AIBU to not forgive my mother?

[LightDuvet]

Mum divorced my father when I was 10, she left the family home, bought a new house, started a new life.

Dad was a cold, uncaring man and ensured he had full custody just to be in control. I didn't see her for 2 years.

With an absent mother and cold father, I started running away, then one day when I was 13 dad dropped me off at my mother's. Never saw him again.

Things were strained with my mum, we have very different personalities and she is incredibly particular about things (suspect autism) she has an awful temper and arguments would escalate into being really heated, horrible - in anger, she'd say I was fat, I was posessed by evil, and I had to wedge myself against my bedroom door to stop her coming in to slap me.

Then aged 14 I was groomed and assulted by a predator. He showed me care, kindness, attention and obviously saw I was vulnerable and could manipulate me.

After the assult, I shrank into myself. I gained weight, and stopped going to school. It was an awful few years.

Fast forward 30 years! I have a wonderful husband, fantastic career, lovely friends and a content life.

Mum desperately wants a close mother-daughter relationship now. She has apologised for the past and realises I needed love and not her anger. She is not maternal, she should have never had kids really.

I want to move past it but I can't forgive her or forget those years of hell, and the scars. I have been seeing a lovely therapist who has helped but this feels so deep.

Has anyone got any advice?

It’s hard to know what one would do, but I’d like to think I would forgive her. She has clearly had a very very hard life, any ND person born when she did had zero help, zero accommodations. She was also vulnerable like you were, and then went on to be abused, like you were, but she was born in a time when women had no choice but to marry. So she married her abuser. Obviously how she treated you was appalling, but she has never had it easy.

@LightDuvet
I think that “forgiveness” and “a loving relationship” are not the same thing.
Through understanding, I feel that forgiveness is a good outcome in that it will help you both, however a loving relationship is something else entirely and that seems a bit optimistic in the circumstances.

I think that although your mother was very sub par, unless you believe she got pleasure out of seeing you unhappy, and therefore has a serious and dangerous mental condition, I feel that she was simply not equipped to be a parent of her time in the context of your family.
This inability to cope, was not something your mother asked for or could have necessarily predicted. You may or may not know enough about her life to give you some answers as to why this might have been, but often things make sense once you have more information.

Put yourself first, as you are already on edge around her it sounds like improving the relationship with her is not possible/no benefit to you.

Her being lonely is not your problem and if she cant accept low/no contact it shows her apology is not genuine and she just wants you to support her in old age.

ETA if you choose to, moving past it without forgiving her may be an option. You can accept an apology and start a relationship now as adults, this does not mean you accept or forgive her behaviour until now. But only if you would like that, you have no obligation to have any relationship with her.

@LightDuvet I think her wanting a close relationship is pushing it. However, you could be civil, keep her in the loop but also keep her at arms length all at the same time. This will give her partly what she wants but doesn’t cross your boundaries. It will enable you to just stop thinking ‘should I, shouldn’t I, which could eat you up’.

I’m sorry your parents let you down and I’m delighted life came good for you in the end.

Take control of the situation on your terms.

Ask yourself why would you need for the pain to dissipate?
can you imagine being able to achieve what you need ?
Similarly to you, parent was not able to be a nurturing person. I cannot accept what she has to offer, what I need and what she is capable of, are too far apart.

OP, you were abused and abandoned by both of your parents. That you have gone on to have stable and loving relationships with your husband and your friends is truly wonderful. We only get one life and you have succeeded in creating a contented one against the odds. If having contact with her makes you feel anxious, guilty, angry, scared then she is encroaching on this precious life that you have built for yourself. Listen to your feelings, listen to your body, let that be the guide of where your boundaries with her lie. Don't do anything you feel uncomforable with. Know that you are free to do what works for you. You don't owe her anything.

No advice but sympathy.

Suspect my own mother is also autistic- its not easy.
On the one hand they expect the mother daughter relationship, on the other hand they haven't put the hard work in during the early years.
Do you feel she's wanting this now as she is getting elderly/ expecting care or maybe not full on care but support?

Anyhow you've done amazingly despite it all op xx

I think i could recognise her as a flawed person who made choices she shouldn't have. I'd find it easier to do that if I could explain her behaviour (eg poor mental health, her own traumatic childhood etc). I think I could try to understand her. I'd make that effort for myself, to try to lessen my own pain. I wouldn't feel that I owed her anything.
I don't think I could forgive her
I don't think I'd want any sort of relationship with her

You owe your mother nothing. Carry on with therapy.

I'll never forgive or see my mother again. She chose money and men over me, and then only wanted me when it looked good for her and later when I was married and she thought I'd married money. In the same sentence she said she loved me then completed bitched about me. No thanks. It's literally decades since I last saw her and I didn't live with her since about two.

