AIBU to judge passengers complaining about grounded flights on 9/11?

[doosesmarket]

I’m watching an old Airline UK episode and it’s from 9/11. The way people were behaving at not being able to get on their flights blows my mind. I keep trying to think well they hadn’t processed 9/11 the way we have now, but realistically they’d all seen screens of the news and watched 2 planes smash into the towers and the towers collapse full of people.

Surely you’d have enough understanding of the need to ground flights and change security measures even then?

I know it was 25 years ago but AIBU to hope those people demanding/shouting at the staff/the entitlement that they need to get to Benidorm that day because ‘we’re not in America’ were ashamed when they seen themselves on the telly and how they acted during the most horrific terrorist attack any of us have ever lived during?

If anyone wants to see a positive story on this check out the musical Come from Away, such a feel good piece considering the tragic circumstances

A lot of people tying themselves in knots to try and defend other persons behaviour. Sometimes people are just absolute arseholes. If you watch other episodes of this show you will see it’s far more common than not for people to act like this. These people were not lacking in information, not 12 hours later certainly, let’s just accept they were self centred pricks. A lot of people are.

I remember thinking it for some kind of hoax. I watched it on TV at work and I genuinely didn't think it was really happening. It took till the next day for it to sink in as all the coverage came in.

We didn't have mobile phones in the same way back then we didn't have internet access at our fingertips or the social media we only had the TV.

And honestly we'd never experienced anything like it so it just didn't seem like it was really happening.

That’s right, around 2ish…unbelievable scenes.

This is not accurate. I actually watched the second plane fly into the tower live as it happened. I happened quite by chance to have the television on in the afternoon at home as I wanted to check something. The first plane had already gone in, and the news cameras were there. Prior to the second plane flying in, there was massive confusion and shock, and the belief that it was some terrible accident. The second the second plane hit the tower, there was no doubt that it was a deliberate terrorist attack. That was the moment the world changed.

I remember walking the village to school to collect my daughter that afternoon, and imagining the buildings collapsing around my head. Suddenly the world was a very scary place.

@hahabahbag

. I must admit it does seem disproportionate now to ground domestic flights from London to Scotland because something happened in the USA

True with hindsight but there were at least two reasons:

The UK security apparatus possibly went with "you can't be too careful,.let's take time to analyse this"..

The other reason for definite (and this is mentioned in the ATC Blog I posted upthread) - is that the UK air traffic controllers were suddenly faced with a wave of dozens, (plus plus) aircraft returning to the UK/Europe from the west having done an about turn over the Atlantic - a lot of that traffic, especially to/from the US West coast routes through the airspace over western Scotland.

Also aircraft in UK airspace coming out of Europe wanted to do a U turn before even getting anywhere near the Atlantic.

The UK controllers had to free up capacity/airspace and cancelling flights not already airborne was one solution.

No, I watched it happening in the afternoon here, morning in NY…I rang my sister to put the news on…

You need to take those programmes with a pinch of salt. They would have asked specific questions to set them up to be answered in that way and edited the responses. It doesn’t mean that everyone had this attitude.

Re security measures - well of course events shape the way we change processes. Nobody can ever anticipate a unique event like this.

Yep, there was unfortunately plenty of live footage of the second hit on the WTC,.not just on rolling news either, some of the US East coast breakfast time TV programmes carried it.

I had just gone on maternity leave with DS and was lying on the sofa balancing a plate of toast on my massive bump when DH phoned me (landline? Nokia?) to tell me to switch the telly on. Lay there thinking - what sort of a world am I bringing this little one into? So very self centred.

But most working people didn’t have access to TV or radio during the day when they were working so the majority were in a bubble until they get home and/or picked up the evening newspaper on their way home. Things were very different back then.

I worked in an investment bank so in my area we had constant news showing on TV screens plus Bloomberg etc but that was a long way from the norm for many people.

I had worked in NYC for a while and a close friend of mine (who I met when I was working there) worked literally across the street from the WTC. We often used to go for drinks after work in the bar at top of one of the towers. When the someone at work in London said about the first plane, everyone at my work was WTF that can’t be true?! So I actually rang my friend at her work in NYC and she answered. She was relatively relaxed about it saying ‘oh they think says it’s a commuter plane’ and then in the background security started evacuating her office and everyone, including her, sounded as confused as hell and she had to go. That was minutes before the second plane hit. After that the reality of what had happened and was still happening started coming out but phone lines in NYC were down and it was more than 24 hours later that I found out she had survived.

Airline UK is a TV program filmed for entertainment and content. They aren't going to show the 99.9% of people who, on hearing what happened, reacted well and went home. It shouldn't come as any surprise that some people are tossers, but I suspect a lot weren't behaving like that.

As regards 'everyone must have known' I think a lot of people on here don't know, or have forgotten how much the world has changed.

It's totally unrealistic to think they'd all seen or heard the news.

About 36% of people had mobiles and they didn't have TV screens in them. Just over 40% of homes had satellite dishes.

These days screens are everywhere and switched on all the time. They just weren't back then. Most people's TVs and monitors still weren't flat, they were massively heavy great things with cathode ray tubes. Flat screens were available but still quite new. It's the flat screen that has made the presence of screens in our lives so damnably prevalent.

People can hold two emotions simultaneously though.

They can be (could have been) absolutely aghast about the attacks, but also upset they are going to miss their daughter's wedding or dad's imminent death or whatever.

