To think pensions need huge reform?

[aburrsir]

With all of the recent chat over changing politicians and big ideas that don’t go anywhere, I can’t be the only one who thinks that someone needs to bite the bullet with pensions?

It’s something ridiculous like 50% of the welfare budget annually, and this is never going to go away.

IMO the government need to hike up retirement age and scrap the triple lock. There can be provisions made to go along with this to phase this in for those in genuine need (e.g. for the next 10 years those with no private pensions can get a top up to cover the transition period).

I’d rather know “look you can’t retire until 75” now than this constant “it’s 67…. now wait it’s 68…..” that never ends.

It seems that all governments are scared to do such a big change as it will piss off older people (who are the primary voting demographic) but something needs to change as this is just completely unsustainable long term.

We’re better off making these changes to ensure the state pension can continue sustainably in the long term future rather than having this attitude of “as long as I’m alright I don’t care”

We need a gov with long term planning goals and not just short term firefighting. AIBU?

And then people would stop paying into private pensions. Why should my sil get pension credits ( so more than her brother who has worked his entire life) when she has paid zilch her whole life. We’ve scrimped, paid off a mortgage and into private pensions, gone without holidays, had old cars, rarely eat out etc. if it’s all for nothing I’ll stop paying into my private pension, fritter money and enjoy a state pension instead thanks.

Neither have the vast majority of people claiming child benefit, or operations on the NHS, or unemployment...Whats your point? Why is it only relevant when talking about pensioners? We're lucky to have all those evil million and billionaires keeping us afloat frankly.

If the government stopped wasting so much money, we wouldn't be in this mess.

Ok so if you're state pension age you don't pay. But those people have been paying all their lives? I'm already fully paid up but still have to keep paying while ever I'm working. Hence I'm retiring in 4 months. Fuck em.

@loveawineloveacrisp but that’s true for everyone and state pension age has increased so people are paying NI for longer. Our tax system would be more simple to scrap NI and roll it into income tax.

If we want a lower pensions bill surely we should be encouraging fags and booze and bacon butties not trying to get everyone to live till they’re 100🤣

absolutely shouldn’t be trying to increase the population- that’s the route cause of 99% of the worlds problems. A few billion less humans would solve a lot of issues…

@NaunetYou are confusing two different issues and the point you are making is relevant to millions boomer or not.

It’s the fact the boomers are such a large cohort and the generation above them was smaller so the boomers paid less towards them. You can google it if you still don’t understand…

You are contradicting yourself. You are against means testing pensions but want to reduce the cap on child benefit. If means testing pensions stops people paying into a private pensions why wouldn’t further reducing child benefit mean people do similar? We pay UC but millions still choose to work and aren’t eligible for any pensions so how come everyone doesn’t give up and claim UC?

Everyone does pay NI until retirement age?

Weird how we can have so many of these threads with so little thinking isn't it ?

Be nice to see some outside the box ideas.

Or is it just me ?

@Naunet this may help you

“Net Beneficiaries: Studies indicate the average Boomer may receive roughly 15% to 25% more in public services and state support over their lifetime than they contributed. 1]

Pay-As-You-Go Design: The UK welfare and state pension system operates on a pay-as-you-go model where current workers fund current retirees. Because of growing longevity and political protection of pensioner perks, the mathematics behind this contract have tilted. 1, 2, 3]

The "Silent" Contrast: The generation preceding the Boomers (the Silent Generation, born 1926–1945) largely ended up as net contributors because they started paying taxes when the modern welfare state was first built, whereas Boomers hit peak usage during an era of expanding state commitments”

The only people who will be able to afford to retire at that age are those in the public sector, which already has a productivity problem.

There are billions in unsustainable pension liabilities which - by your rationale- would be paid via contributions from those pushing 70 to allow those getting on for 20 years younger to retire in comfort.

My stock example, but DH is a doctor and will retire (soon-ish) on £100k per year. Great for us! But I don’t begrudge a former private sector worker £200 a week in the face of such largesse (or insanity, depending on how you look at it).

Only if they earn enough and of course state pension age is different for different cohorts

@Vinvertebratedoctors younger than your DH won’t get that sort of pension though because the schemes are less generous.

We've been told for 25 years that immigrants were going to pay pensions.

More over 70s are paying tax than under 30s. Pensioners are paying for immigrants. My advice is to emigrate.

They’ll still get a pension that is wildly more generous than thomas can be afforded by those in the private sector - I.e. those that work in companies that fund the public sector.

Oh god, another Boomer obsessed poster.
The point stands, either we only get out what we put in, or we dont, you cant have both ways. Also I'm not sure its even true, maybe when looking at their taxable income, but what about everything else we pay tax on whilst alive and then again when we die, is that factored in?

And again, if the government stopped wasting BILLIONS of tax payers money, this wouldn't be an issue.

£238 State pension.
Will they then not need to pay for- council tax , water rates, gas, electricty, broadband, phone, house ins,
car or transport expenses, household maintenance,
repair & replacement of appliances,
a cleaner or gardener, clothing ect?
Oh and now and again possibly a little food....

👏👏👏

Omg. No. No. No. The big change needed is taxing wealth. Sick of hearing that those of us on the ground floor need to tighten our bootstraps and work until we drop. It needs to (and can) go in the other direction. But that needs a fairer spread of resources.

We also need to bring in euthanasia for people who want it. That will ease the pressure on resources too.

What does taxing wealth mean?

The mobile global 1%? not going to happen without international initiative.

@Naunetits not boomer obsessed to post facts. If you cannot understand there is no shame in acknowledging that

And again, if the government stopped wasting BILLIONS of tax payers money, this wouldn't be an issue.

@Naunet
so how much waste is acceptable & what would you stop wasting money on?

@Backwardsbinn where did I say otherwise? But the fact remains that public sector pensions are not as generous to younger entrants.

There were far more DB schemes in the private sector too.

More over 70s are paying tax than under 30s

The difference is largely due to frozen tax bands & the triple lock which is pulling more pensioners into paying tax.

Based on 600,000 births per year, that would be £7.5 billion a year.

For reference, the foreign aid budget is around £13 billion.

In government terms, £7.5 billion is small change.

The current spend for pensions is £146 billion. My plan is very long term but in 70 or 80 years, the state pension cost would be zero and would be forevermore.