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The budget now rubbish it is

184 replies

Noras · Yesterday 17:02

my post should read how rubbish is this budget!

So I will only get a state pension and income from an investment property for my retirement ( monies from an inheritance ) as I have looked after my disabled son. So the Gov have gone against me as ever.

But have they gone against the extremely wealthy or huge corporates that exercise price transfer re tax tax or use franchises/ loan agreements etc to legally avoid tax?

Nope.

I actually loathe this government now. They always shield the wealthy and go for the middle classes. Those with a bit of bank interest or a single asset let’s tax that more - easy pickings.

OP posts:
PinkFrogss · Yesterday 17:52

GasPanic · Yesterday 17:44

Well a bit less income following the budget as they are raising the tax on rental income from what I can tell.

TBH I think it has been obvious for probably at least 5 years that the winds of change are blowing against the private landlord. Increased taxes. Huge increases in regulation and significant benefits given to tenants.

I was never a fan of BTL, but for me the smart money was really out by the time IRs started to rise (after covid) and HPI could no longer be banked on.

Everyone who was in the sector after that was IMO HODL'ing and therefore a cash cow with a big target painted on its side for the government.

Tbf I missed that - and I was watching it live! Clearly wasn’t listening properly. I just looked and unless the OP is renting out a palace the additional tax will be more than offset by the additional state pension, so she’ll still be overall better off than she is now.

JimBobsWife · Yesterday 17:53

Sartre · Yesterday 17:17

Can you explain this? My neighbour was pushed out of her house this month by a dodgy landlord who has decided to sell up to avoid being placed on the landlord register. Why are landlords afraid of this?

If he’s a dodgy landlord, I would have thought it would be obvious why he wouldn’t want to be easily identifiable?!

Raiderofthelostbattenburg · Yesterday 17:54

Definitely a do no harm, steady the ship budget. I'd've liked to see the government go further on the bank levy and the taxes on gambling companies, but I thought there was some good stuff about supporting small high street businesses, and on helping young entrepeneurs.

LBFseBrom · Yesterday 17:55

So........
I presume you'll be paying a bit more tax.

BMW6 · Yesterday 17:57

OP what you are failing to realise is that if you try to tax "the rich" beyond a certain point the rich leave the country and the Revenue from them GOES DOWN

I worked for HMRC for over 30 years. I've seen it in action in real time.

There is a "Goldilocks Zone" where you set a rate of taxation that brings in the maximum Revenue - that goes to those without.

You want a fully funded Welfare State don't you?
Then you need INCOME from the Wealthy who don't leave!

Previous Labour Governments utterly failed in this "Tax and Spend" was their mantra. It never lasted long.

Cardhey · Yesterday 17:59

They are buying votes. Simple as that. And bankrupting the country in the process. And changing the ethos of GB too….

JimBobsWife · Yesterday 18:01

Discosnake · Yesterday 17:42

I have nothing against landlords. But, I have lot against whinging like that.
You are a business, providing service. Of course there will be numerous running costs. Licensing, h&s, repairs etc. Like with any kind of business. Your income is also your growth in equity, not just your monthly profit.

It’s not like any other business. Sole trader LLs are taxed on turnover not profit which means you are artificially pushed into higher tax brackets.

With one hand Government is outsourcing the job of housing people to the private sector because it cannot get its act together to build the 1.5m homes Angela fuckface Rayner promised. With the other hand, it’s beating landlords black and blue and expecting them to roll over and take it.

Many haven’t. Leading to temporary housing costs soaring and making councils bankrupt.

Is Burnham doing anything about it? Is he fuck. Instead he’s distracting everyone from his current inaction by ‘having a conversation’ about Brexit and making promises for 2030 when hopefully he won’t be in power. What a joke.

Noras · Yesterday 18:03

The issue is that the Gov will keep fiddling with this and that usually again the middle classes but we all
know about parent holding companies / massive loans from parent companies that never get repaid get rolled over to offset the tax bill etc

To make it worse some of these companies usually benefit from underpaying their employees who then have to claim universal credit or be supported for the privilege of making money for these off shore profit chasing companies. Hence I get the need to raise minimum wage to lower the UC bill.

My post is not even really about the tax I pay but the constant reluctance of a gov to actually stop the huge transfer of cash to off shore places without decent tax being paid. These are eye watering sums.

After the next election it will be against PAYE again as they are running out of middle class assets to tax more but in the meantime the off shore companies rub their hands with glee

We are dogs fighting over scraps

OP posts:
CurlyKoalie · Yesterday 18:05

I was really disappointed that the tax allowance wasn't raised to say£ 15K. Let working people, particularly the low paid, keep a bit more in their pockets to spend in the local economy!
The extra increase in minimum wage much vaunted by the PM will be eaten up in tax.
Employers will also be dismayed at the increased cost to them at a time when we need to generate more jobs.
Wave bye-bye to employers taking on more young people and training them up.

