To be worried about filthy childminders house?

[tennispros]

Signed up in the summer and all seemed fine. Today had a settling in session and was really shocked at the state of the house. Not just kids mess but tbh really dirty

I don’t really have a choice re childcare and she’s only there a couple of hours a day so part of me thinks leave it another part thinks I’m being really neglectful sending her there!

Does it remind you of a soft play or doctors surgery that has toys out for kids that have clearly never been cleaned since they got there 5 years ago? Plastic toys where all the seams have dirt in them and they are just generally grotty and you don’t even want to touch them yourselves, let alone let your kid as you know they probably have hand foot and mouth waiting to be picked up?

If so, I get where you are coming from, and I’m still of the same opinion I wouldn’t be leaving my child there. I can’t stand filthy toys.

A bit like that @Bookbears

And the kitchen wasn’t ’spotlessly clean kitchen with a couple of used plates that haven’t been put in the dishwasher’ it was ‘filthy kitchen with dirty plates left around’ but I seem to have had my arse handed to me a bit on that!

The problem with what you say is well, what else would you do? There aren’t any other childminders. And I can’t just quit work! So for two hours twice a week …

All the issues you describe are essentially clutter and things not being tidy, but you use the words filthy, dirty, grotty, disgusting etc which are about cleanliness rather than clutter. I don't know why you can't describe the dirt or why it would be "outing" to do so. For example, you could say that the carpet had ingrained dirt beyond what a surface vacuuming would remove, the kitchen surfaces had built up crusted food waste which was brown, there was mould, hair, wee/poo on the bathroom floor, toilet, etc. There were muddy handprints on surfaces, doors and door handles had built up grime from being handled, and so on. None of that is "outing" and would be clearer for people to understand.

If the house was free from clutter, would it still need a deep clean, rather than a once over, for example?

😱 the horror that there was dirty plates in the sink 😳. Thank god im not a childminder, id be sacked on the first day after they looked into my teenage boys room and seen manky socks 🤮 possibly 2 weeks old kfc bones and boxers stuck to the floor.🤢🤮. No joke.

I don't get why it's hard to explain.
For me filthy would be dirty floors, cobwebs everywhere, spilled food and drinks on floors and furniture, pet mess on floors, dirty nappies etc.

A few dishes waiting to be washed I wouldn't class as dirty let alone filthy

Do you have any nurseries nearby that do wraparound care? We have two near us that will take kids before and after school on a day by day basis. It might be worth asking around as i wasn’t aware until I attended a school open day for my son but they said you didn’t need to be of school age, they would take younger children as well for emergencies or regular arrangements like yours.

Hi OP

I don’t think you’ve had your arse handed to you. I think there’s a mismatch between the words that you use and the meaning that they have.

And when people are pushing you for more information - not through nosiness but to better answer the question you posed, you keep snipping at them eg ‘I do know what a childminder is’

For the avoidance of doubt, of course you should take your child out of a filthy setting. It is your responsibility and you would kick yourself if something went wrong.

bur kindly I’d suggest you interrogate your own choice of language. When you say ‘filthy/dirty’ is it your own internal shorthand. Do you mean messy? Do you mean run-down and unloved decor? Do you mean stained? Eg my own living room carpet is stained to fuck from years of spills and wine and coffee. It’s not dirty. It gets a daily vacuum and a regular vax. But I suppose you might describe it as filthy if you had that as a shorthand for ‘badly stained and a bit unloved’

This sounds snippy in return - I promise I’m not trying to be. But your vocabulary means something specific and you aren’t backing it up with examples.

Yes this exactly

@SilenceInside i guess I feel it’s going a bit like this (I’m not being a dick but)

’the house was dirty’
‘give an example’
‘dirt’
’we want more examples’
’dirt!’

I am unsure whether people don’t understand or if they are kind of pretending not to … (not meaning you specifically there) but I do think people know what you mean, like if you go to a house where the people are quite elderly and haven’t been able to clean it very thoroughly for some time, a general slightly grimy sort of feeling. I have said the kitchen was filthy, and it was. The lounge was a complete mess but not as bad. I would of course expect some mess but I was surprised it was as chaotic as it was. But … I don’t really have a choice here.

There were a couple of quite big things that I am going to politely raise but I haven’t gone into those details in case the CM is on MN!

If it’s that much of a state and she knew you were coming inside I’d worry what it’s like usually! No way would I send my child to a filthy place, lived in and a bit dated yes but not filthy!

Op I’ve just read your update and I still don’t understand. I am not trying to be obnoxious. Dirt is quantifiable. Dirt isn’t just dirt.

eg if I’m thinking about my own house, here’s all the imperfections I can think about

1. carpet stains as above
2. pencil on the wall that won’t come off
3. chipped skirting boards
4. dust on the bookshelves

only one of those is dirt

@MayWelland its not snippy at all, I just don’t really know how else to describe a filthy kitchen. It was definitely a run down and not ideal setting but I am limited in options so I suspect I’ll have to muddle through for the short term.

