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The Jason Arday scandal, part deux

933 replies

KatiePricesKnickers · 10/08/2026 07:09

As the book launch is coming, let the discussion continue.

First thread: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/5563599-the-jason-arday-scandal?utm_campaign=thread&utm_medium=share
This is lifted from the thread in the education section, which is an interesting summary
https://www.ian-leslie.com/p/the-great-and-unfortunate-story-of?r=8w0woc&triedRedirect=true

Or AIBU with not letting this fade away?

The Great and Unfortunate Story of Jason Arday

A One-Stop Shop For the Craziest Scandal of 2026

https://www.ian-leslie.com/p/the-great-and-unfortunate-story-of?r=8w0woc&triedRedirect=true

OP posts:
Thread gallery
17
TJH1 · 16/08/2026 12:57

Todolisttoolong · 16/08/2026 12:03

It is not a comparison to the crimes of saville. It is about death not being an adequate excuse to not investigate people. But you know that and were being disingenuous.

I agree that death does not make an adequate excuse to not investigate people…however to bring up Saville? One of the countries worst sexual offenders? Really?

Todolisttoolong · 16/08/2026 12:59

Sunnibee · 16/08/2026 12:48

They weren't well known in the US either- beyond academic circles , and nor is this person dead. This is the overwhelming norm with cases of much more extreme academic frauds- let alone plagiarism (which is a much more common misdemeanour in academia).

Indeed, there are huge levels of vested interests within academia who are desperate for interest in JA to go away precisely because his case highlighted the wider corruption within academia. Because he wasn’t an aberration.

sammyvine · 16/08/2026 12:59

Angeruish · 16/08/2026 11:09

Why are we still yapping on about him?

a) because the people at Cambridge who put somebody so obviously unsuited to the role in the spotlight need to be brought to account (which is why I got involved in the first place)

b) the same goes for other universities, and indeed the whole ideologically-distorted areas of sociology and education, and especially the idiots at LiverpoolJMU who allowed through a doctorate with an obvious grammatical mistake in the thesis title

c) because his actions harmed a lot of people: the woman whose work he plagiarised, the women who didn't get the job given to him, the families of autistic children given false hope by his lies, the journalist threatened by scary lawyers, the academic contacted by the police...

d) because people like you are still having your own good old yap, trying to ignore the points raised above and instead substituting your own false narrative of a racist witch hunt

You need to let it go. You seem very distressed about this.
Let his family mourn him and move on. We have to keep remembering that nobody died through his actions. We have seen rapists and murderers come out of prison and be allowed to move on with their lives, so JA's actions could have been forgiven as time went on.

sammyvine · 16/08/2026 13:00

Why are soo many right winger people in the UK deleting their previous posts about Arday? Kathleen Stock has wiped out hers as well and she was on the hate train. Why don't they stand on their opinions now that he has passed?

sammyvine · 16/08/2026 13:02

NotAnotherScarf · 16/08/2026 11:01

Because I care about equality...as anyone who has half a brain should. Because inequality effects everyone...if you make women give up working when they get married as used to happen, you lose highly trained, experienced people from the workforce.

So i care that someone who made up stories implying he's being racially targeted when questioned about his lies as the next person who complains is impacted by that lie

Are you really sure about that? If this was a White man or woman would you feel the same way? Hmmm

Todolisttoolong · 16/08/2026 13:04

TJH1 · 16/08/2026 12:57

I agree that death does not make an adequate excuse to not investigate people…however to bring up Saville? One of the countries worst sexual offenders? Really?

where is your cutoff point for not speaking ill of the dead? which side of the line does Charlie Kirk sit on? Anne Widdecombe? Margaret Thatcher? They didn’t pretend to be something they were not but had many political opponents (and two were murdered by those opponents).

sammyvine · 16/08/2026 13:05

White people are more upset about Jason Arday's lies than actual pedo Prince Andrew.
Now I know why Meghan Markle got the hell out of the UK.

