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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

AIBU to want spending cuts rather than more tax rises?

333 replies

PinkFruitbat · Today 10:07

The foundations are being laid for more tax rises in the October Budget.

https://www.ft.com/content/6d43b599-3d7c-471c-88c2-0f056475a840?syn-25a6b1a6=1

AIBU to ask for savings in spending to help balance the budget rather than more taxes.

With welfare spending at nearly £1bn each day, when is enough, enough?

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Boomer55 · Today 16:15

PinkFruitbat · Today 10:07

The foundations are being laid for more tax rises in the October Budget.

https://www.ft.com/content/6d43b599-3d7c-471c-88c2-0f056475a840?syn-25a6b1a6=1

AIBU to ask for savings in spending to help balance the budget rather than more taxes.

With welfare spending at nearly £1bn each day, when is enough, enough?

Ideally, the NHS, education, and welfare need root and branch reform.

It won’t happen though. 🙄

PinkFruitbat · Today 16:16

Velumental · Today 16:14

I don't believe that for a second.

why would I make that up?

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LathkillDale · Today 16:18

PinkFruitbat · Today 10:40

Complete cut to foreign aid.

25% cut to the civil service.

25% cut to all welfare.

Reinstate a child benefit cap (3 children).

Mandatory in person PiP review for all claimants.

Scrap triple lock, winter fuel allowance, free TV licence, free bus passes for the elderly.

Motability only for UK manufactured cars, basic models only.

Cut House of Lords down from 1000 to say 200.

DD1 has a congenital brain abnormality, causing severe epilepsy and complex learning disability/learning difficulties. She functions at about the age of an 18 month old with dementia.

There is no known cure for brain abnormality nor epilepsy.

What do you think is the point of face to face PIP assessments?

PinkFruitbat · Today 16:18

TigerRag · Today 16:15

But you can claim pip and work

Which is why PIP needs to be reviewed to consider if it is still appropriate for all payees.

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Badbadbunny · Today 16:19

Velumental · Today 16:14

But his cancer prognosis? Was it the only available treatment remaining to prolong life?

No, he's still on first line treatment and has responded well to the maintenance chemotherapy drugs, with his "markers" very low. Lots more options when his markers start to increase. The infusion he was wrongly given for 8 years is alongside the other treatment lines.

EasternStandard · Today 16:20

Velumental · Today 16:11

I would be very surprised if someone could suggest such economic policy changes if they had any education beyond bare minimum GCSEs

You don’t know that.

PinkFruitbat · Today 16:20

LathkillDale · Today 16:18

DD1 has a congenital brain abnormality, causing severe epilepsy and complex learning disability/learning difficulties. She functions at about the age of an 18 month old with dementia.

There is no known cure for brain abnormality nor epilepsy.

What do you think is the point of face to face PIP assessments?

Because the online assessments have introduced a huge amount of fraud, and the only way to be sure is to re-do all the assessments.

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TigerRag · Today 16:21

PinkFruitbat · Today 16:20

Because the online assessments have introduced a huge amount of fraud, and the only way to be sure is to re-do all the assessments.

What "huge amount of fraud"? There's virtually no fraud according to DWPs own stats. Assessor fraud however is rife

Reluctantlyonhols · Today 16:22

B1anche · Today 10:34

Everything has been cut to the bone, which is why everyone struggles to get doctors appointments, can wait hours for an ambulance or to be seen in A and E, and the police won't come out. I would much rather pay more tax and see an improvement in our services.

It wouldn't improve the service because it is all so dysfunctional. It's all going into a black hole for no real gain.

Badbadbunny · Today 16:23

Reluctantlyonhols · Today 16:22

It wouldn't improve the service because it is all so dysfunctional. It's all going into a black hole for no real gain.

Nail on the head. Radical reform of the NHS is needed. Otherwise any more money just perpetuates the leaky bucket.