I had an extremely abusive parent whom I didn’t see for 20 years after leaving home. They did make some moves to make contact during that time but , like you, I didn’t feel able to respond to this.
When my oldest child was about ten I did start to occasionally see them because my other parent was upset at the situation but I didn’t enjoy it at all.
As they became frail , I reluctantly decided to be involved in visits and ended up being the only visitor at the end of their life. Just before they died my parent made something like a hint of an apology, which meant a great deal to me.
They died some years ago.
Two things: firstly, in retrospect I feel much more at peace with the fact I did the decent thing, even tough it wasn’t easy.
Secondly, people do change as they get older and their circumstances change. My parent did genuinely regret what happened and there would have been more of a reconciliation if my SIL hadn’t done everything she could to prolong the hostility and try to keep me out of the inheritance.
I would say, it’s good to be the better person and forgive whatever you can as and when you’re able to forgive. I felt much better for it.

Yanbu, you do not owe your mother anything (not even a mothers day card) because she did not mother you. It is good you got a genuine apology, but do not let her weaponise that into you feeling guilty and submitting to the closer relationship with her that she wants, but you do not.

You trusted her with your heart and love as a child and she stomped on your heart and responded to your love with violence and anger. You cannot trust your heart to her a second time.

You will need to stay strong as people will judge you for not being close to your mother and see the distance as you being a cold and ungrateful daughter. Your mother will likely fuel those assumptions with her own victimhood narrative. Abuse by mothers is almost taboo but it exists and your mother abused you terribly.

I would keep her at arms length. It’s too late to fix it. She should have tried long ago. Not your problem to fix.

It's great that she apologised - that is a big and important step.

It sounds like you love her and care for her but you don't trust her, which is totally understandable.

As others have said, there's a huge difference between forgiveness and close relationship. One thing to be very wary of is that abusive parents make their children take on responsibilty for how they feel. Abused children tend to twist themselves in knots trying to please the abusive parent, trying to avoid backlash and pain. It's a defence mechanism that you must avoid getting pulled into at all costs.

She has no right to demand anything of you. She has absolutely no right to expect you to forget everything that happened and act like everything is ok - that would make her feel better, of course, but it would put you back in the position of being a person whose needs and feelings just do not count.

That said, I think it's worth considering what kind of person you want to be and what you want to see when you look back on your life. My approach is - you can be horrible to me, but I won't let you make me into a horrible person. I will always be the person I want to be - kind, supportive, generous - without being a doormat.

One thing to consider is having a relationship with her but entirely on your terms. By that I mean, you see her exactly as much as you want, you don't give into any guilting or emotional blackmail and you walk away when it is no longer serving you. I know from experience that doing this can be extremely liberating, as it returns control to you in a situation where you previously had none. It takes quite a lot of energy and emotional strength though, so do seek support if you do it. Resetting a relationship with a very rigid and unhealthy dynamic is hard and doesn't always work.

If you don’t want to forgive her don’t.

I am 41, I haven’t spoken to my “sperm donor” for 20 years. Pretty much to the day actually. Not for any of the reasons you have said. He was very absent, saw us only when it suited him. I was always waiting for him. I found out later he abused my mum very seriously. Held her hostage over night with sh0tgun. Beaten her. Chased her up the stairs whilst pregnant with my sister and punched her on the back of the head, the through me in the bed. (I was about 14 months old)
He has never tried to make amends or even try to talk to me to ask why I stopped speaking to him.

If he came to me now begging forgiveness I would say no and think no more of it.

So it all depends on what you want. Do you want a better with your mum? If so would you do family counselling maybe? I don’t know if it would help. But if your answer is, I don’t want any more of a relationship that what you have with her, then that’s your answer.

I think what the OP has said here is really important:

"she isn't someone who I would be friends with, or want to spend time with - yet I feel an immense guilt at keeping her at arm's length knowing she is desperately wanting a closer relationship with me.
I am so on edge around her, even now."

Not wanting to have more contact would never mean the OP was a horrible person. There is no need to think in terms of being "the better person", being kind, future peace of mind in case she gets hit by a bus etc. Children raised in this kind of situation - not least one in which they are called evil - are already groomed to be riddled with internalised guilt and shame. It is not at all surprising that the OP feels guilt about keeping her mother at arm's length. Before deciding anything, the first step is to cotinue therapy and work on the fear, obligation, guilt. When you reach a stage when you can accept without much feeling that there is no obligation to do anything, that there is nothing to be scared of if you decide to never speak to her ever again, that whatever you choose does not make you a "better" or "worse" person, then you will be able to actually decide what, if anything, you want from having contact with her.

