Andy Burnham is just a dumbed down version of Starmer

[WarmHiker]

Just caught a snippet of some confident sounding commentator on tv repeating a line that you tend to hear in all news programmes. That Burnham is personable and has charisma. That line is starting make me think that as a country, the tyranny of low expectations has really hit a new low.

First thing’s first, when did saying ‘isn’t it’ after every sentence pass for charisma. Is the bar for charisma really that low.

Second, the guy’s failed upwards into a job that he’s clearly not fit for. His answer to everything is ‘Booses’.

The economy is on fire, buses. Immigration is out of control, buses. Crime is a problem, buses. We have the most expensive energy, buses. Industry and businesses are shutting down, buses.

He’s basically a small town mayor who accidentally became the prime minister because the quality of talent in parliament is non existent. Manchester is not a small town but running buses in Manchester doesn’t make you fit to be a PM. He was a failed health secretary, failed to be Labour leader twice when he actually had to have proper fight, somehow grifted his way to a mayor job for a decade. And yes his predecessors were any better. But why all the fawning over Burnham.

AIBU to think that we are headed towards a point soon when the public turns on him. He’s utterly out of his depth and the false shine will wear off in no time. A General election is looming.

All in all, so sad to see that this is the calibre of person at the top of government. What has happened to this country that no one smart wants to go anywhere politics.

Whatever else Labour may or may not be doing, under Burnham you've got that muddled.

If any PM will tax the billionaires, it's this one.

@NanFlanders yes I know. I already said. Low bar.

Agree 💯

I’ll never trust a Labour MP again after their devious, underhand coup against KS. It’s thanks to him 400 of them have got their jobs … and they repaid him by stabbing him in the back. AB has shown himself to be devious and untrustworthy. Don’t believe a word this man says! I’ve been a Labour voter all my adult life and now, aged 70, I feel betrayed by them.

It is all relative. Even after Brexit the UK does not exist in a vacuum. Two major wars, growing threats from Russia and other sources, climate change, etc - all are a drag on the worldwide economy and, specifically, the UK economy. Yet they are beyond British control. It is wrong to blame HMG, whatever party is in power.

Doing the best speaks for itself.

I am not muddled, I am just not an acolyte.

As for the billionaires, yes AB will show Norway and France what's what...

Doing the best speaks for itself.

Not when you are knowingly out of your depth.

What is your evidence?

Burnham has only been PM for three months. That isn’t enough time to do anything substantive.

@clavinova,

‘I think you are being a little coy about your previous source.’

What previous source? I have quoted multiple sources, none of which were the one you mentioned.

‘We have clearly diverged somewhat in services - financial services and AI for example, e.g. Jan 2026 - City pushes back against closer ties with EU.
https://www.cityam.com/city-pushes-back-against-closer-ties-with-eu/
We would lose regulatory sovereignty, have to accept free movement of people, make financial contributions... any possible gains may have limited impact on the UK's structural problems...‘

Well, yeah. We have reintroduced a bonus structure which allows earlier payments.

It is true that the EU overregulate, but we can’t sell into the EU unless we follow their regulations, which is a big handicap.

(And CityAM is not exactly an unbiased source).

You can say exactly the same about the right - conservative in-fighting, leader not wanting to upset the brexiteers and more right wing, constant leadership battles and years of failed policies (but with a history of cronyism).

We do need our own gas and oil supplies rather than buy them in. But the issue is that it will only make shell and BP even richer than they already are. It isnt likely to improve working folks energy bills or car running costs.

Manchester has TWO mayors? That's a bit greedy. And how do they work that? One's the boss of the centre of the city and one oversees the outer belt? I think I want to see the more detailed boundary map. This can't NOT cause bureaucratic nightmares.

But maybe we should do the same in London. Separate Khan's empire outside North and South Cicular. Who would be your nomination for the Mayor of Greater London.? One of my criteria would be that they have to have had proper jobs for 10 years so we'll need to finetooth those CV's.