Goota · Today 16:24

UnpopularOpinionsIWouldUsuallyKeepToMyself · Today 15:29

‘Avoidance’ isn’t illegal. Evasion is.
What specifically are you referring to here?

I got the words the wrong way round. Thanks for correcting me.

Reluctantlyonhols · Today 16:24

LathkillDale · Today 16:18

DD1 has a congenital brain abnormality, causing severe epilepsy and complex learning disability/learning difficulties. She functions at about the age of an 18 month old with dementia.

There is no known cure for brain abnormality nor epilepsy.

What do you think is the point of face to face PIP assessments?

Similar to my late sister. Obviously no one begrudges the state helping in this type of case.

5128gap · Today 16:25

PinkFruitbat · Today 12:39

Well across Central and Local Government I would suggest scrapping most:

Interpreters (English, Welsh, Scots Gaelic are our official languages)

Diversity and Inclusion Specialists

Social Media Managers

Administrators and HR (from experience these roles simply invent productivity inhibiting process and rules)

Scrap HR and administration roles and you end up with higher level essential post holders wasting time on HR and administration. I don't know about you, but I'd rather checking rotas, ordering supplies, sifting through post, signing off staff annual leave and calling the maintenance guy because the ladies is blocked again wasn't taking essential and expert staff away from the essential business of implementing the running of the country.
Not to mention I don't want to pay the salaries these roles command, for work not conversent with the pay.

emuloc · Today 16:25

PinkFruitbat · Today 16:20

Because the online assessments have introduced a huge amount of fraud, and the only way to be sure is to re-do all the assessments.

It does not matter what a person puts on their form, if they are unable to back it up without medical proof. So online, over the phone etc, makes no difference to the outcome, if unable to provide medical evidence.

Coconutter24 · Today 16:25

lippylip · Today 14:57

@Coconutter24 my parents bought their 1.2m house for 50k. If I inherited when they die how have I or them paid tax on that already?

Edited

There will be tax paid once you inherit it.
What did I write to prompt that question?

PinkFruitbat · Today 16:29

5128gap · Today 16:25

Scrap HR and administration roles and you end up with higher level essential post holders wasting time on HR and administration. I don't know about you, but I'd rather checking rotas, ordering supplies, sifting through post, signing off staff annual leave and calling the maintenance guy because the ladies is blocked again wasn't taking essential and expert staff away from the essential business of implementing the running of the country.
Not to mention I don't want to pay the salaries these roles command, for work not conversent with the pay.

From what I have seen there is far more admin and HR per technical/delivery staff than in private business. And yet private business is far more productive. Maybe it’s the quality of staff, or maybe it is just less admin. (Probably a bit of both).

AIBU to want spending cuts rather than more tax rises?
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Goota · Today 16:41

lazyarse123 · Today 15:40

Shall I go back in time and tell my dh not to get ill and unable to claim benefits so that I had to get 4 part time jobs with 3 teens to pay for? Where exactly was i getting the money to save?
This is what I mean when everyone is generalising. Sometimes shit happens and we deal with it the best way we can. We've never lived on benefits so at least I can't be blamed for that.

Why not 1 full time "proper job"? With an occupational pension scheme?

User134098 · Today 16:42

PinkFruitbat · Today 15:21

Admin I have mostly seen from an MOD procurement perspective. Inventing new forms and process to slow, delay, obfuscate. These are not front line operators, but back room paper/electronic form pushers.

Interpreters, yes thar’s more local government.

I’m not going to spend all day undertaking a forensic analysis of where bloat might be cut from government. But I have given some examples.

we are going to have to disagree about HR!

You don't have to undertake a forensic analysis, you just need to provide a coherent explanation as to where you think we would cut the Civil Service by 25% without impacting delivery. The examples don't stack up. At the moment it reads like you're fed up with MOD procurement so we should cut the Civil Service by 25%.

5128gap · Today 16:45

PinkFruitbat · Today 16:29

From what I have seen there is far more admin and HR per technical/delivery staff than in private business. And yet private business is far more productive. Maybe it’s the quality of staff, or maybe it is just less admin. (Probably a bit of both).