ReadingSoManyThreads · Yesterday 18:05

Sartre · Yesterday 17:17

Can you explain this? My neighbour was pushed out of her house this month by a dodgy landlord who has decided to sell up to avoid being placed on the landlord register. Why are landlords afraid of this?

I'm personally afraid of it as I had to flee my highly physically abusive ex-H and was told by police to never tell him where I lived. Now, I have to register and my personal details, including address will be publicly available for him to find me and attempt to kill me again.

I am registered as a LL in another country and none of our personal details are available publicly, so it can be done, yet for some reason they have decided to throw us to the wolves in England.

PinkFrogss · Yesterday 18:06

CurlyKoalie · Yesterday 18:05

I was really disappointed that the tax allowance wasn't raised to say£ 15K. Let working people, particularly the low paid, keep a bit more in their pockets to spend in the local economy!
The extra increase in minimum wage much vaunted by the PM will be eaten up in tax.
Employers will also be dismayed at the increased cost to them at a time when we need to generate more jobs.
Wave bye-bye to employers taking on more young people and training them up.

I would rather see the national insurance threshold raised by £2.5k per year than the tax threshold as that is truly aimed at working people.

JimBobsWife · Yesterday 18:06

Raiderofthelostbattenburg · Yesterday 17:54

Definitely a do no harm, steady the ship budget. I'd've liked to see the government go further on the bank levy and the taxes on gambling companies, but I thought there was some good stuff about supporting small high street businesses, and on helping young entrepeneurs.

How is he steadying the ship? He’s reduced the headroom Reeves left him and deferred important decisions on defence until this time next year?

Id say less steadying the ship and more ignoring all the elephants in the room and hoping the proles won’t notice because he’s bunged them some money off energy bills.

Gaderee · Yesterday 18:08

Noras · Yesterday 17:10

Well we all know that it’s tax avoidance not evasion so not legally wrong because the Gov does nothing to legislate to capture more tax from them - that’s the point of my post! They go against the middle classes.

These corporation have huge influence in parliament to ensure that they are protected. This is why so many elderly people’s homes are able to off shore funds to Lichtenstein or companies use expensive franchise agreements with parent companies to reduce on shore tax with parent companies set up in the Cayman Islands.

These are multinational companies doing nothing whatsoever wrong. Get over it. There is no magic money tree. If we want to pay more welfare and have a larger defence budget WE have to pay for it. If we don’t, WE need to vote for politicians that will make savage cuts. There is no middle ground.

Noras · Yesterday 18:08

BMW6 · Yesterday 17:57

OP what you are failing to realise is that if you try to tax "the rich" beyond a certain point the rich leave the country and the Revenue from them GOES DOWN

I worked for HMRC for over 30 years. I've seen it in action in real time.

There is a "Goldilocks Zone" where you set a rate of taxation that brings in the maximum Revenue - that goes to those without.

You want a fully funded Welfare State don't you?
Then you need INCOME from the Wealthy who don't leave!

Previous Labour Governments utterly failed in this "Tax and Spend" was their mantra. It never lasted long.

But we are getting to the stage that these who can get out of the country eg having an Irish passport as an example - will sell up all assets and go elsewhere.

Members of my family are actively thinking of trying to go elsewhere. People are getting to that point - it reminds me of when my dad wanted to go to Aus in the 1970s

What is worse is that the kids with excellent qualification are going to places like NZ or Australia etc as they see what has happened to parents.
My friends son has just left for NZ. So many of our family have left to eg US or NZ etc

I have a daughter with excellent qualifications and I doubt that she will stay if she can get seconded abroad to say NY or Australia.

OP posts:
Allseeingallknowing · Yesterday 18:09

If the state pension plus a small private pension is not as much as the highest state pension, but exceeds the threshold then it is indeed very unfair. Surely the government can’t get away with this? Just saying it would be administratively difficult is not good enough.

Gaderee · Yesterday 18:09

GasPanic · Yesterday 17:18

It was a boring nothingburger of a budget. The markets shrugged and did nothing.

However, for people wanting to stick it to the "big corporations" some changes were annouced to taxation on online sales platforms which IMO are great (but will of course end up costing people more money and may even reduce the variety of goods on offer) and of course the extra bank tax which is paying for the energy payment.