1dayatatime · 16/08/2026 13:05

DEI made him their emperor.

The rest of us and the media simply pointed out that he had no clothes.

The blame for his tragic death was the Universities putting him in to positions he was out of his depth to fulfill and in their zest for DEI not adequately doing their due diligence on his claims.

Sunnibee · 16/08/2026 13:08

sammyvine · 16/08/2026 13:00

Why are soo many right winger people in the UK deleting their previous posts about Arday? Kathleen Stock has wiped out hers as well and she was on the hate train. Why don't they stand on their opinions now that he has passed?

Because they realised that their actions contributed to the death of man who - while he might have deserved to lose his job - certainly did not deserve to die?

Todolisttoolong · 16/08/2026 13:13

Sunnibee · 16/08/2026 12:55

Actually- no . I hadn't heard his name and I don't know his face.
He's not dead
I just looked him up.
I've heard his false claims - which did very significant, widespread harm (literally led to the reemergence of diseases that kill and maim children) corrected in the evidence base and advice.

This is exactly how it should be, and demonstrates my points perfectly.

JA's face has been all over my social media and front page news for weeks. I know exactly what caused the difference.

Edited

Andrew Wakefield was all over the papers for ages, not just a couple of weeks - he was in every mainstream newspaper one both sides of the Atlantic. There is even a book written about how terrible he is.

BySunnyJadeEagle · 16/08/2026 13:17

Sunnibee · 16/08/2026 12:37

Immeasurable harm??! 😂.

Have you heard of Duke University researcher Erin Potts-Kant, whose systematic fabrication of research data on mouse lung functions was used to secure tens of millions of dollars in federal grants.

Nope? Know what her face looks like?No?

Now please ask yourself - why?

(This is just one example of numerous academic frauds that have had much more substantial consequences.)

Are these people dead?

Now ask yourself why.

Edited

Andrew Wakefield- caused immeasurable harm with his fabricated research on MMR vaccines causing ASC when he had money in single vaccines.

Struck off. Hounded in the press, quite fucking rightly, condemned by every other Autism researcher world wide and still now positioned as the example of medical research fraud. The subject of books, articles, podcasts and documentaries worldwide. He's included in academic teaching of Dr's and researchers of not what to do.

He's not dead because he didn't kill himself. It's that simple. He chose not to. Not because he wasn't investigated, struck off, lost his career, derided, condemned and hounded but because he didn't chose to kill himself you think JA suffered worse?

He didn't and hasn't.

And the worst part?

Years after he was investigated and thoroughly publicly shamed, people still think there was something in it.

Trump in the last 2 weeks when announcing policies around reducing DC vaccination schedules said 'we didn't have all these cases of Autism before we started giving so many childhood vaccines.

The difference between AW and JA was AW didn't also have a backstory of lies waiting to be uncovered and he couldn't claim he was a victim of racism when his fraudulent academia was uncovered.

Sunnibee · 16/08/2026 13:19

Todolisttoolong · 16/08/2026 13:13

Andrew Wakefield was all over the papers for ages, not just a couple of weeks - he was in every mainstream newspaper one both sides of the Atlantic. There is even a book written about how terrible he is.

I'm not disputing that the MMR controversy received extensive media coverage, but I'd never heard of Andrew Wakefield or seen his face until this discussion. His face certainly wasn't plastered across my Facebook feed for weeks, as JA was.

Being the subject of extensive news reporting isn't necessarily the same as having the kind of sustained, personal public shaming that JA received.

Also the comparison isn't particularly persuasive on the substance either: Wakefield's case involved serious professional misconduct and deliberate research fraud, with consequences for public confidence in vaccination and public health on a very different scale. The nature, reach and impact of the two controversies are not remotely equivalent.

Todolisttoolong · 16/08/2026 13:24

Sunnibee · 16/08/2026 13:19

I'm not disputing that the MMR controversy received extensive media coverage, but I'd never heard of Andrew Wakefield or seen his face until this discussion. His face certainly wasn't plastered across my Facebook feed for weeks, as JA was.

