AIBU to discuss GCSE and A-level realities with my Year 8 daughter?

[roughtrenches2]

DD is still young so I am aware this might sound a bit crazy. She is going in to year 8. So will pick her gcse options at the end of year 9. She is adamant she knows what she wants to do and has done for a long time but I don’t think realistically she is going to manage academically what it requires. Her friends older sister was talking about her GCSE choices the other day when I realised how much daughter has her mind set on this path. She soon told everyone what she was choosing for GCSE because then she could do her chosen A levels science ( biology and physics )

The issue is maths ! She is very science motivated and has done amazing in science this year BUT she will not get the maths grade required to do any A level sciences.
when do you start nicely having these conversations with your children without it sounding like you are being evil.

she has had a very turbulent start to education which she had done incredible considering but to catch up in maths would be a real task that will take a lot to get to a grade 7 she would need. I’m not sure if she even knows she would need a 7 in maths. Do I just let her go ahead and think this is the plan and dream until she finds out later on that it will be unlikely ?

sounds silly being worried about this now but I don’t want her to get crushed later on either.

Get her a tutor to pull her maths up.

Yes so realistically I was just looking.

her attendance for year 7 was term 1
42 percent. Term 2 20 percent ( this was a very unusual health crisis even for them and we very nearly lost her ) term 3 - 72 percent.

end of year exams
were
chemistry 92 percent
biology 80 percent
physics 89 percent

English didn’t give a percentage but
was
poetry - mastering
persuasive writing - securing

maths
paper 1 50 percent
paper 2 48 percent

so I think the capability is there and maths has always been a bit of a mix bag really good at some topics for example she actually done really well in algebra but she struggled in conversion of fractions to decimals etc
she also really struggled with divisions.
she struggled with multiplication and started the year with a test they gave them at 30 percent but achieved 98 percent in the repeat test at the end of the year.

Just checked again her school requirements is a grade 7 in the science they want to do at a level or a 7-7 in combined science, a 7 in maths and a 5 in English.

it’s good to know some are a grade 6 because maybe if we are not quite a a 7 we could look at alternative places.

My dd had a terrible relationship with maths, truly - if your dd is getting 50% in maths tests right now, my dd was not getting that and her school had streamed her into top set for everything based on SATs scores so she couldn't keep up with her peers either. Her maths teacher gave her a straight talking to end of year 8 as she was failing papers. Also considering much was lost in Y7 and beg Y8 due to covid. Anyway we sent her to tutoring for maths for y9-y11 and she come out with a grade 8 GCSE in maths. Shockingly, she chose maths at A level - I thought our nightmare might be over by this stage and we questioned her many times over this choice. Anyway, we also paid for online tutoring in maths from end of y12 as it wasn't clear if she'd get the grade she wanted without intervention. She has collected an A in maths today. I do feel the tutoring from year 9 onwards was most valuable as it allowed her to fill in any knowledge/skills gaps and it obviously must have gave her some sort of confidence! The stress has been immense following her on this journey though.

She is going into year 8. You need to chill! I say that with a dd who got her results today and at times I wasn’t sure she’d cope as science was very up and down. Well, she’s done it and off to uni… taking science. Get through GCSEs then worry about alevels!

She sounds incredibly bright and more than capable of getting a 7 in maths given her current marks and attendance levels. It's probably a couple of weekends on the missed areas each - division, multiplication, fractions, decimals basics.

It’s not that I’m not chill I am super proud of her no matter what she chooses to do. I just always have this very thin line between her over doing it vs letting everything slide and so I like to make sure I know things about the systems so I can stream line appropriate and make sure she doesn’t burn her self out on things that are not needed. Unfortunately for me a lot of her education has fallen on me over the years which is not ideal because I only have a certain amount of hours in the day and her full time carer to with a lot of night time medical intervention.

Or, talk to the school, explaining her issues and they may make an adjustment for her. It may not be as hard and fast as you think it is.

I agree that it has a lot to do with the teacher at school. If it gives you hope, I missed significant amounts of primary school and a lot in years 7-9 due to being in hospital. I got a D at GCSE and felt like an utter failure. However, I left school and resat my GCSE Maths with a wonderful teacher and got a B. Perhaps I needed a bit more time to catch up, maybe I needed a better teacher. Maybe I just grew in maturity and learnt how to revise 🤷🏻‍♀️

I don’t think your daughter has had a fair crack of the whip if she has missed so much school. Don’t underestimate her ability or her determination. School will guide her with her choices as well, and may also have a quiet chat with her in the run up to making her choices about how much work she’ll need to do, to achieve her ambition.

She will work out what’s in her reach without you telling her and you’re just way too early in ruling it out. You may be right but my dd in year 8 was an anxiety filled shy girl - nothing like the 18yo she is now.

I think it's still early days.

At primary school I was average at maths. In years 7 and 8 I was still average, and it was one of the subjects I was weaker at. I lacked a lot of confidence in it.

In year 9, I don't know why, but it just suddenly clicked (it wasn't the teaching, which was good throughout). I ended up doing A level maths and a degree with a high maths component. Incidentally, I was pressured to give up the maths modules at uni by the awful lecturer and I lost confidence again, but worked really hard and got 100% in the exam. Ha, I so enjoyed proving the awful lecturer wrong.

I'd say continue to encourage her, find ways to help her catch up and re-cover things if the teacher is bad.

