To think that there should be some consequences for Judge Nicholas Rowland

[BerryTwister]

I’ve just read that the boys who raped and filmed 2 girls have had their non custodial sentences changed to custodial ones. Judge Nicholas Rowland had originally let them off with non custodial sentences, but there was a public outcry and the Attorney General got involved. In court today it was stated that he had made a mistake, and the boys were remanded in custody.

I can’t find any information about what happens to Nicholas Rowland. Maybe nothing. But I really think there should be some consequence. Maybe some retraining, or perhaps not being allowed to try cases involving sexual violence against women and girls for a while.

In any other job, if you made such an error of judgement, you wouldn't just be allowed to carry on as you were.

If these boys are unable to understand not to rape, they need to be incarcerated for everyone's sake, effectively forever.

Not for these specific boys, obviously, no.

Generally, yes. Why not do some research if you're interested rather than attacking me for giving an alternative perspective.

So again @EnidSpyton if they don’t know, and can’t be made aware that rape and other violence is wrong, should they be out with a 24/7 close supervised, male only staffed setting?

Agree
Same with judge Nolan in Ireland
Let's rapists go free with an "ah well he's a good father and has a job ". .
Whereas he has jailed single mothers for shop lifting

And you’re not being attacked Enid, you’re telling posters their responses are ‘knee jerk” for not thinking restorative justice is the way forward.

It's a joke. They come from a community who are lawless, meaning they are outside society and don't abide by any rules of society, regard themselves as impervious and superior to those rules. What message does this send to law abiding people?

We don't know that they can't be made aware. They weren't showing full awareness during the court process. That doesn't mean they can't learn and be supported to understand in future.

Saying they should be locked up forever is ridiculous when considering the reality that these are 14 year olds.

Well yes, the boys and their well being is of course the priority.

Saying they should be locked up forever is ridiculous when considering the reality that these are 14 year olds.

If a boy is capable of gang rape he is capable of gang rape.

I don't think this is something one 'grows out of'.

This 'restorative justice' lark puts me in mind of how the elders of a church might socially pressure a victim to meet with and 'forgive' a perpetrator's pathetic lies of apology, framing it as being for the victim's own good as well as the perpetrator's. Sadly, the victim often comes to believe that they need to forgive the perpetrator and will force themselves to do so, and are then re-victimised regularly by being forced to treat the perpetrator like any fellow churchgoer.

Frankly I have no idea how, in cases of rape and sexual abuse, allowing the perpetrator to have a chance to revel in their victim's suffering and vulnerability, is supposed to be 'healing' to the victim, or helping the perpetrator understand what they've done (as though they don't already).

These boys can't be simultaneously so immature, naïve and incapable that they "didn't understand" they were gang raping two girls, while also being mature enough to learn from the experience, engage with rehabilitation and complete community service.

You can't have it both ways.

Repeated gang rape isn't something that happens absent-mindedly or by accident.

I think the word 'opportunity' here is utterly offensive, whether applied to the boys - why should they be given 'opportunities' as a reward for rape? - or the girls - what kind of 'opportunity' is it to re-encounter the rapists who have traumatised you?

It's not about the boys' wellbeing being the priority.

It's thinking realistically about the effectiveness of whatever punishment is given and what will prevent them from committing the same crime again. Punishment is not just about making someone suffer for what they've done - it has to also involve enabling that person to understand what they've done and want to not commit that crime again.

In the UK, rape is not a crime that is legally punishable with life imprisonment. So at some point anyone who is imprisoned for rape (as their sole crime) will be released back into the community.

If proper support and education and rehabilitation has been carried out, that person should ideally be able to reintegrate into society successfully and not reoffend.

The reality is that for most prisoners, this doesn't happen effectively or with any consistency. When you factor in prisoners with learning needs or low intelligence, rehabilitation is even more complex.

So if these boys are not given appropriate support around their sentence, they may well reoffend, and what kind of justice will that be for the victims?

In the UK, rape is not a crime

FTFY.

https://rapecrisis.org.uk/get-informed/the-decriminalisation-of-rape/

https://www.uolprobono.co.uk/post/understanding-britain-s-decriminalisation-of-rape

https://victimscommissioner.org.uk/news/the-distressing-truth-is-that-if-you-are-raped-in-britain-today-your-chances-of-seeing-justice-are-slim/

Many victims of crimes do want to engage with their perpetrator.

You might find that surprising, but there's a reason why restorative justice exists. Obviously it doesn't work for everyone, but it does for some.

This, it’s another condescending version of “educate yourself” isn’t it?

If they can commit gang rapes at the tender age of 13/14, what the fuck are they going to escalate to as adult men? The fact that they're already doing that at such a young age just goes to show how deeply dangerous they are - it's a point against them, not a point in their favour.

Not to mention, their learning disabilities, lack of self control, and (apparent) inability to understand something as simple as 'rape is bad' at an age where they well should, means they're quite unlikely to ever actually understand that rape is bad. They might be driven by their own self interest enough to learn that 'rape could lead to jail, and jail is bad', but I think it's clear they don't give a shit about hurting girls, and never will.

When these sorts of situations come up, I always find myself thinking: Humans aren't an endangered species. There's no burning need to try to preserve the ones that insist on hurting other people.

Perhaps we should forget trying to deal with men raping.

Maybe we need to start teaching women to get better at dealing with being rapees, instead.

Instead of all that pointless community service, offer victims the opportunity to better themselves through a series of helpful courses:

How to be gracious and not make 'knee jerk' reactions when discussing rape sentencing guidelines.

How to consider the rights of rapists without judging

How to thoughtfully balance the rapist's trauma with his rehabilitation potential

How to not be unpleasant when complaining about rape rates

We could have that woman who got put in jail for her tweets in to advise on how to avoid being offensive and reactionary.

What was it she got for her inflammatory tweet? Two years, was it?

Absolutely. The entire framing is horrifically offensive. And frankly, I have doubts as to whether 'restorative justice' has ever been genuinely helpful for victims of sexual violence.

Women are socialised to forgive, to turn our loathing inwards, to be ashamed instead of angry, to smooth things over, to minimise, to make excuses for our abusers, and blame ourselves...we're as good at being self-destructive as men are at being destructive. So I have to doubt whether restorative justice is actually healing and helpful, or just a woman doing what she feels is expected of her, and telling herself it's helped.

There are guidelines but he chose to interpret and apply them in the most lenient fashion

One has a question, If there are youth detention centres, what the hell are they for If not for young people raping girls? What do you need to do to end up in a youth detention centre if rape doesn’t automatically lead to a custodial sentence.

Possibly for really serious stuff like tweets?

Shoplifting, maybe.

https://www.hampshire.police.uk/news/hampshire/news/news/2025/september/teenage-boy-from-hythe-sentenced-to-six-month-detention-and-training-order/

It’ll never happen. If you know what happens with family courts, you’ll never trust any system again.

Do you mean the woman who was inciting mass murder? That trivial little misdomeaner?