Being the subject of extensive news reporting isn't necessarily the same as having the kind of sustained, personal public shaming that JA received.

Also the comparison isn't particularly persuasive on the substance either: Wakefield's case involved serious professional misconduct and deliberate research fraud, with consequences for public confidence in vaccination and public health on a very different scale. The nature, reach and impact of the two controversies are not remotely equivalent.

JAs con was only on SM for two weeks. Nothing like the sustained hounding Wakefield received over years.

JA case includes professional misconduct and deliberate research fraud with consequences on the education and treatment of children in schools across the uk and on public sector policy.

Lougle · 16/08/2026 13:28

Sunnibee · 16/08/2026 12:47

And herein lies the harm.

You are describing your own experience, and you’re entitled to it. But presenting that experience as though it establishes what development generally looks like- and presenting it as a certainty for other children - is exactly the problem.

These narratives are the harm, not the extraordinary claims of individuals like JA about beating the odds, which (even if they were believed) everyone recognises to be exceptional.

I haven't presented it as a certainty. I'm saying that my experience of hundreds of children in special schools is that the gap widens. There will be situations where this isn't true, but Jason Arday said that he had global developmental delay, so he wouldn't be in the group that had a specific reason for being behind.

JustPlumCrow · 16/08/2026 13:29

This reply has been deleted

This has been deleted by MNHQ for breaking our Talk Guidelines.

BySunnyJadeEagle · 16/08/2026 13:30

sammyvine · 16/08/2026 13:00

Why are soo many right winger people in the UK deleting their previous posts about Arday? Kathleen Stock has wiped out hers as well and she was on the hate train. Why don't they stand on their opinions now that he has passed?

I'm sure they do.

But are likely being bombarded with hate and threats since Arday decided to not face the music.

I've seen videos on YouTube claiming what happened was thr equivalent of a modern day lynching and all those that spoke against him are 'racists that will be held to account and suffer'

Sunnibee · 16/08/2026 13:30

Todolisttoolong · 16/08/2026 13:24

JAs con was only on SM for two weeks. Nothing like the sustained hounding Wakefield received over years.

JA case includes professional misconduct and deliberate research fraud with consequences on the education and treatment of children in schools across the uk and on public sector policy.

The fact that the MMR case remained in the news for years doesn't prove that Wakefield had the same kind of personal visibility or exposure. Indeed, I've never heard of him or seen his face until this conversation, whereas JA's face and name were being circulated relentlessly across social media.

JA's face was plastered all over my social media for many weeks, despite the fact that I never clicked on a single story. That's a very different phenomenon: weeks of algorithmically amplified, personalised online exposure and public shaming. And the morning before he ended his life, JA reportedly called a colleague and said he couldn't leave his house because his face had become an emblem of shame. That gives you some indication of the nature of the exposure he was experiencing.

You're also simply asserting that JA's case involved "deliberate research fraud" and specific consequences for UK education and public policy as though those are established facts. They aren't. The allegations and findings surrounding his work are considerably more contested and, far from being comparable to Wakefield's deliberate fabrication of research, JA's case appears to concern much more ordinary academic misconduct, including plagiarism. Different institutions have also reached different conclusions following investigations.

And the claim that the consequences were comparable to Wakefield's is equally difficult to sustain. Wakefield's fraudulent research directly contributed to a major and enduring public-health scare around childhood vaccination, with consequences extending far beyond academia. Whatever one's view of JA's conduct, it simply isn't equivalent in scale or nature.

Sunnibee · 16/08/2026 13:33

Lougle · 16/08/2026 13:28

I haven't presented it as a certainty. I'm saying that my experience of hundreds of children in special schools is that the gap widens. There will be situations where this isn't true, but Jason Arday said that he had global developmental delay, so he wouldn't be in the group that had a specific reason for being behind.

