To wonder where the normal people are?

[wherearemypeople]

I went to a broadly leftwing but not political event the other day. At one point an anti racist man shouted out "never mourn a Tory", which struck me as pretty pro-violence in the month that Ann Widdecombe was murdered. Then a trans performance poet had trans flag painted bricks to remind people of the stonewall riots and said that sometimes people needed more persuasion, and mentioned Wes Streetings constituency office being damaged.

I used to be solidly left wing but would never condone violence. I'm just wondering where normal people are who are neither like the ones just mentioned or Tommy Robinson fans.

Name changed just in case the woman who runs the event comes on here.

What is normal? Kind? Able to hold your own political views without hating or disrespecting others? There's still a few about.
Just think, only a decade ago it was seen as weird to go NC with family at all, never mind because they vote for a different party.

Glad to hear there are people who agree that it's not normal to just cheer along nonsense.

Now I just need to find some arts events in real life that are sane.

The point about going no contact is interesting - I am sure some people really do need to do it because their parents or other family members are properly toxic, but it does feel like it's suggested a lot more easily than it should be these days. It probably is technology that encourages extreme reactions in many directions.

Far left. Far right. Same difference when each side think violence and silencing is the right way to win an argument.

I wish nuance existed.

What event was this and who was it held by?

Orwell, in "The Road To Wigan Pier" wrote of how socialism attracted too many cranks, which put off the 'normal people'
(OK, he wrote that the left attracts "every fruit-juice drinker, nudist, sandal-wearer, sex-maniac, Quaker, 'Nature Cure' quack, pacifist and feminist in England." - personally I'd choose different targets, but you get the gist 👍)

Throughout history and across countries the extreme left and right wings have always been the complete opposite of tolerant. Both are controlling, repressive, coercive and ultimately violent.

Tolerance cones from a moderate, balanced, non-ideological, evidence-based and rational position not from either extreme, by definition: extremes can only exist by characterising others as scapegoats or enemies.

I’m a centrist. I don’t consider myself left or right wing. However, I have noticed that the left have become more extreme, violent, and intolerant than the right in recent years.

I think some people have just started yelling about their politics more. It never used to be a thing to discuss politics. That and social media echo chambers making people think certain views are so abhorrent they’re not to be discussed and their views being the only virtue. Hence people screaming about immigration, Gaza and trans to (in their eyes) make themselves look virtuous when irl it’s healthcare / education / budget that actually matter.

It seems to be so tied up with their identity for some people. I’m lucky with my friends but I occasionally meet someone new who very quickly wants to find out where I stand politically (which is in a very woolly middle ground, so incomprehensibly boring to them!). These are NOT my kind of people.

And the stereotyping! A Tory friend spends her days since she retired doing voluntary work, raising money for good causes, driving people to hospital etc. Yet she’d be scum to some!

And then there’s the labelling. I’m gender critical so must be ‘far right’ and therefore love Trump and want to destroy the NHS and hate immigrants and read the daily mail. All because I think a fella wearing wig and taking some hormones does not make him a woman. Wild times!

What was the event? I dont understand how it can be "broadly leftwing but not political" - that seems a contradiction!

Angela Rayner called a Tory MP ‘Tory scum’ in the House of Commons a few years ago. It was under her breath but clearly audible. It was immediately reported to the Speaker but she was never made to return to the House to apologise.

I feel like this was a dangerous moment for civility in our politics. Most parliamentarians are civil , even friendly, towards each other despite their differences.

We cannot allow extremism or hatred to enter the mainstream.

That’s why I don’t like Rayner. I’ve been accused of snobbery by my left wing friends for disliking her but it’s definitely not that. It’s because I get vibes of someone who stereotypes people and uses labels and insults to shut opponents down and whose politics are very much based on resentment.

I just don’t think she’s of a high enough calibre personally to hold high office - unlike some of the working class Labour politicians of the past. Even dear old Denis Skinner, The Beast of Bolsover, wasn’t small- minded and spiteful.

It was a local spoken word night, so just a bunch of poets. They tend to be consistently left wing in my area, but it's not a specifically political event. Mostly open mic - there was some good stuff.

Yeah, you're unlikely to find any Burkean Conservatives at a spoken word night.

What is normal, though?

Who decides what it is?

Surely, normal is different for everyone?

This thread has made me think back over my experience at work and elsewhere. I’ve always worked in education - not exclusively in schools, but also in museums and similar settings. The dominant - sometimes actually bullying - ethos was left wing, so my experience of political people is of the left rather than the right. I acknowledge that if I’d worked in other contexts - say the trading floor of the Stock Exchange - I might be moaning about brash right wingers.

But in my work contexts, if you weren’t overtly left wing - boy, you’d better be brave or else keep your mouth shut! And it should never be like that, should it? It did put me off staying in school teaching and I know other teachers who’d had enough of the preaching and disapproval from left wing colleagues who were frankly intolerant. I’m not exactly a Tory, though I have voted for all 3 main parties over the years, but the intolerance and bias wore me down.

Sure, but I think we’re talking about extremism and intolerance here.

'Normal' people usually just get on with living their lives and are not interested in being all over social media all the time or creating controversy for attention and publicity.

The silent, decent majority is out there living normal lives and don't hold extreme views (left or right) or promote violence.

Most people are normal and don't announce their views. People are polite and will either remain quiet while someone is spouting off or they will nod, as if to agree, to appease the talker, but there is a silent majority who do not like the extreme views. It will show at voting time.

The police/government/justice system seem to operate a two tier system as well which emboldens some.

Anyone remember Ricky Jones the Labour councillor who called for the Southport protesters to have their throats cut. Remember what happened to him? Nothing.

Thank you, you've encapsulated wonderfully what I wanted to say.

I used to be solidly leftwing but no more. It’s clear the left is now the home of ‘othering’ people, intolerance and violent rhetoric, if not actual violence, against those they politically disagree with. Nor are they the home of evidence based opinions.

I never thought I’d say it, but I see the Conservatives as the political home of tolerance and evidence based policy nowadays.

I too have been appalled at left identified people, those who claim to be feminists no less, expressing anger at those who are upset at an an elderly woman being beaten to death by a young man. How did the left come to this? Maybe they were always like this and I never noticed.

We're the silent majority who don't believe people can change sex, don't want puberty blockers used on children, are concerned about illegal immigration and the growth of Islam in the UK.

However, we don't want anyone murdered or intimidated and would never vote Reform.

We really care about the NHS, education, social care, unemployment of young people, housing, transport. Palestine is a foreign country and we care more about our own country. That's human nature.

I’m not a paid-up Conservative (or Labour supporter, gotr that matter…bit of a floater!😣) but it’s funny, isn’t it, that the Tories have had 3 female PMs and 2 BAME PMs, yet they are often stereotyped as racist and sexist by the Left?

A cynic might think they don’t trust the electorate - or at least their cor supporters- to vote for these categories. I. Not agreeing with this - I have more respect for voters - but I do wonder sometimes if the Labour Party think that way.

Ooh sorry…Kemi isn’t PM…yet! But she’s the party leader.