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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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9
BlueberryVibes · 19/05/2026 23:07

Did you mean to say that you were grateful to live in a society where the state was able to step in when you were no longer able to meet your child's care needs?

I didn't say those exact words, but I did say I was grateful. Twice.

AllTheOddSocks · 19/05/2026 23:08

ByQuaintAzureWasp · 19/05/2026 19:49

Your pension will cost you 7-8% as its taken before tax. You must really try to re-join when you can.

Agree that @Eudaimonia11 should not leave the scheme and also curious about how student loan repayment is 15% - why so high a %? And surely only above a certain threshold?

45% of working age people not saving toward a pension at all
Doglover254 · 19/05/2026 23:10

FernFaery · 19/05/2026 17:22

I agree but there are millions not in work and the number is rising.

1.84 m out of work. Not millions

NorthXNorthWest · 19/05/2026 23:10

BlueberryVibes · 19/05/2026 23:02

Did you mean to say that you were grateful to live in a society where the state was able to step in when you were no longer able to meet your child's care needs?

My 35 year old child? Of course I am grateful for her situation now. It doesn't alter the fact that my actions in not accepting a placement offered when she was 16 has saved a huge amount of taxpayer money that would have been spent on her care. That's just fact.

It has been a mutually beneficial arrangement for you and your daughter, yet there seems to be very little acknowledgement or gratitude towards the state and the wider society that also helped support it through taxpayers and public services for both the care and your pension.

Pallegoose · 19/05/2026 23:13

jumpingjohnny · 19/05/2026 21:06

UC takes pension contributions into account, so you would get more in UC if you pay into a pension. And I'm assuming being on the breadline would entitle you to at least some UC.

Yep, I pay a large amount extra into my pension and UC just take the amount on my payslip as my wage (after the pension has been deducted), so I get a decent pension contribution (which is grossed up) and also qualify for UC, which also means free prescriptions, lower water bills and other advantages like reduced entry to attractions.

Dragonflyspeeding · 19/05/2026 23:16

NorthXNorthWest · 19/05/2026 23:10

It has been a mutually beneficial arrangement for you and your daughter, yet there seems to be very little acknowledgement or gratitude towards the state and the wider society that also helped support it through taxpayers and public services for both the care and your pension.

That is what society is though.
Society helps the vulnerable. That is why we take immigrants at risk in their own country, send funds to wartorn countries etc etc etc

How can you not grasp that?

PrettyPickle · 19/05/2026 23:16

In the 1980s, only around 40–45% of working‑age people paid into any private pension, and only about half of employers offered a pension scheme at all. Today, because of auto‑enrolment, around 88% of employees are in a workplace pension and over 85% of employers provide one. Pension coverage is far higher now than it was in the 80s.

The real looming issue isn’t that people aren’t paying into pensions, auto‑enrolment means the vast majority now do. The problem is that the UK has a much smaller young workforce and a rapidly growing older population. Fewer workers are supporting more retirees, which puts long‑term pressure on the State Pension, the NHS, and social care. This is exactly what the ONS, IFS, and OECD have been warning about for years.

Younger people today often say they can’t afford to pay into a pension, and there’s truth in that, their disposable income is tighter than older generations had at the same age. But it’s also true that today’s standard of living and expectations are much higher: more holidays, more eating out, more subscriptions, more tech, and a general lifestyle that simply didn’t exist in the 80s or 90s.

The real structural issue isn’t pension participation anymore, it’s the shrinking young workforce and the rapidly growing older population. Fewer workers supporting more retirees is the real long‑term pressure on the system.

Franjipanl8r · 19/05/2026 23:22

XenoBitch · 19/05/2026 23:01

So you base your whole life around work? That is sad.

The complete opposite actually - I’ve worked as little as possible and done loads of travelling and wonderful things and spent lots of time with my kids. There’s nothing fun I’ve saved up to do when I’m old and my body’s too knackered to do it. Now I’m mid 40s, I need to get working and earning some money and plan on doing that until I die.

TheKittenswithMittens · 19/05/2026 23:22

PrettyPickle · 19/05/2026 23:16

In the 1980s, only around 40–45% of working‑age people paid into any private pension, and only about half of employers offered a pension scheme at all. Today, because of auto‑enrolment, around 88% of employees are in a workplace pension and over 85% of employers provide one. Pension coverage is far higher now than it was in the 80s.

The real looming issue isn’t that people aren’t paying into pensions, auto‑enrolment means the vast majority now do. The problem is that the UK has a much smaller young workforce and a rapidly growing older population. Fewer workers are supporting more retirees, which puts long‑term pressure on the State Pension, the NHS, and social care. This is exactly what the ONS, IFS, and OECD have been warning about for years.