Well as its purpose is administration, rather than say, construction or whatever, I suppose that's to be expected. You're probably right that roles need reviewing. But it makes more sense to start at the top end with the more expensive roles than with the cheaper ones. The higher you get the more opportunity you have to create an easy life for yourself while the real work is done by those lower down the hierarchy.
You also need to look at hidden costs of removing roles and whether it's false economy. For instance it may beccheaper to provide an interpreter so someone understands their responsibilities than deal with the aftermath of them not knowing what they should be doing.

LathkillDale · Today 16:45

PinkFruitbat · Today 16:20

Because the online assessments have introduced a huge amount of fraud, and the only way to be sure is to re-do all the assessments.

Not really. I submitted around 1,000 pages of professional reports last time. DD2 has two lifelong degenerative conditions. She’s one in five hundred and nineteen million. It took me all day just to photocopy the reports. If six consultant neurologists write along the lines of

“DD1 has the most severe epilepsy and enormous medical needs. A team of onsite nurses and local GP cannot meet her needs…she needs to be in a specialist epilepsy centre with onsite neurology…”

A clinical psychologist wrote:

”DD1 is virtually incapable of learning any new information….”

A speech and language therapist wrote

”DD1 can only process one key word in a sentence, usually the last word…”

Do you think the best consultant neurologists in the country are going to lie? There would have to be a massive conspiracy among 20 - 30 professionals, Social Services and the ICB, looking after her!

strawberrybubblegum · Today 16:47

Velumental · Today 16:10

And his cancer prognosis? Without the drug? Did it help his cancer at all?

Are you really suggesting that we should be grateful for the NHS which we pay £216.6billion each year for - which is 11.4% of the UK's entire GDP - everything we do and make - because it's better than nothing Confused

Seriously?!?

I mean, sure it's better than leeches and trepanation....

When did the bar get so low?

Noras · Today 16:54

My son faced numerous assessments throughout his entire life. He received social care to attend university and that is a far greater outlay than PIP. I am not sure what a face to face assessment can achieve with my son to assess his ASD/ complex needs. He is at university with PA support. He works hard and in his holidays he volunteers. He does not wish to be disabled. Frankly his pip is used to pay for the psychiatric support that he needs to overcome the mental issues he has from being disabled. As an example expressing a constant desire to die and delving deeper into the on screen world/ fantasy world. Unless an assessor is multi disciplined I wander how good they can be as they have to assess psychiatric, occupational health, language, memory, dexterity needs as well as general needs of autism. The reality is that the reason assessments are done on paper is that the paper carries far more information than a 40 minute snapshot. What would he more useful is a more encouraging environment for disabled people. Frankly I wish that they would create more communities for our neurodiverse adult kids with their own facilities where they could even have jobs in those communities overseen with support workers eg have their own shops, gyms, parks and houses or own communities. It’s a really really sad world for those more neurodiverse and sadness is very much prevalent at times. My son hates that I need to cut his food for him ( to prep food) he gets angry that he can’t open tin cans - he tries to do it an blood goes everywhere and then I get anxious. He hates himself for being scared to cross a main road. He feels humiliated. He is desperate to manage his own bowel issue and is having some success but hates that I manage his medication etc. He tries so hard to be more independent but can’t seem to organise anything eg he tried to meet a ‘friend’ ( us taking him ) and got the wrong day. He gets so confused with arr wife things. His PA gets him to the right place at the right time. Frankly I am not sure what a 40 minute assessment will achieve and frankly if that is required for our kids that need supportive living support ( most likel) then the law is an arse. As it is the pip questions are stupid any way. The only question is what happens if there is no suppprt as a base line. For my son he would not survive easily and could well become very ill , certainly ubkempt and probably end up wandering the streets confused or huddled up at home freaked out. There are a huge tranche of our kids who don’t need the constant assessments. As parents we spent thousands writing our wills with vulnerable persons trusts as this is not a situation that willl get better to the degree that he will not need support. Ina few years time I will have to do another pip assessment which seems crazy when social care pay thousands for his social care needs and are better placed to assess his needs as they liase with care services. It’s just added strain. What is a complete waste of tax money was me having gone back to work having to give it up as we argued over whether my son could have social care hours to eg access beyond just his lecture time at university etc or who would pay for his university trips ( a battle between the university and social care). The fact that parents have to give up work is a major issue. Before that I was staying at home to home school him de facto as they could not fit 2 PA into the class room and he had to share with someone not capable of getting GCSEs. So my son had no notes ( as he had no tech report done and could not write) I had to write his notes and teach him the many subjects. So get angry with the sheer incompetence of things. So many parents are trying their best. We know what our kids need eg supportive communities to exist in would en a start also job creation if appropriate and far better support at school. If you want cost savings the gov needs to invest more - that’s the reality.