Agree. These are excellent changes long over due.

khakipant · Yesterday 18:09

Noras · Yesterday 18:03

The issue is that the Gov will keep fiddling with this and that usually again the middle classes but we all
know about parent holding companies / massive loans from parent companies that never get repaid get rolled over to offset the tax bill etc

To make it worse some of these companies usually benefit from underpaying their employees who then have to claim universal credit or be supported for the privilege of making money for these off shore profit chasing companies. Hence I get the need to raise minimum wage to lower the UC bill.

My post is not even really about the tax I pay but the constant reluctance of a gov to actually stop the huge transfer of cash to off shore places without decent tax being paid. These are eye watering sums.

After the next election it will be against PAYE again as they are running out of middle class assets to tax more but in the meantime the off shore companies rub their hands with glee

We are dogs fighting over scraps

The top 1% of taxpayers pay roughly 28% of income tax, and the top 10% around 60%.

HMRC puts the total tax gap at around 5% of liabilities, and large businesses are a minority of that.

You’re in cloud cuckoo land.

Sartre · Yesterday 18:11

ReadingSoManyThreads · Yesterday 18:05

I'm personally afraid of it as I had to flee my highly physically abusive ex-H and was told by police to never tell him where I lived. Now, I have to register and my personal details, including address will be publicly available for him to find me and attempt to kill me again.

I am registered as a LL in another country and none of our personal details are available publicly, so it can be done, yet for some reason they have decided to throw us to the wolves in England.

So they will place your home address and other contact details on a public register for all to see?

Sartre · Yesterday 18:13

JimBobsWife · Yesterday 17:53

If he’s a dodgy landlord, I would have thought it would be obvious why he wouldn’t want to be easily identifiable?!

Yes I agree but the PP also said she was afraid of the changes and I wanted to know whether any legitimate landlords have good reason to hate them that’s all.

Gaderee · Yesterday 18:13

Noras · Yesterday 18:03

The issue is that the Gov will keep fiddling with this and that usually again the middle classes but we all
know about parent holding companies / massive loans from parent companies that never get repaid get rolled over to offset the tax bill etc

To make it worse some of these companies usually benefit from underpaying their employees who then have to claim universal credit or be supported for the privilege of making money for these off shore profit chasing companies. Hence I get the need to raise minimum wage to lower the UC bill.

My post is not even really about the tax I pay but the constant reluctance of a gov to actually stop the huge transfer of cash to off shore places without decent tax being paid. These are eye watering sums.

After the next election it will be against PAYE again as they are running out of middle class assets to tax more but in the meantime the off shore companies rub their hands with glee

We are dogs fighting over scraps

You haven’t a clue how international companies work do you? Not a clue.

Boreded · Yesterday 18:14

Noras · Yesterday 17:20

There is too much admin now

quarterly accounts - more costs

landlords register - just more cost

the new legislation - you need really good insurance to overcome possible rent voids if tenants don’t pay - more costs

no indexation allowance for CGT when you sell up so more costs

So it’s easier to take funds invest it to allow accumulated growth and only pay tax when you withdraw funds

Then sell your property and invest elsewhere…but you won’t because it is still profitable.

I have a property I rent out too, guess what, I’ll make less money on it now, but also guess what…I’ll still make money because every month what I get covers my mortgage and increases my equity whilst the asset increases in value at the same time. And I change far and away below market rate too. 🤷‍♀️

The budget was much of nothing. No impact for the vast majority.

The only thing that will impact me is a tiny bit of extra tax on my salary sacrifice, and I mean tiny. And I’ll get £100 that I don’t need so I’ll donate it to a local charity for people who actually are in poverty.

JimBobsWife · Yesterday 18:15

Sartre · Yesterday 18:13

Yes I agree but the PP also said she was afraid of the changes and I wanted to know whether any legitimate landlords have good reason to hate them that’s all.

Legitimate landlords have been penalised for the last decade plus for the actions of rogue landlords. This is nothing new and governments are extremely narrow minded when it comes to managing the PRS.

ChilliPotato · Yesterday 18:18

Sole trader LLs are taxed on turnover not profit

This is absolute nonsense, of course they aren’t.

ilovesooty · Yesterday 18:18

Cardhey · Yesterday 17:59

They are buying votes. Simple as that. And bankrupting the country in the process. And changing the ethos of GB too….

Hardly. It's not as if an election is imminent. How are they changing the ethos of Great Britain and how was that evidenced in the budget?

ReadingSoManyThreads · Yesterday 18:18

Sartre · Yesterday 18:11

So they will place your home address and other contact details on a public register for all to see?

Yes, name, address, phone number & email address. So I'm not safe. I already have PTSD from the severe violence I suffered and the time I survived him trying to kill me, now I'll be back to living in fear of him finding me again.

Whereas, in NI, where I am also a LL, I am registered with the government body, yet none of my details are available to the public.