We are going to have to agree to disagree. I also don't accept the premise that personal experience provides a reliable basis for making generalisations about children with global developmental delay. Nor do I believe that anyone can reasonably claim to know the developmental histories and trajectories of hundreds of individual children in the way you're suggesting. Even if you did, they would not be a representative sample from which generalisations could be drawn.

More importantly, I think some of the claims you're making risk spreading harmful misinformation, with real implications for the wellbeing of other people.

I prefer to draw conclusions from the research evidence rather than extrapolating from personal experience, so I don't think there's anything further to discuss.

TJH1 · 16/08/2026 13:35

Todolisttoolong · 16/08/2026 13:04

where is your cutoff point for not speaking ill of the dead? which side of the line does Charlie Kirk sit on? Anne Widdecombe? Margaret Thatcher? They didn’t pretend to be something they were not but had many political opponents (and two were murdered by those opponents).

Where have I said I don’t speak ill of the dead? What I said is that I think it’s disgusting to bring in Saville into this case and that the poster should be ashamed of themselves. I stand by that

Todolisttoolong · 16/08/2026 13:36

Sunnibee · 16/08/2026 13:30

The fact that the MMR case remained in the news for years doesn't prove that Wakefield had the same kind of personal visibility or exposure. Indeed, I've never heard of him or seen his face until this conversation, whereas JA's face and name were being circulated relentlessly across social media.

JA's face was plastered all over my social media for many weeks, despite the fact that I never clicked on a single story. That's a very different phenomenon: weeks of algorithmically amplified, personalised online exposure and public shaming. And the morning before he ended his life, JA reportedly called a colleague and said he couldn't leave his house because his face had become an emblem of shame. That gives you some indication of the nature of the exposure he was experiencing.

You're also simply asserting that JA's case involved "deliberate research fraud" and specific consequences for UK education and public policy as though those are established facts. They aren't. The allegations and findings surrounding his work are considerably more contested and, far from being comparable to Wakefield's deliberate fabrication of research, JA's case appears to concern much more ordinary academic misconduct, including plagiarism. Different institutions have also reached different conclusions following investigations.

And the claim that the consequences were comparable to Wakefield's is equally difficult to sustain. Wakefield's fraudulent research directly contributed to a major and enduring public-health scare around childhood vaccination, with consequences extending far beyond academia. Whatever one's view of JA's conduct, it simply isn't equivalent in scale or nature.

The fact you don’t remember the news from when Wakefields case was public doesn’t mean other people don’t, or that you can’t google it! SM was less then but it was certainly all over my Facebook feed!

JA is charged with fabricating work not just plagerism.

BySunnyJadeEagle · 16/08/2026 13:48

Sunnibee · 16/08/2026 13:19

I'm not disputing that the MMR controversy received extensive media coverage, but I'd never heard of Andrew Wakefield or seen his face until this discussion. His face certainly wasn't plastered across my Facebook feed for weeks, as JA was.

Being the subject of extensive news reporting isn't necessarily the same as having the kind of sustained, personal public shaming that JA received.

Also the comparison isn't particularly persuasive on the substance either: Wakefield's case involved serious professional misconduct and deliberate research fraud, with consequences for public confidence in vaccination and public health on a very different scale. The nature, reach and impact of the two controversies are not remotely equivalent.

How old are you?

Wakefield paper was published in 1998. It immediately had other researchers questioning it but the first hit piece investigation was published in 2004 when it was discovered Wakefield had money in promoting MMR being dangerous.

FB was just starting in 2004 and it took another 6 years for him to be struck off by the GMC and for the original research paper to be retracted.

So it was news and created a huge amount of media coverage but rumbled on for years. It wasn't a 'developing news story' like JA where more and more was coming out rapidly.

Which is why even though the press coverage was extensive, it wasn't concentrated over a few weeks. It was years.

And Wakefield didn't have the incredible back story that JA had made his career and a lot of money off the back of, and couldn't claim he was being targeted because of his race and make up stories about that which could then be questioned and found to be untrue.

