able to get a copy since it sells out so fast and they run only on scheduled times.

So I found this. We don't need defra after all - we can colonise them ourselves. Do you think it will really help? Should we start a mumsnet back garden bee colony campaign?

Iorek, that's fabulous! Yes, if you are an avid gardener...you can probably note the difference in pollination of your garden after and before.
I had taken notice of these bees when in a gardening magazine (I think it was a Smith and Hawken here in the states) that sells hanging nests. They are just a bunch of little tubes put together as ready made nests. The bees need only to move in. Since they aren't agressive I see no reason why they shouldn't become a permanent resident.

Even if you aren't, they will find and pollinate and sharing them as a project with your children would only help to make them aware of connections between nature balances.

But you don't think it will save the world? [disappointed emoticon]

I think it could help. At this point I think we need all the help we can get.

re how the universe is 'in' God. When I wondered if you could explain what you meant, I didn't mean just more vague metaphors but some idea of how you think this ACTUALLY works please. When God intervenes on earth does he obey the laws of physics? How does he make neurons fire? And how does he manage this for every human being on earth at the same time?

Oh and humans are certainly not unique in the ability to think and feel. Chimps cry. Ewes show signs of distress when their lambs are taken for slaughter. We think and feel BETTER because we have bigger, more complex brains, which have come about because of evolution. It's not really complicated.