Its the same when people try and pretend they are more than happy to be stuck in a 5 hour traffic jam just because someone had it worse than them. Whatever you are doing, there will be someone worse off, so should you not do anything anywhere, anytime because you have more empathy for those not able to do it? Including living in a clean, dry home or eating decent food or having a job or sending your kids to school....? Where do you draw the line?

Growing up in London in the 90s, terrorist attacks werent an everyday thing, but were common enough that you were used to working around that train station being closed or taking a different bus home etc.

So on 9/11, relying just on text messages, the idea a terrorist attack the other side of tge world would affect is teens in London seemed absolutely bizarre.

A few years later, i was working iuth a charity abroad when the july bombings hit London. The only information was Spanish CNN. It was very unspecific... because it was aimed at the Central American population not the UK population. It didnt really give the scope of the attack.

Funnily enough I watched the episode OP stated and then carried on watching some more.

The way people treat staff is appalling.

I’d forgotten that side of it! I’d forgotten how many times I was yelled at because “you can solve the problem you’re just choosing not to”.

I learned well how to put the ball back the other side of the court and so it’s been a great lesson for life in general.

One of my favourite moments of working the tourist industry was my company asking me if I’d really said to a guest “well I can’t build extra rooms in the hotel so short of accepting the 3 alternatives I’ve offered you what would you suggest I do?”

What else could I say other than “yes I did?”

Byw this was because they didn’t want to vacate their room at checkout time because they had a late flight.

There was a courtesy room which they were offered for sole use as a large group for a set period of time, offered the crèche as a room for them to use personally or the adults only chalet for personal use. More than they were entitled to. But no, the only acceptable solution for them was for their entire party of 6 rooms to keep all those rooms until 9pm despite knowing check out times when they booked.

I think they thought force in numbers would win them the argument.

They took the chalet in the end when the hotel owner threatened to get them physically removed from the hotel by the police for abusing me 😂

sadly, as is seen in Airline, and the staff comment on - I suspect they got compensation anyway completely undermining me and my experience 🤷‍♀️

Yes it was about then.

Because we go into hotels at 4 ish for our evening rounds and it was on the news then showing both planes hitting.

We were at the airport by 6 to receive diverted flights. (Same time zone as the uk)

@ElBandito

As regards 'everyone must have known' I think a lot of people on here don't know, or have forgotten how much the world has changed.
It's totally unrealistic to think they'd all seen or heard the news.
About 36% of people had mobiles and they didn't have TV screens in them. Just over 40% of homes had satellite dishes

Absolutely agree

And if overseas some mobiles wouldn't work (remember the different specs for e.g. the States/Japan?), roaming cost a fortune, public wi-fi ...what's that?

Case in point is how I found on the day as an airline employee...

Meet up with colleagues (crew) in hotel lobby, get in cab to restaurant...driver mutters about "a plane flying into skyscraper in New York"..we shrug, eat a leisurely dinner, couple of hours later walk into bar for a nightcap...open the door thinking "bit quiet"....and see everyone watching CNN...that's when we found out

These days as an airline employee I doubt we'd have got as far as the restaurant before somebody would have had a message from HQ/the Union/Home..

Different world.

Things were very different back then, no smart phones, less internet access etc. Also it took quite a while for people to know what happened.

For instance I didn't know about 9/11 until around 16 hours later, someone 12 hrs after it happened said to me 'Did you hear about the plane crash' and I said 'No' but it wasn't for another 3-4 hours I saw a TV and realised it was more than a simple crash.

I am sure in those first 16 hrs my reaction would have been 'why is my flight cancled because of a crash in America - doesn't make sense?'

Programnes like Airline only showed the most "entertaining" customers.

Not saying the staff dont get a lot of unreasonable abuse... but it isnt as constant as the programme made out.

If you had been berating me you would have immediately gone to the back of the queue and potentially police called for abusive and threatening behaviour. There is NEVER any excuse for abusing and shouting at poor people just trying to do their jobs. Why do you think your needs trump everyone else. This is exactly the attitude op is talking about.

Yes they did for goodness sake. They just weren’t smart phones. I had a phone that funnily enough managed texting and they were very common by then.

Yes they did. I was watching rolling coverage on the television and many people were watching it on screens in shop windows. I really wish people wouldn’t try and make out it was the dark ages. Very few people where I was were unaware of what was going on. As I’ve previously said texting was very common.

It's not a case of people making out it was the dark ages, but more a case that unless someone had reason and the means to send a text, or you were near a handy TV, it could certainly take several hours to be fully aware of events such as 9/11.

For example as I recall it you didn't have notifications pushed to your mobile about latest workd events, or (open to correction) an option to pass the time by quickly scanning BBC news headlines on your mobile.

I can certainly understand why someone could rock up at an airport check-in and not know, and in any event agree with the opinion that as always the TV programmes will have been edited to highlight whatever behaviour the director wants to highlight.

Phone calls and texts were relatively expensive then.

BBC TV rolling news was a thing. It was on all the radio channels. I think it was unlikely that that sort of news hadn’t spread through most workplaces in minutes. My neighbour rang me to put the TV on but if she hadn’t I’d have heard about it when I got in the car to go on the school run, so within the hour. I suppose you wouldn’t have heard if you stayed in all day with no TV or radio and no one had told you.