Neighbour cultivating fox den

[Sunnyday14558]

Our neighbour has actively been getting foxes to nest in her garden. We live on the outskirts of a city so I’m not entirely sure why she’s luring them into a semi detached property from woodland half a mile away. Anyhow, we now have a family living in her garden and the noise at night is keeping us awake. We have two children under 4 and have found a dead rat in their play area and fox poo all over the lawn. The patio also stinks from fox wee so we can’t open our windows downstairs. I literally have no idea what to do as we’ve tried fox deterrents before and nothing seems to work. I want to confront her about it but I’m pretty sure she’ll accuse me of being mean to the foxes. A someone please give me some thoughts on how to approach this? Is encouraging foxes to live in an urban garden really kind for them? I ask because it sounds like they’re ripping each other apart at night with the fighting.

I was just about to say that. And mice too. But as I’ve seen and the cat has caught rats in my garden this year the foxes aren’t catching them all.

I'm not technically correct. It's just correct.

And I agree we're overpopulated but as you just said, we have land that can't be built on. Huge amounts of it. I agree.

Your original post that I responded to was you saying mankind was using every available bit of land so wildlife was being forced out.

Which as I said simply isn't true.

There's 91% of the UK that hasn't been built on for housing, roads or car parks that foxes and other wildlife can live in. They're not being forced out of their natural habitat, they're moving away from their natural habitat because natural hunting and foraging is harder work than eating leftover KFC that a litterer has left on the road or because people and businesses have overflowing bins full of fox delights.

And because Doris down the road feeds them beautifully prepared a la carte food because it makes her feel good, special and a superior person and she can 'do what she likes in her own garden'.

One of those attacks turned out to be by an Alsatian. The family blamed a fox because they didn't want the dog to get the blame.

Isn’t your garden secure so your dog can’t get out? Pretty sure that’s on you, and before you start I have a dog and it’s my job to make sure she doesn’t escape and doesn’t eat things she shouldn’t.

Kind of her to try and help the fox that is in discomfort.

There is nothing you go do @Sunnyday14558 . It’s not illegal, you don’t have to like it, but we all do things our neighbours don’t like and unless it is unlawful there’s nothing to be done. Don’t let it eat you up.

fyi the noise is more likely mating/communicating than fighting

YANBU
Foxes are vermin and carry diseases. They also attack people's pets.

We will have to disagree.
I say technically correct because yes, that figure is right. But not correct in a sense or view that we can carry on as we are and we have far more we can and perhaps should build on.

All sorts of wildlife are finding their environment picked off because of humans.
Even if you say foxes are coming into urban areas because of KFC litter who produces that ! Humans do.

We don’t know the lady who is feeding the foxes. Nor her age nor name. I wasn’t advocating people should feed foxes. Just that we should acknowledge we have encroached on their and many other species environment and we don’t own the planet.

I read an anecdote from a (male) dog behaviourist about an explorer in a frozen wasteland deterring the wolves that had begun to circle his house by peeing round the perimeter. Not sure it should be normalised.

People really need to stop believing what they heard about foxes when they were being read bedtime stories.

Foxes don't kill for pleasure, they kill for food and, being intelligent creatures, will store (or cache) additional meat in the knowledge that they will be able to eat it later.

They're far less a risk to children than the family dog - they're less likely to trip them up coming down the stairs, for a start - and it's not their fault stupid humans put some of their natural food sources (rabbits, rodents, poultry) in shabby little cages and boxes with fuck all protection or create other food sources by running over cats with their cars or by putting carrion - as in chicken carcasses and the like - in flimsy plastic bags on the street.

Like all wild animals (and cats, dogs, sheep, cows, horses, fwuffy ickle bunny wabbits...), they may bite if frightened, trapped, wounded or if their young are disturbed or put at risk.

The only murderous little bastards in the equation are humans.

Fox cubs are born in February, start to come out of the den in April and the family will then disperse in July. So they will all be gone soon.

Foxes and other carrion eaters are a really essential part of the ecosystem. Don’t demonise them.

I think its important to keep things in perspective. It's "extremely rare" for foxes to attack people, as the first line in the first article you attacked explained. It's very laudable that you're so keen to protect children from injury, but you'd prevent far more accidents if you campaigned against trampolines, playground equipment, or even the humble pencil - all of which cause far more (and more serious) injuries to children than foxes do.

Foxes do attack and kill small pets (not usually cats, which are almost as big as foxes and generally more than capable of using their claws to defend themselves). But really, that's on the owner of the guinea pig/rabbit/chickens, who should be ensuring that their prey-animal pets' accomodation keeps them safe from all predators, be they cats, sparrow hawks, or foxes.