He has had enough time to:
Whip up even more entitlement to money earned by other workers.
Reopen the Brexit debate, despite saying the opposite during his campaign in Makerfield.
Leave businesses guessing about his plans, undermining their ability to plan with confidence. Many will have put hiring and other decisions on hold or directed investment elsewhere.
Stoke even more vitriol between the North and the South.
Poke his nose into the Man City scandal.
Propose scrapping the triple lock while overstating what the savings will actually achieve.
Offer young people even more access to higher debt - of course with a punitive catch.

So I don’t agree that he hasn’t had enough time to do anything detrimental. Uncertainty is bad for people and business.

What previous source?

For this;
'We are expected to gain about 50-60% of what we lost by regaining the single market and 80-90% if we rejoin the EU.'

(And CityAM is not exactly an unbiased source)

In that case, neither is Goldman Sachs - Goldman Sachs donated at least £500,000 to the remain campaign.

Well, yeah. We have reintroduced a bonus structure which allows earlier payments.

Not just bonus payments;

Concerns have also been raised that submitting to EU rules on financial services could see Brussels steer its regulatory framework in a direction that could be harmful to London...

Mats Persson, macro strategy leader at EY-Parthenon, told the Financial Times companies “are seeing the benefits of the UK’s ability to regulate in a nimble and innovative way, particularly in relation to emerging technology and access to global markets”.

I don't think you're an acolyte. You need loyalty to a cause for that.

Not sure what Norway and France have to do with potential domestic policy, or why you feel that will show them?

Bizarre thing to write.

Norway, and France: Billionaires, wealth taxes and capital flight. Norway is more recent.

How has Burnham whipped up entitlement? He is likely to get rid of the triple lock and channel welfare payments for NEETs into training.

I addressed Brexit above.

The budget is imminent and will give clarity. Three months is not a long period of uncertainty in these very difficult international times, beyond any PM’s control.

To say he is ‘stoking vitriol’ is a very biased way of describing the devolution experiment. The country is in desperate need of levelling up and nothing else has worked.

I agree with you about the Man City scandal.

What is your evidence for saying that Burnham is overstating the consequences of dispensing with the triple lock?

In what way is he offering young people even more access ro higher debt, with a punitive catch? He is proposing to reform Student Loans to make the conditions more favourable to those who take them out. This is a major help to young people.

He is doing pretty well for someone in office only three months.

I don’t think you could be anymore unreasonable. Am too tired to argue with you but just wanted to say that I think your post is ridiculous.

All Governments are in power to serve their friends in the Worldwide Elites. And their own vested interests. Not the best interests of the country.

Always has been and always will be.

Greater Manchester is a conurbation that consists of the local authorities that actually surround the City of Manchester with a population of around 3 million people. Ten in total.

Mr Burnham was very pally with Sheikh Mansoor and his band of merry men when he was Mayor of Greater Manchester.

You know re the billions of pounds that Mansoor owned companies that went into Man City, development of Eastlands and places like the Coop live music building.

This is where all Burnhams plans for Devolution and Regional Economies and Investment came from.

Just another Politician out for himself as far as I'm concerned.

He has plenty of time to piss about with his ‘man of the people’ schtick. Giving vacuous interviews and appearing on gogglebox. Just not enough time to do prime ministerial stuff. It’s all about the vibes innit.

This scandal is yet to pick up pace. It will very likely become toxic for him and could be his downfall.

He’s as thick as mince!

What a shower we have atm in the top echelons of society. These people are supposed to be the best we have, to lead the country in our time of need.
To show courage and leadership. Hah.

It’s so so sad that we’ve come to this.

The revolution is going to be very painful and sadly it’s always the poorest who suffer most.

If the IMF have to bail us out there’ll be NO quibbling about who gets benefits, what, how much and when. We’ll be told.
There’ll be cuts all round.
People should watch Liam Halligan, Kathryn Porter and educate themselves about the state of our finances and perilous energy supply.

And yet Gordon Brown made the BoE independent four days after taking office.

Michael Gove introduced his education reforms almost immediately after taking office and had a bill going through Parliament within weeks.