She doesn't want to make amends, she just doesn't want to die alone.

You reap what you sow, you owe her nothing.

You do not owe her a goddamn thing!

I'm angry for you that she should dare to try to have the relationship you needed as a child that she withheld, only when it serves her interests. It's breathtakingly selfish!

Supporting an elderly parent is hard work. There is no way I would do it for someone who had treated me like this!

I’m so sorry OP that you went through all this.

You do not need to forgive your mother at all.

Some counselling may help you sort your feelings towards her and her attempts to apologise though.

For myself, knowing I was the "better person" freed me from feelings of guilt and enhanced my self esteem, knowing I had made the very best of the situation that I was dealt.
I'm not saying that OP 'should' follow this path. I'm simply relating my very relevant experience.
I'm not particularly pleased that someone else should dismiss my contribution by saying theres no need to think in terms of being "the better person", There is no need for OP to follow any of the advice given here. On the other hand I would prefer my experience to be respected.
I certainly disagree that nothing one does/does not do makes one a better/worse person. For me, it's all about knowing that I hold myself to a higher standard.

Hey @SixtySomething "be the better person" is a completely standard phrase used by people in these types of situations when people are encouraging people who are LC/NC with abusive family members to forgive/understand/be kind. I hadn’t consciously noticed that this was a phrase you had used at the bottom of your post, my post was not directed at you or your personal testimony. You are certainly not alone here in expressing the idea that it’s better to forgive. I’m expressing the idea that moral high ground, standards, peace of mind should she die, be kind etc. are guilt talk. If you found that leaning into that guilt helped you to alleviate it, sincerely, good for you. Nobody is dismissing your opinion or experience. My point is that many other people endure painful contact due to the guilt, so as not to feel like a bad person, despite it having an adverse affect on the quality of their adult life. There’s no need to think of it in these terms; properly dismantling the misplaced guilt and unjustified sense of obligation can liberate a person to decide for themselves what it is that they actually want rather than erroneously worrying about whether their ability to endure painful contact or not makes them a good or bad person.

It's possible to forge a new relationship without forgiveness of the past or just 'forgetting' what you went through. I too had a difficult childhood and a mother who often made decisions that were not in the best interests of her children. As an adult I can understand why she was like that without necessarily 'forgiving' her.

For you, I think you have answered your own question. You are on edge around her, you know you could not treat someone (less alone your child), the way she did you. You feel resentment, pain and hurt and can't let that go (which is entirely understandable). What holds you back right now is the guilt. And that makes you a nice person because you have empathy and feel sorry for her even if she doesn't deserve it. But guilt is not the basis of a meaningful relationship and you are right, her regretting her past decisions and actions doesn't mean you have to let her rewrite your past or minimise your trauma.

I'd say you have two choices:

1. accept her as she is now and have a relationship on your terms that acknowledges the past whilst focusing on the present. Set up the levels and type of contact that you feel comfortable with (that could mean very low contact, for example seeing her once a year or only sending birthday and Christmas cards), it doesn't have to be whatever she wants to define as 'close', this is about what you can handle.
   OR
2. decide your peace means absolutely no contact and let go of any guilt around that, just focus on your own family and happiness and drop all contact.

FWIW I went with option 1) with VLC as it worked for me, but my siblings chose different variations, including no contact for one of them.

You deserve to feel safe and with your mum in your life, feeling safe is impossible.

You owe her nothing. You had an utterly horrific childhood and you were let down by both your parents.

She is still trying to manipulate you by telling you that she is lonely. Even if she had given you a lovely childhood, you still wouldn't need to see her if you didn't want to. As your childhood was the absolute opposite of lovely, you should cut her off with no guilt or regrets. You deserve the live the lovely life that you have with your husband and friends. You certainly don't need an abusive millstone around your neck.

Thanks for taking the trouble to reply. 🙂
I do agree it’s important to for everyone to do what’s right for them and not be swayed by other people or pressure.
From my personal experience, what’s often underplayed on these threads is that, wrong as it is, abuse is often driven by mental illness or other difficulties. As the abusive parent gets older and life gets simpler, they genuinely do change because they’re no longer in that situation where the abuse arose. The adult child has been lacking that parental relationship so if some kind of workable relationship can be developed, IMO that’s the preferred solution.
But each to their own, of course!

My relationship with my mother was difficult. Bad childhood etc. I forgave her for my peace. I didnt want a relationship with her.
It sounds like you don't want a relationship. You've no need to feel guilty about it.

Exactly this.
My enabling father to my abusive mother now wants to see me more since she died. Never really saw him whilst she was alive. Funny that.
I can’t forgive, but that’s me. They don’t get to dictate now it suits them.