If you feel that foxes (and this thread is about foxes, not badgers) are damaging your decking or shed, wait until the autumn when the cubs have left and then put a pile of leaves, twigs etc in the entrance hole (loose enough that any foxes that are already in can get out). If these remain undisturbed for several days, the foxes are no longer using this space and you can block off the entrance using mesh.

Poisoning foxes causes them huge suffering and is extremely cruel. It's also illegal. Additionally, it is not effective in the long run, as if your garden is attractive to foxes (due to food being left out, easy access to shelter etc), it will be occupied by another fox within days of you poisoning the original one.

If you don't want foxes, make your garden less attractive or try the humane deterrents.

There is a business park behind with overgrown grounds where foxes have their dens, In the past I have had several families of foxes caught on my cctv. I dont feed them in summer because foxes are omnivorous and will eat most anything. I have been known to leave food scraps out in winter but I don't know if its cats or foxes who eat it.

Thank you for the clarification. Tbh it’s only the past couple of weeks when they’ve been really noisy and all over our garden. If they’re leaving soon we can probably just get on with it. Do you know whether they are likely to come back to the same den year after year?

The vixen who chose to have her cubs under our shed never came back. Because we have a quiet enclosed garden, some of the seven cubs did come back to visit several times, often lying on the lawn in the sun, a beautiful sight, until the autumn. None of the local faces have tried to use the same site for a den since then - nearly 10 years ago.

My Labrador prepares herself to attack any trespassing foxes by rolling in their poo regularly. We live rurally and have never been visited by the local fox population because unfortunately for the dog she is showered and deodorised before she is allowed back in the house so our garden still smells of labrador. No self respecting fox will enter the garden of a big dog. The rats tend to give us a wide berth too.

Moles and woodpeckers are actually a bigger problem with regard to lawn maintenance. And my DH has an ongoing battle with the local woodpidgeon population who frequently nest in our garden. We do have Wrens and Robins nesting but they are allowed. DH is a country boy so hates foxes and badgers but loves songbirds, apart from the blackbird that wakes him up every morning singing its heart out outside our bedroom window.

Foxes are vermin and will kill a whole coop of chickens without eating a bite. Badgers carry TB so frequently end up as road kill locally although it’s unlikely they were hit by a car. And as for deer they are a bloody menace. I probably see at least one deer a week killed on our road, unfortunately it’s usually the youngsters. My DS hit one last year, he did go back to make sure it was dead, but it had done £3k of damage to his car. The road we live on has grassy banked verges so when a deer jumps down in front of you it’s either you or them.

I've had foxes in my garden for year, causing no problems. The only poo issue is when they leave a 'thank you' if I put some leftovers out for them which I do occasionally. (I mean, a card or maybe a flower would be nice, but clearly we see these things differently). They also got rid of a potential rat problem. You could fox proof your garden. They won't have made a den next door because she's been enticing them in - it must seem better than the local woodland to them. Tbh, I love watching my foxes. Badgers have started arriving as well. It's fascinating, like my own private Springwatch.

Foxes made a den under my shed about 8 years ago and they had six babies and it was wonderful to see them all running around. Some of the adults visit my garden daily, which I enjoy.

That said, they can be a total pain for all the reasons mentioned, so I’m not surprised you’re not happy.

Incidentally, ours dug a massive tunnel between mine and my neighbours garden 😫

Sorry but that’s not true

I agree

We have had foxes living nearby for decades, very rarely any bother at all.

Then a neighbour decided to start feeding them and it's become absolute hell the past couple of years.

They feed them raw chicken from their door, morning and evening which the foxes then take to neighbouring gardens to consume, discarding anything they don't want and burying the surplus. They hang around for hours, waiting to be fed and defecate, urinate and vomit everywhere, they frequently pull the bins out and bring rubbish into our gardens on a daily basis.

What concerns me most of all is that the vixen no longer has any fear of human beings and will enter our properties if we leave the door open. Two weeks ago, I was putting washing out and I saw the vixen coming out of my backdoor with my cats bowl of biscuits. Unfortunately my cat must have tried to defend himself because he had a puncture wound to his shoulder and I've ended up with a vets bill for over £200.

There is no speaking to this individual as they have convinced themselves that the foxes will die without them feeding them and won't hear any different.

The reality is, that it is they themselves, that are the biggest threat to these wild animals because they have broken down the animals natural defense, caution around humans and made them visible during daylight hours rather than after dusk.

I'm all for helping nature, put out a bowl of water and maybe offer some dog biscuits when it's very cold but to feed twice daily, despite knowing the distress it is causing your neighbours is another level of selfish.

No self respecting fox will enter the garden of a big dog

Then the foxes that are noisily shagging in our garden and making our 60kg dog go crazy must not be very self respecting!

I still love them though.

It's your responsibility to keep your dog under control. Why was it able to leave YOUR garden?

No they don't. Stop spreading lies.