BySunnyJadeEagle · 16/08/2026 14:00

TJH1 · 16/08/2026 13:35

Where have I said I don’t speak ill of the dead? What I said is that I think it’s disgusting to bring in Saville into this case and that the poster should be ashamed of themselves. I stand by that

If you had any reading comprehension you'd have understood that I as that poster, wasn't comparing JA to Saville.

It was in response to that poster trying to shut down the conversation by saying 'he's dead, don't you have compassion for his wife (ex btw) and DC'?

So I said of course I do but someone being dead doesn't mean we should not investigate them or talk about them.

And gave Saville as an example. Should he not have been investigated and condemned after death because he was dead?

Or anyone? Should death mean people shut up?

As I said in another post, if Farage died tomorrow would you be on threads saying 'let it go, he's dead. 5 million gift didn't hurt anyone. Won't you think about his children?'.

I doubt it.

Gloriia · 16/08/2026 14:04

Sunnibee · 16/08/2026 13:30

The fact that the MMR case remained in the news for years doesn't prove that Wakefield had the same kind of personal visibility or exposure. Indeed, I've never heard of him or seen his face until this conversation, whereas JA's face and name were being circulated relentlessly across social media.

JA's face was plastered all over my social media for many weeks, despite the fact that I never clicked on a single story. That's a very different phenomenon: weeks of algorithmically amplified, personalised online exposure and public shaming. And the morning before he ended his life, JA reportedly called a colleague and said he couldn't leave his house because his face had become an emblem of shame. That gives you some indication of the nature of the exposure he was experiencing.

You're also simply asserting that JA's case involved "deliberate research fraud" and specific consequences for UK education and public policy as though those are established facts. They aren't. The allegations and findings surrounding his work are considerably more contested and, far from being comparable to Wakefield's deliberate fabrication of research, JA's case appears to concern much more ordinary academic misconduct, including plagiarism. Different institutions have also reached different conclusions following investigations.

And the claim that the consequences were comparable to Wakefield's is equally difficult to sustain. Wakefield's fraudulent research directly contributed to a major and enduring public-health scare around childhood vaccination, with consequences extending far beyond academia. Whatever one's view of JA's conduct, it simply isn't equivalent in scale or nature.

JA's 'face was plastered over the media and sm' for 2 weeks max before his death. I'd never heard of him prior.

Wakefield's high profile case was plastered over the media for months.

Fine if you're too young and you didn't know about it but this constant 'doesn't happen to white people' is just untrue. What about David Kelly? Humiliated and publicly discredited and he took his own life. White also.

JA made a lot of stuff up and students paid thousands to hear it. He was on tv, he did interviews. He was making money on the back of all his stories. Please tell me you agree that is wrong?

His suicide is tragic he left his dc without a df when he could've faced the music. I bet there'd have still been 'academics' in Cambridge and elsewhere who would've backed him. Sadly I don't think the book would have been well received who knows though.

TJH1 · 16/08/2026 14:11

Ah but I actually like Farage, you wasnt expecting that was you?

As for reading comprehension? You have a nerve. Uttering JA and Saville in the same paragraph and you cant see while someone might find it offensive?

WonderfulSmith · 16/08/2026 14:12

Sunnibee · 16/08/2026 12:37

Immeasurable harm??! 😂.

Have you heard of Duke University researcher Erin Potts-Kant, whose systematic fabrication of research data on mouse lung functions was used to secure tens of millions of dollars in federal grants.

Nope? Know what her face looks like?No?

Now please ask yourself - why?

(This is just one example of numerous academic frauds that have had much more substantial consequences.)

Are these people dead?

Now ask yourself why.

Edited

Because she wasn’t the guest editor of The Today Program? Because she didn’t have an autobiography she publicised? Because she wasn’t interviewed numerous times about her educational experiences and told blatant lies? Because she didn’t lie about having cancer?

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