Younger people today often say they can’t afford to pay into a pension, and there’s truth in that, their disposable income is tighter than older generations had at the same age. But it’s also true that today’s standard of living and expectations are much higher: more holidays, more eating out, more subscriptions, more tech, and a general lifestyle that simply didn’t exist in the 80s or 90s.

The real structural issue isn’t pension participation anymore, it’s the shrinking young workforce and the rapidly growing older population. Fewer workers supporting more retirees is the real long‑term pressure on the system.

Edited

That's how it is.

XenoBitch · 19/05/2026 23:24

Franjipanl8r · 19/05/2026 23:22

The complete opposite actually - I’ve worked as little as possible and done loads of travelling and wonderful things and spent lots of time with my kids. There’s nothing fun I’ve saved up to do when I’m old and my body’s too knackered to do it. Now I’m mid 40s, I need to get working and earning some money and plan on doing that until I die.

That makes no sense, sorry. You said you would rather work than retire, as retirement sounds boring. Then said the opposite.

Kirbert2 · 19/05/2026 23:26

Dragonflyspeeding · 19/05/2026 23:16

That is what society is though.
Society helps the vulnerable. That is why we take immigrants at risk in their own country, send funds to wartorn countries etc etc etc

How can you not grasp that?

Yep.

It also only seems to be certain people that have to trip over themselves to express eternal gratitude for the support they receive despite the fact that many people receive support through the state in several different ways, especially if you have children.

NorthXNorthWest · 19/05/2026 23:27

Dragonflyspeeding · 19/05/2026 23:16

That is what society is though.
Society helps the vulnerable. That is why we take immigrants at risk in their own country, send funds to wartorn countries etc etc etc

How can you not grasp that?

Our society? yes. All societies? No.

Can you genuinely not grasp the concept of gratitude?

It was a two-way benefit, despite the constant emphasis on the “favour” supposedly being done for the state.

The minute the child was born, a reciprocal relationship also began through healthcare, benefits, support and wider taxpayer-funded services like adult residential care.

That poster did make sacrifices, but the arrangement was never entirely one-sided, however much they want to lead with "I have saved the state x".

ticktickticktickBOOM · 19/05/2026 23:30

Franjipanl8r · 19/05/2026 23:22

The complete opposite actually - I’ve worked as little as possible and done loads of travelling and wonderful things and spent lots of time with my kids. There’s nothing fun I’ve saved up to do when I’m old and my body’s too knackered to do it. Now I’m mid 40s, I need to get working and earning some money and plan on doing that until I die.

I was really full of energy when I was 45/46. Now that I'm 51 I have aches and pains that seem to appear from nowhere and every injury or illness takes twice as long to recover from - and I have kept myself fit!

I worry how you're going to find working once your body feels old and knackered. Working is much harder than holidays and fun stuff that's for sure!

NorthXNorthWest · 19/05/2026 23:31

Kirbert2 · 19/05/2026 23:26

Yep.

It also only seems to be certain people that have to trip over themselves to express eternal gratitude for the support they receive despite the fact that many people receive support through the state in several different ways, especially if you have children.

If you want to present yourself as a martyr, don't be surprised if people pick you up on it.

Dragonflyspeeding · 19/05/2026 23:36

NorthXNorthWest · 19/05/2026 23:27

Our society? yes. All societies? No.

Can you genuinely not grasp the concept of gratitude?

It was a two-way benefit, despite the constant emphasis on the “favour” supposedly being done for the state.

The minute the child was born, a reciprocal relationship also began through healthcare, benefits, support and wider taxpayer-funded services like adult residential care.

That poster did make sacrifices, but the arrangement was never entirely one-sided, however much they want to lead with "I have saved the state x".

You keep missng the point.

There is no hierarchy of vulnerbility.
The child could have been born to a junkie mother, a rape victim, a prisoner. Society has to protect the most vulnerable including those who cannot live independently and need constant care, we cannot make humans feel 'less than' or insist they must be 'grateful' for finding themselves in a position not of their choosing.

BoredZelda · 19/05/2026 23:39

Whysnothingsimple · 19/05/2026 20:36

Many of the comments on here absolutely suggest that there are many people on here who absolutely cannot imagine and empathise with other’s circumstances. I’m sure there are plenty of well off people who can imagine and empathise with the situation of others they just don’t seem to be on this thread.

Given I’m the only one you asked to disclose my status, and few others have done the same, that’s a wild statement to make. What you mean is, people aren’t agreeing with you therefore they must not feel empathy for those on low wages. Looking through the thread, I haven’t seen anyone suggest those on low incomes should forego their basic needs in order to save for their retirement.

PhaedraTwo · 19/05/2026 23:43

FernFaery · 19/05/2026 17:21

Mine too. No doubt it’ll become ‘means tested’ so, as ever, the sensible among us will be no better off than those who didn’t bother because ‘why shouldn’t they have it, do you want them to starve etc’

Oh I'm one of "the sensible" I'm also fully aware that what I earn is way, way, way above average and that many working people simply can't afford to pay into a pension. My son for example, degree in music, which he uses working with adults and children with learning disabilities. He's a long way to go before he retires but I expect he will rely on inheriting from his parents. I don't begrudge universal pension.