Ok well good luck with it, I hope you find what you need

If I was describing a filthy kitchen I might say 'the floor was sticky and dirty' 'there was old food in the sink' 'the work surfaces looked like they hadn't been wiped in a long time'.

It's difficult to answer your question on whether you should be worried as you say filthy, but describe a bit of mess - if it really is filthy then yes you should be worried and shouldn't send your child there.
If it is so filthy that it's hazardous you should really be reporting to Ofsted or Environmental Health if she serves food.

@MayWelland that’s OK, if you don’t understand, we’re obviously just not understanding one another very well.

I have said the kitchen was filthy, plates with food left everywhere, stuff on the floor and sides that didn’t belong there, cluttered, no space clean because you can’t get to it to clean, I can’t really add more detail and I don’t think you’re being obnoxious but I’m not sure this exchange is getting us anywhere either tbh.

Dirty to me would be sticky crusty bits on sofas, tables and floors, unhoovered floors, pet hair on rugs and furniture, clumps of dust and hair in corners and under furniture. More dishes in the sink than a days worth. Spilt food on counters, heavy grease on kitchen tiles, dirty toilets. Because these things spread germs.
Fingers marks on windows, old stains, clutter, a sink of washing up, past its best paintwork and general scruffiness wouldn't bother me.

@tennispros I gave examples of how you could be specific....

The conversation went more like

’the house was dirty’
‘give an example’
‘there were dishes left around"
’That's not related to "dirty", we would like an example of what was dirty and how dirty it was’
’it was a bit messy’

Essentially, giving examples that aren't to do with dirt, or using another word that means the same without actually giving a specific example, as per my list of examples and those of other posters.

Regardless, if it is genuinely filthy, disgusting, grotty and all those other words you used, then of course you can't leave your child there and you should report to OFSTED. You may need to use annual leave or other kinds of leave to manage in the short term whilst you work out another plan.

YANBU
I wouldn’t have sent my DC to a filthy house.

It shows laziness and a lack of awareness imo.

Surely if you’re a childminder you would be aware parents don’t want their children playing in filth catching god knows what.

Toys everywhere is fine. Playing outside and getting muddy is fine.

If the issue is the presence of non-house-trained cats or dogs, I think that really is a red flag issue, as that would be a genuine health hazard, in contrast to (say) a slightly grimey looking skirting board, which is not realistically going to do an average 3-year-old any harm.

Lol at folk falling over themselves to determine if their own homes are a hovel or just a bit 'cluttered'.

OP, you have more than adequately described a dirty home. Not one that has a day of dirty dishes but is otherwise obviously clean.

I am sure your eyes and senses can work out the difference between the 2.

I personally couldn't leave my dc in a dirty house. I imagine that there are levels of grime and filth you aren't aware of if the kitchen and spaces open to you, looked like you describe.

Unhelpfully, not entirely sure what to suggest if you are stuck and have no other choice. Feed her up before you take her, with a note saying 'don't feed'. In the meantime look for alternatives as what you describe isn't a rogue day of domestic disarray.

I don't really understand what you want from the thread?

You're the only one who has seen the house so you're the only one who can make a judgement. Clearly the level of cleanliness isn't acceptable to you (so it doesn't really matter what the rest of us think), therefore surely you can't be happy to leave your child there?

Are you happy for your child to use the loo, have a drink of water, play with the toys etc in somewhere you describe as filthy? Would you be happy to have a glass of water, use the loo there? If not you cannot use this childminder. Even if it is only for a couple of hours - what happens if you get caught late at work for example, are you happy for your child to eat tea from the 'filthy' kitchen?

You keep saying there's no other option, in which case why bother with the thread? Presumably she's not the only childminder in your area?

OP, I am wondering whether the presence of pets in the home, combined with a lack of fastidious hygiene standards, is what is making you concerned. Might be helpful to clarify that.

To be fair @Aethelredtheunsteady probably nothing really, insofar as I don’t think I exactly had a specific motivation for starting it. I was really just sharing my thoughts and worries with a wider audience. She is the only childminder so I don’t have any other option, unfortunately.

Thanks @FreddoEspresso . I genuinely appreciate your response there!

@SilenceInside i guess it’s a bit like the other poster, there does come a point where we both have to kind of say ‘this isn’t helping anybody!’

You didnt say any of that at the start. The only thign you started talking about was dishes. Then the dishes moved out into the other rooms

Then you mentioned toys every where and turned into bric a brac

Then you've moved to lots of food on the floor, the surfaces etc, this wasnt what you said

I feel like I’m on trial at the crown court with this post 😂