Apparently, Andy Burnham had been plotting his moves for around a year. Plenty of time to draft legislation that was ready to go.

The reality is that he’s got very few options hence bus fares (which we all seem to have forgotten were £2 under the Tories until Reeves increased them) and meaningless reductions on energy bills.

The Budget is being trailed as ‘not a significant fiscal event’, we have to wait until next year’s spending review for that. Most of his main announcements thus far are for after the next general election. Why are we accepting of that? He’s PM right now.

Burnham strikes me as mercurial as ever. His speech about ending neoliberalism is disingenuous at best when Manchester’s recent economic boom has been entirely engineered using neoliberal policies.

Peter Sellers last film 1979
Being There
The point of the film is to satirize how easily powerful people, the media, and society project their own desires, intelligence, and meaning onto someone who has none.

Key Themes and Points

• The Illusion of Wisdom:
• Peter Sellers plays Chance, an illiterate, naive gardener who knows nothing about the world except what he watches on television and tends to in the garden. When he is thrust into the real world, his simple, literal gardening statements
• ("like stimulate growth") are completely misinterpreted by wealthy elites and the President as profound economic and political philosophy.
• The Power of the Media: As users on www.reddit.com/r/TrueFilm/comments/p4vj5m/thoughts_on_being_there_1979/&ved=2ahUKEwiAtbadgNeXAxVldUEAHYoODXYQy_kOeggIAAgBCBsQAg&opi=89978449&cd&psig=AOvVaw0eCJyyHjmIXVkAJ8xLUna7&ust=1793080689010000" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Reddit note in a discussion of the film's media commentary, Chance mimics the opinions, mannerisms, and soundbites he sees on television, mirroring how modern public discourse and political figures often recycle superficial media projections
• The Fool as a Mirror: Rather than laughing at Chance, the film laughs at the rest of the world. It exposes the vanity, insecurity, and emptiness of the establishment, which desperately looks for guidance from an empty vessel.
• The Ambiguous Ending: The movie concludes with an enigmatic image of Chance walking on or near water in a snow-covered estate, reinforcing his role as a natural, unblemished, and mysterious force untouched by human greed or ego.

I think you are being extremely unreasonable and underestimate him. Please read his book, Head North, written with Steve Rotherham. You may change your mind. He is a very genuine, decent man who wants to make like better for working people. What he did for the Hillsborough families is incredible. He's gives a percentage of his salary to worthy causes in his constituency. At the moment he is tied to the Labour manifesto from the last election and is unable to deviate from that too much. He has years of experience at the top level of government and left because everything was Westminster centric. Having taken time out from that he sees things in a different way. Give him time! Would you prefer Reform? Take a look at the ITV documentary from last week - again you may see things differently!

The Labour manifesto promised to build 1.5 million new homes in this parliament. There’s been very little mention of that.

The country desperately needs a PM for right now, not after the next general election.

If he is so hamstrung by the 2024 manifesto he should call a general election. If he isn’t hamstrung, he should get on with the job of governing now. Not talking about things that will happen in 2030 and opening up conversations about Brexit which will leave very little time for discussion about anything else. Although I have to say, it’s clear why he’s doing this and it’s to distract from the fact he has very little room for movement right now in 2026.

@JimBobsWife ,

‘If he is so hamstrung by the 2024 manifesto he should call a general election. If he isn’t hamstrung, he should get on with the job of governing now. Not talking about things that will happen in 2030 and opening up conversations about Brexit which will leave very little time for discussion about anything else. Although I have to say, it’s clear why he’s doing this and it’s to distract from the fact he has very little room for movement right now in 2026.’

That’s a tough dilemma, to be honest. You are right that he needs a mandate and to get on with things. OTOH, an election campaign is, in itself, a massive distraction, and he would be unlikely to win a clear mandate even were he to call one.

So, he is probably best doing the small fixes and putting in place a structure where he can enact real change if he wins the next election.

Democracy, while by far the best of available options, still has many flaws. However, that is not Burnham’s fault.