NorthXNorthWest · 19/05/2026 23:48

Dragonflyspeeding · 19/05/2026 23:36

You keep missng the point.

There is no hierarchy of vulnerbility.
The child could have been born to a junkie mother, a rape victim, a prisoner. Society has to protect the most vulnerable including those who cannot live independently and need constant care, we cannot make humans feel 'less than' or insist they must be 'grateful' for finding themselves in a position not of their choosing.

You keep missing the point.

Ditto

But we can tell the government and by default tax payers to be "grateful"

Pistachiocake · 19/05/2026 23:49

FernFaery · 19/05/2026 17:27

So you can’t afford to be self employed? Should you be looking for a job with a workplace pension?

Not always easy to get, these days. A lot of self-employed people are only self-employed because they tried, for literally years, to get a good "normal" job, with maternity, sick pay and pensions that lots of us enjoy. It's not even necessarily that they couldn't find one in the field they qualified for; lots of people started up their own business because they couldn't find any job at all. This can be the case for older workers in particular, or those with children with additional needs, who needed more flexibility than many jobs can give.

BlueberryVibes · 19/05/2026 23:51

If you want to present yourself as a martyr, don't be surprised if people pick you up on it

Ouch.

redcarandthebluecarhadarace26 · 19/05/2026 23:55

I pay in via my work and then £10-20pm into a private pension but that’s all I can stretch to
I earn 28.5k and my mortgage is going up £120pm in October so it’s tight

GreenCaterpillarOnALeaf · 20/05/2026 00:06

Banking on one of the kids making it big 🤞🤞🤞

No, obviously not (would be nice tho) but it is very worrying. I think a lot of people aren’t properly educated on pensions though. I knew what a mortgage was before I got one and how taxes worked, but I didn’t really know about pensions till I actively looked when I became self employed.

BoredZelda · 20/05/2026 00:08

NorthXNorthWest · 19/05/2026 21:32

That's not nuance, that's binary thinking.

That way of thinking is sometimes very MN-style. Poverty and wealth get treated entirely the only two position when inface it is a spectrum responsibility and individual agency are often downplayed. Of course luck, upbringing, health and opportunity matter. Some people absolutely do start life from a much harder position than others. But there also has to be an expectation that people try to make the best of what they have and take some responsibility for their choices and or social responsibility where they can.

What frustrates me, and I am sure many others, is that when someone shares their own experience of working through hardship, instability or adversity, it often gets dismissed as simply “luck”, as though hard work, determination, discipline and sacrifice played little role at all. The reality is usually somewhere in the middle. Neither “I made it why can't others?” nor “people have almost no control over their outcomes ”fully reflects real life.

This is nuance.

This is exactly the issue. Everyone is either on NMW or earning 6 figure salaries. Nobody on NMW has ever made foolish decisions or spends money unwisely. Nobody on a six figure salary has ever had anything less than the silver spoon they were born with.

Personal responsibility is important across the board, and the fact remains that for many people, particularly young people, pensions are not seen as a necessity, despite them having even a small amount of disposable income they can pay towards it.

I have never put any significant amount of money into my pension but as someone else pointed out, with the employer contributions added on, it’s been the best free money I ever got. I was really surprised how little you could put into a pension and still do ok, but the key is you have to start really young.

Eudaimonia11 · 20/05/2026 00:08

AllTheOddSocks · 19/05/2026 23:08

Agree that @Eudaimonia11 should not leave the scheme and also curious about how student loan repayment is 15% - why so high a %? And surely only above a certain threshold?

I’m glad we all agree that I should not stop pension contributions. Unfortunately, whilst it would be lovely to reach retirement age, I do need to keep myself alive, housed, and fed before then too! It’s a bit of a bugger!

Undergraduate loan 9%
Postgraduate loan 6%
9+6=15

Dragonflyspeeding · 20/05/2026 00:14

NorthXNorthWest · 19/05/2026 23:48

You keep missing the point.

Ditto

But we can tell the government and by default tax payers to be "grateful"

Edited

Who is telling taxpayers to be grateful?
Are you referrrng to the poster who looked after her disabled child? Do you really think she did it for the meagre payment she received from the gov?

Surely she was simply stating facts when she was defending her positon of not paying into a private pension because she didn't have enough disposable income to do so.

The alternative would have been for her to work outside the home, earn a salary and pay into a pension. Instead she did more than an institution could ever have done for a fraction of the cost and to her absolute financial detriment as she now faces quite a bleak retirement?

Carers all over the country are in a similar position and we should never underestimate the valuable contribution they make to society. The vulnerable in our society could not survive without the carers and volunteers who put others before themselves.