White working class children

[NotAnotherScarf]

The bbc has a report about a review of the academic system failing white working class children. The bulk of the population.

It's brilliant that this has been looked at but the recommendations are appalling.

Basically its saying that wcc's are only fit for manual jobs. That schools should push towards offering for vocational courses.

That's where my education went 40 years ago. One child from my year group of 242 went to university at 18. We had at most 6 kids from non white backgrounds. Many went subsequently. I have always maintained the school saw us as shop assistants, factory hands and dockers.

The other recommendations will help children of all races...free travel under 22. Promoting reading etc.

One of the reasons why kids from other backgrounds are doing better has been the push to get them into university...ie black boys being actively recruited and bursarys being given solely to them. Places sponsored etc etc.

Whilst I welcome the move to vocational training. And for many people thats a brilliant move, ts disappointing that the report thinks that that's the main option for wcc's. Basically its says "we don't think your good enough for anything else " .

BBC News - White working-class children 'failed by schools system' - BBC News
www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cq51j10q601o

Where did this happen?! I was unfortunately close to one of the investigations and havent heard this dog stuff before!

what happened to those girls is nothing short of horrific and she was absolutely abused and definitely sounds like there is some us v them prejudice against people from different backgrounds here, and these girls happened to be white.

their actions are inexcusable and point to a really deep hatred of women number one

but on the specific point of racism no, because racism is prejudice + power and in every other scenario aside from this foul foul one those girls, like myself do not suffer on account of being white.

i think there is so real work that needs to go into understanding that disdain that was had and how it was brought about, is it generational trauma from racial abuse that people in the community face. I know many Pakistani friends whose friends and family get racially abused often. Is it a reaction to that, that deep seated hatred? I don’t know

No white people have not faced racism. No white supremacy was constructed by white people to benefit white people. We are not the victims of it.

that doesn’t mean bad things don’t happen to white people and it could even be done to them because they are white but white people do not suffer from racism. How are we this deluded. Why must we try and paint ourselves as victims constantly, it’s so embarrassing

Please let's not get into too much detail on this thread though...I've read a bit of the report but couldn't finish as it was too horrible.

Thanks.
I’ll pass that nugget on to my friends from school who were raped and told it was all white girls were good for because white girls are all slags and scum. I’m sure they’ll be so relieved to hear they’re privileged and that they didn’t actually face any racism.

Phew
For other readers, this is exactly what they faced when trying to report their rapes, attacks and attempted murders.

Naming the city isn’t going to traumatise anyone

Racism exists due to white people and white supremacy. White people benefit from racism they aren’t victims of it

• this is a weird and unhelpful outlook. White people certainly have created some forms of racism but other forms have nothing to do with white people. How does your framework explain discrimination and in some eras, slavery of, Sub Saharan Africans by Arabs? Or for that matter, the Hindu caste system, which appears to have originated with lighter skinned invaders mistreating the original, darker skinned population (which also fed into colourism)? In a sense to say white people have invented all racism is to say that they've had ultimate control over all of the world always, which is obviously not true.

white supremacy benefits white people. Like patriarchy benefits men.

it doesn’t mean that white people still don’t suffer.

im sorry that happened to your friend. I hope she’s ok now and she’s got a strong support network around her

They’ve been raped- what importance do they put on the need to be acknowledged as victims of racism in that context? Genuine question, is that actually a concern of theirs or something you’ve assumed to use in this response?

It matters because it means other girls will be targeted for the same reason.

The same reason it matters if anyone is targeted for assault because of their race.

We can’t stop it if we don’t acknowledge patterns of behaviour and address the motives.

It was 2012 and I was sitting in presentations over the course of 2 years working on the project. I don’t work there anymore and don’t have access to the files of evidence. I linked the articles that talked about the project I’m referring to but can’t access schools data and dept of education data or presentations anymore.

A simple google could’ve helped you debunk yourself

No, sorry, I just meant let's not get into too much detail of what crimes exactly happened.

Imagine if they had said that about non WC. There would have been outrage. Kids should get treated the same and given the same opportunities. Regardless of skin colour.

You mean these claims are inaccurate? So the Arab slave trade and the Hindu caste system were caused by white people?

Or do you mean something else?

Apologies.
That was me. I’ll not do that again. It’s not what this thread is about.

Err because the fact that there are more white men in the UK than men of other ethnicities might have something to do with it?

You should look at the per capita statistics instead:

It sounds like their being white was a factor...and that's relevant to know how we can protect other girls and stop this happening again.

It's difficult to disentangle though. Hatred of white people seems to have been a factor, but also the girls were despised & targeted because they were vulnerable and unprotected, not simply white.

The fact Sikh and Hindu girls were targeted suggests religious/ethnic animosity towards non Pakistani and non Muslims generally was probably a factor too. Those girls were less likely to be from vulnerable families in the same way, but there was clearly still animosity there.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-18092605

And general misogyny/sense of absolute control over women in the cases where Muslim girls within the community were targeted.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=www.mwnuk.co.uk/go_files/resources/UnheardVoices.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwjoxMG8jq2VAxV1Q_EDHTe7O1MQFnoECCAQAQ&usg=AOvVaw3Hw9uNMmyuZFBMiOsoOyfh

Thank you - I can understand wanting to get across how terrible it was, especially when some pps are downplaying the racial element. People need to understand..

You say it's still happening and still just as hard to report : are the police still corrupt then? Ignoring the abuse? This is terrible...

personally I don't find that Critical Race Theory destroying hope and ambition in ethnic minorities especially young black boys to be amusing. But it's rather disturbing that you do find it amusing...

Agree.

You only have to read threads on Mumsnet to see how unwilling people still are to listen and accept that this is common.

maybe look into them you’ll have the answer to your question

the Arab slave trade was no where near as race motivated as the later transatlantic slave trade. Most historians argue that colourism played a role but it wasn’t the driving feature which is was for the transatlantic slave trade and religion was a bigger driver

and whilst the caste system was a well established part of Hinduism again most historians state that there’s no real evidence that it meant colour as such prior to British colonisation even if there was intersection of ideas.

such whataboutery. On the world stage it is white peoples that have weaponised race and used it to enslave or pillage the world, yet we’re trying to make it seem like it’s nbd because at one point Arabs might have been racist too?

I don’t think people are shrugging and saying “oh well it’s their problem”. However it’s important to identify the problem correctly as a first step to fixing it. In my cousin’s case, the focus on racism, segregated schools and poverty meant that the issue of parental non involvement has been overlooked. As a result, billions has been spent on anti-racism teaching initiatives, years spent trying to cajole white parents into sending their children to underperforming Black schools/getting Black children into successful majority white schools to ‘end segregation’ and throwing money at state of the art facilities for low income Black children. The result: test scores have barely moved because these children are not being raised to understand the importance of education so all the money and resources in the world barely makes a difference.

Transporting the issue here to the UK, underachieving WWC boys are not going to start doing better at school until and unless they are encouraged to at home. Throwing more money at vocational courses and apprenticeships is not the answer because, as already mentioned upthread, those pathways are now extremely competitive. These WWC boys won’t get the minimum exam results required for them.

What is the solution? I genuinely don’t know. Perhaps targeting the parents with as much outreach as possible to get them more involved in their children’s education. I was raised by two immigrants who instilled the importance of a good education. I can’t pretend know how to break poverty of aspiration as it’s not something I’ve experienced. It’s a conundrum.

I disagree.

Children even at a young age are aware of the concept of certain things being 'not for the likes of us', of words like 'posh', and of how people who like to read or use vocabulary that is considered unusual, or who are interested in culture deemed 'posh' are perceived or treated in their family and wider community.