To be honest in my reference letter?

[IamAporcupine]

I have been asked to provide a reference letter for an employee who recently left my team. She has already been offered a new job in a completely different field. This is fortunate as her performance in her previous role was very poor; we lost time and money thanks to her lack of skills.

The form has a "would you re-employ this person?" I want to be honest and just say "No". I can explain that I believe this field of work was not for her, and that she will very likely perform well in her new job.

AIBU?

As the OP says, the job she has been offered is in a completely different field. Something this woman may excel in that is nothing to do with the OP's role. Why be spiteful and deprive her of that chance to improve her life? Unless there is a drip-feed pending, it doesn't sound like this employee has done anything nefarious or dishonest, just that she made some mistakes along the way. If she is a conscientious, honest worker who just wasn't a right fit for the role, OP should just say "yes" on the form and move on.

also “would you employed her again”
is a bit of a moot point when It’s the same employer. They basically already have 😆

my company you have to mark in the system on their exit paper work whether we should employ them again so this doesn’t happen. They wouldn’t get through the recruitment

Sorry it was it wasn’t useful enough to you

Mmm I'd say that it is 50/50?
It was me who hired her and of course I blame myself for not having trusted my instinct. But the fact she ended up being so bad, it is not my fault!

Yeah I'd run that past your HR department before committing professional suicide......

Did you fire her?

Honestly this is not worth the hassle. Just write a factual reference stating dates of employment and leave it at that. You’re opening yourself up to risk if you add detail, especially if there wasn’t any formal processes regarding performance carried out or sanctions issued.

But that's exactly what I said I wanted to say! "no, I would not employ her again, but I do believe her new role is perfect for her.

By the way, I did tell her something along those lines in our final meeting. I suggested this was probably not not a field for her. She fully agreed and said, yes I just wanted to have a final shot before changing career.

Do you have an HR department? If so, do they know you are writing this? I've worked in 3 law firms over the last 18 years and NO ONE gives references like that, it's an enormous litigation risk. Any reference request is referred back to HR who confirm name, dates of employment. End of story.

Plus you'd have to be a real nasty piece of work to do this, especially if you think the new role is better for her.

No, it's not an internal transfer as such. She finished her contract with us and they applied for a different position in a (completely) different department

Just confirm dates and job title. It’s madness to risk anything else and I’m really surprised your employer allows it.

Like this. 👍

@IamAporcupine you need to check with your HR Department whether you're permitted to provide a reference.

The last reference a Manager gave off his own back in my old company ended up with the new role being withdrawn and the company being sued. The manager was disciplined too for not following policy and handing the request to HR for a standard response.

As I said, references within academia are always dealt with like this, HR would know fuck all about you and/ or your performance .

And no, I might be a bit stupid, but I'm definitely not a nasty piece of work. I do not intend to jeopardise her new position at all. She already has two references from previous jobs; they only want mine because it is more recent. I just did not want to lie, that's all.

No, her contract finished.

Just tick yes. It doesn't harm you.

What if you tick no and she loses her new job.

You could be sued for giving a bad reference if she thinks it wasn’t justified.

Just say "yes if an opportunity arose" which isnt lying. "An opportunity" = the right opportunity.

Or put "N/A as employee remains employed by XXX institution"

but I would not be giving her a bad reference! i was explicitly told not to bother with the reference letter and to just complete those two sections.

I just didn't feel comfortable saying I (personally) would employ her again, when I clearly would not.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding the question as a PP said

You leave yourself to being liable to being sued if you put anything but fact. Yes/No or N/A.

You can leave it blank. Many do because of the reason above.

Well surely you’d know that it could impact her, if it’s just a tick box and you genuinely believe she’ll be good in her new role can’t you just tick yes? I think you’re being a bit disingenuous tbh, if they asked for you because you’re more recent then they clearly aren’t just relying on the two she’s already provided.

It sounds like a bad fit and now she’s moving to something that’s a better fit vs she just didn’t care or was deliberately a bad employee. You could jeopardise her new job. No one is actually asking you to employ her again so my view is I’d feel far less comfortable potentially screwing someone over for a move that could be good for them.

we lost time and money thanks to her lack of skills.

So your company didn't train or recruit her properly but it's her fault? Wow.

So, she fulfilled her role until her contract ended.
So yes, the reference should be positive.

What ‘would you employ this person again’ means is ‘was this person sacked/almost sacked/a thief/someone who didn’t turn up for work’ basically are they unemployable, it isn’t actually asking if YOU would employ them again in the same role, it’s saying we know no one will give a bad reference so here is your opportunity to put an X in the no box if this person is a wrong’un but you are too afraid to tell us because you don’t want to be sued.

Do you work for a small company without a HR advisor? Most bigger firms only confirm job title, dates worked and maybe reason for leaving. You are opening yourself up for possible issues if you give much more.