AIBU to wonder if anti-English feeling is mostly about sport

[Batsratscatsgnats]

If you support anyone but England in football or other sports do you dislike English people generally or is it just in sports?

Have you heard of any bad behaviour from England fans because I haven't? Also did you read what I wrote of Scotland fans cutting down English flags or have you conveniently forgotten that?

London's great. It's just that the UK is so centralised there both in terms of power (especially England) and finance/industry. It's bad for everyone because it means other parts of the country suffer from lack of jobs/industry and London gets ever more expensive and crowded as everyone moves there for jobs. That's not Londoners fault though! It's years of government decisions and centuries of history

I’m Northern Irish. I left NI after uni at 23 which is nearly 25 years ago. I have lived in France, Australia and New Zealand at various times in my life. I have a large extended family, with a sister who has lived in England for over 20 years, and I now have beautiful nephews and nieces who happen to be English.

With a genuine experience of other cultures and an appreciation of what’s ‘good’ about England (my BIL is a lovely decent man) I can say without reservation that the English are known all over the world for their arrogance. It’s insufferable, and sporting events serve to highlight it. Where other countries know their weaknesses and can understand when and how to boast about their strengths, the English ‘barmy army’ (no matter what the sport) shove their entitlement down everyone else’s throat. There is zero awareness of what’s appropriate sporting behaviour (or political, or social) and quite often, there is zero acknowledgement of culpability when it’s needed. Whether that’s ignorance or pride, it doesn’t matter. Some humility would go a long way on the international stage. No one, and I mean no one, wants to see over-confidence (arrogance) rewarded. I usually avoid threads like this but felt my honesty might be helpful.

Anyone But England? Every time.

But Wales was England’s first colony. Taken by force.

More generally Id guess the not wanting to support England stretches from ‘friendly’ local rivalry, to deeply engrained history. It doesn’t make much sense to just start supporting a neighbouring country because your team are out. In club sport some of the biggest rivalries are between local teams

I dunno most 'English' people arent fully English anyway are they? If you go back just 2 generations in my family for example you would see Jamaican, Welsh (mothers side) Scottish, English (fathers side) and i dont think im unusual. So if we're talking HISTORY then the descendents of the English you blame for history (who arent responsible for what their ancestors did anyway) may well be "Scottish" or "Welsh" now anyway.

I don't even know if what sinkysocks is saying is true. If it is, and Bostonians were shocked at the football chants against their new best friends it just tells me that Bostonians/Americans don't know how football chants work. Scotland has chants against the UK and they are funny. But if America doesn't have the same culture maybe it was shocking to them. Or maybe it's made up for clocks online.

I thought it was maybe down to Aussie cockiness. Dd1 was in Oz for the 2003 (IIRC) Rugby World Cup final (England won) and said the cockiness was off the scale - ‘Of course we’re going to win - we’re Australian!’
So it was doubly sweet to dd when they didn’t,

Well, Wales used to spread out through Cheshire and much of the UK. So is Cheshire also England's first colony?

I got that impression too actually. Their chants are very tame compared to what Scots and English teams might chant.

It was Brythonic not Welsh in what is England. I had a Welsh individual claiming England should give the newly discovered carynx to Wales even though it was in Norfolk but they weren't Welsh.

That is no way my adult kids will be able to live anywhere near us in London. They will never be able to afford it. That makes me a bit sad, but what can we do.

We all did an ancestry DNA test for fun.

My 'English' family were pretty much anything but.

I inherited some welsh from both DM and DF (expected from DM, surprise from DF) and ended up 60% welsh, 20 % English and the other 20% was from Iceland/Norway/Germany.

OK. Would you be surprised at a Man City fan supporting anyone but Man United?

See Celtic / Rangers and football. Childish idiots re-enacting the N Ireland troubles in modern day Glasgow. It’s staggeringly pathetic.

I didn't say that people said derogatory things about the Tartan Army. Not sure where you got that.

But the Bostonians didn't take well to the 'fuck off Tartan Army, you've had your fucking party' chant, for example. Unless that was AI?

My grandparents are Scottish, Welsh and Irish. So I don't have any "English" DNA at all. But I was born in England and sound very English and feel English. If I claimed to be Irish based on a grandparent I never met that would bee deeply weird (different for people with more links to there). But it makes the whole (right wing) argument about "Englishness is an ethnicity first and foremost" seem nonsensical. Even with Scottishness which I have more connection to. Am I more Scottish than Hamza Yousuf? No, if I tried to claim I was it would be ridiculous.
But equally, should I be calling myself an oppressor because I am now living in England? Or am I part of the tragically colonised class because my ancestors came from Wales/Scotland/Ireland. The Scottish borders fluctuated a lot as did the Welsh and for most of the countries histories people moved freely over them. And people moved into the countries from elsewhere as well.

I'm Scottish, have never hated the English. I had way too many happy holidays as a kid in england to feel anything other than fond. I would usually support England as i would any other brit team but sometimes the media just bangs on a bit. I still visit England and love London but avoid certain areas now like the plague. A lot of times with the football, its just banter, which is part of the fun of being a footy fan i think.

Isn't it quite common to not want your rivals to win?

For example do Man City fans support United in a tournament that they've been knocked out of?

I do think its a reaction to the media frenzy rather than anything else. I remember when I was young thinking that references to 1966 would stop soon as we'd be so far on from it...and here we are 30 years later

They’re my next door neighbour, if I’m not in the race, I hope my neighbour will take the medal.
DH cheers for England, he is a Northern Ireland Catholic. His father used to moan but as DH sees it, he supports English players throughout the year.
Ireland and the Uk have built up a strong healthy relationship since the 90’s.
Okay, we might have to hear about it for years but no different to any other countries that win.

I’m a Scot, lived in Northern England for 50+ years. In my much younger days I was a radio operator in a male based industry, the lads called me Jock. My dad was in an English regiment during WWII, and he was called Jock. It was never derogatory for either of us. He had English friends that wrote years afterwards, that’s how they addressed him.

DH, English, moved to Scotland as a child. Granted, the area wasn’t the best, but he had a tough time. He can change accents at will, he learnt pretty quickly to avoid being bullied. I had no idea he wasn’t Scottish til I met his parents. One of the reasons why, after we had the DC, moving back was never going to happen.

I love so much about Scotland, we’ve visited regularly over the years, but occasionally I still got a whiff of anti Englishness. There are so many similarities and shared DNA across the UK, I find the tiny mindedness sad.

I’m no football fan, but I thought Scotland did well to qualify, and the Tartan Army got a great reception in the USA, and I’d love England to win.

I love England (European) but everyone I know in Europe don't like the English football team because of their drunk hooligan supporters- so it's def just about football.

I’m Irish and i am not anti-English at all. I’ve visited England a few times and I love it and always found the people very friendly and welcoming. I can safely say any anti-English sentiment here has nothing to do with sport though , it’s very obviously got everything to do with the history of how our country was treated by the uk in the past . I think there is a lack of knowledge or a burying in the sand a bit by some people about this history, which is frustrating.

My Scottish roots were less than expected. My Irish paternal grandmother, from Dublin, and her parents and grandparents turned out to be English! The only Irish DNA was mixed in with the Scots on my mum’s side. Bits of Scandinavia too.

I don't think the English are arrogant at all! They tend to be very humble and do not have the bragging attitude of Americans nor the pride you can see with the French.

They do have a long tradition of football hooligans and that's why people don't like their football team.

It's only football people. Not a tribal war! If they win, it's fun for a day or so. But if they don't, it doesn't matter. It's only a ball in a field.