TankFlyBossW4lk · Today 16:55

HollyhocksandPeons · Today 14:36

I have a suggestion - I would start from stripping council housing from foreign heads of state - Fatima Bio: Council takes possession of property linked to politician - BBC News

And go down the list - those who live abroad and rent privately their council housing, etc. etc.

Then no treatment on the NHS to foreigners - Dr Meiron Thomas raised objections to treating Spaniards at the Royal Marsden - they have a perfectly well functioning system in Spain. And then go down the list.

Regarding no treatment on the NHS:

Then this needs to be reciprocal. Spain won't treat you in return. Is that what you want?

I have seen lots and lots of UK people that get treated in the EU , say a biopsy and then expect the NHS to retrieve all their notes etc as they return from their holiday home/ extended stay. No effort on their part. Everything has to be done urgently of course.

Everyone one seems to think that everything is urgent and we need to be honest about things that simply shouldn't be prioritised.

Katypp · Today 16:57

My contribution to getting more money into the coffers would be

  1. Reinstating the two-child benefit cap
  2. Reinstating the NI cut made by the Tories just before the last election
  3. Getting rid of the triple lock
  4. Getting rid of free prescriptions once you turn 60
  5. Bring public sector pensions in line with private sector pensions. Yes, I KNOW they are not as generous as they used to be, but they are still way in excess of what most similar roles in the private sector get. Wages in the public sector (in lower-level jobs - executive jobs may be different) are similar if not better than the private sector now so the argument of compensation for lower wages is nonsense)
  6. While I'm on it, stop allowing public sector workers to access their pensions at 55
  7. Tax EVERONE once their income reaches a certain level, regardless of where the income comes from. Pensioners already pay tax if they breech the personal allowance, but why not UC claimants? PIP claimants?
  8. Any maintenance received must be deducted from the recipients UC payment. We can't afford to pay someone full UC then allow a top-up tax free.
  9. Get rid of the ability to work part-time and get a UC top-up
  10. Give serious thought to what should be available on the NHS. It needs a root-and-branch reform and people need to stop romanticising about how fabulous it (and its staff) are.

I think that's enough for now!

PinkFruitbat · Today 16:59

LathkillDale · Today 16:45

Not really. I submitted around 1,000 pages of professional reports last time. DD2 has two lifelong degenerative conditions. She’s one in five hundred and nineteen million. It took me all day just to photocopy the reports. If six consultant neurologists write along the lines of

“DD1 has the most severe epilepsy and enormous medical needs. A team of onsite nurses and local GP cannot meet her needs…she needs to be in a specialist epilepsy centre with onsite neurology…”

A clinical psychologist wrote:

”DD1 is virtually incapable of learning any new information….”

A speech and language therapist wrote

”DD1 can only process one key word in a sentence, usually the last word…”

Do you think the best consultant neurologists in the country are going to lie? There would have to be a massive conspiracy among 20 - 30 professionals, Social Services and the ICB, looking after her!

with that evidence it should be a formality reviewing it in-person.

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