I also really enjoyed reading "Why do buses come in threes", around year 9. Maybe she'd find it fun.

ah well done it’s a really tough situation.
the balance is key and i sometimes feel guilty about everything 🤣
i never wanted her health ( it was from birth ) to dictate her whole future but also knew there would be breaks and pacing needed and not to push her too much.

I am struggling with the maths sets at he school and I did speak to the head of maths about it but there is no way around it and I do feel like it will detriment her.

it’s a very small school and so 3 sets in maths.
they have some children who really really really struggle in maths and they have some very advanced students in maths.

with the 3 sets they only set the top children so they have their own set and the 2 other sets are mixed. I raised this as technically she was one of the “ top “ students in exams our the 2 mixed sets. He said they will not slit them up in ability for those 2 sets. The top set it so they are given the opportunity to be stretched but they will not put all the children who need the most support in one class because it would mean they wouldn’t get enough individual help.
this is where I worry as it stands all I hear about DD is “ she really isn’t a concern for me “ but that’s because she in a class with children who no fault of their own are really struggling and so I worry she will be left in that well she is a pass. She can’t go up to to top set because as I said they are really ahead of her.

If it's her dream OP and she's great at science but maths is holding her back, then get her a tutor. At 12/13 she's got time to catch up. If you give her all the extra support of a tutor and come end of Year 9 her SATs are average at best then you could consider having a chat with her.

I think a bit too early to decide on her potential when she's not had the best start in her education.

Give her the best opportunity now and see if she can do it. If she can't then it'll become obvious because of the results and marks she gets over the next couple of years. Too soon to crush her dreams and to decide what she can't do. At least you can say you gave her an equal footing to see what she can really do.

I say this as someone who scraped a C at GCSE Maths, was told I couldn't study my chosen science at undergraduate and MSc, only to go and get a First and Distinction once given the chance and opportunities :)

I think the problem will be that physics without maths does not go anywhere. Biology it won’t matter as much. She’s going to get advised by the school at some point that maths is a non starter if she remains at a 4. Let them advise. DD might change her interests too but even a grade 6 in maths is unlikely to lead to a great A level grade anyway and @noblegiraffehas all the stats on this. As she’s got to take maths and science GCSEs anyway so you have 3 years to see how it goes. Id offer help but say nothing about A levels right now.

I agree it’s a good time to address this. Your dd seems really bright and it would be a shame to give up on her dreams. The reduced subjects seems like and excellent option. And I would also be speaking to the school about special dispensation for her GCSE grade if she doesn’t get a 7.

I think and hope the teachers would be tactfully discussing this scenario with her when the time comes. Is her illness likely to improve over the next few years - if so I’d leave it a bit longer. If not then has she got a tutor at school you could discuss it with sensitively. Another option for sixth form could be a BTEC in science. I know some of my sons friends did this and did well and went to uni etc but the pass mark for maths etc wasn’t as high as Alevel.

This x100.
She definitely had time to catch up! I wouldn’t write it off yet. Tell her great then you need to do more maths and get her a tutor.

Wow she sounds like a really bright girl to be doing this well after such a lot to deal with. I agree with others she just needs more time it’s not that she’s not necessarily capable. Good luck to her with the right support I’m sure she’ll go far (even if not in physics!)

If she has her heart set on what she wants to be I would be realistic but would do my best to help her. Private maths tutor at weekends is the answer di not rely on the school. 1-1 classes will make all the difference. You seem to not have answered when people have suggested a tutor. If it’s cost that’s understandable but I would try and find a way.

The secret with maths is repetition.
So is she doing a bit everyday through the holidays? She could go over the things already studied just to keep them in her memory.
Have a look at the CGP book for KS3. And/or BBC Bite size online.
If she is really sure on everything so far, it will give a good foundation for Y8.
Use each holiday to recap what she has done in the previous term.
Explain that if she really wants to do her dream she needs to be able to do maths, and that she needs to put in the extra time.

Hi
I did answer. My issue was timing and fitting it in. So I said I would talk to school about finishing early one day where a core subject is last lesson ( once I have timetable )

You can achieve a fair amount by working in the holidays.
I would go back to, say, y2 work. Is she secure on all of that? Then go onwards. It sounds like she is missing some fundamentals that need to be sorted.
If you can put back the missing building blocks then it sounds like she might have the ability to fly.

Also you could ask school whether she could drop a non core subject for maths intervention or self study, given the circumstances. (Probably a no but worth a try)

To be fair I don’t think they would have an issue with this things like art are hard for her to keep up with and 3D design with the lessons she missed. So for example end of year exams they allowed her not so Spanish and history because she hasn’t done a lot of the curriculum. She caught up in maths ( as in completed all work ) English, all 3 sciences, Drama and geography.
I think I will wait until they start and have a meeting with the head and Senco. She could do with some extra time on maths and English writing !

Bright dc should not be giving up any subjects in my view. A broad education has value. Tuition in the evenings or weekends is the way to go.

Ok, so next year is she continuing Spanish and History despite having missed the curriculum to the point of not sitting the exams?

It definitely sounds like you need a meeting with the school to not just react to how her education has gone so far, but a plan for the future and what you are working towards. If she is missing school due to illness, is there any plan for hospital education? https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/hospital-education-a-guide-for-health-services/hospital-education-a-guide-for-health-services

I'm not sure why this all seems to have been left to you?