Andy Burnham - how can this be allowed?

[Boopybop]

I know that there is a long way to go over the coming weeks, with by-elections and leadership challenges. But fundamentally - how can it be right that a man who was not even a candidate in the General Election, was therefore not voted for in the General Election - become Prime Minister? Effectively, the people of Makerfield are selecting the country’s new Prime Minister (as it is pretty obvious that AB would win a leadership contest).

This feels wholly undemocratic in every way.

AIBU - Andy Burnham has every right to become PM

AINBU - it is not right that a by-election in Makerfield can determine who the next Prime Minister will be

I hope AB walks away with nothing, same for Angela waiting so obviously at the side.

I don't take a great interest in politics, but extraordinary to me that out of, what, 400 odd labour MP’s not one of them is up to the job so they’ve got to parachute a popular media figure into save the day.

Politics has become such a bear pit, what sort of idiot would want to be one anymore!

By the time Labour gets a new prime minister in place the electorate will be demanding a general election. The new leader will only have 2 years max to try and sort things out.

I wonder about that, actually. We never got to a critical mass of the public doing that during the other mid term PM swaps in the last decade, and there's a good chunk of people who are fearful of instability.

1st post nails it..
You vote for an mp 1st, which may mean the party has a majority...then they elect their leader

He has tried twice previously to be leader and failed, they are really desperate now, would be funny if Reform put up a candidate and won the seat! They are just a clown show walking now, there is no one they have available that can beat Reform in a GE, they are all just running on ego and completely out of touch.

No, that would not be funny, at all.

Or a proper leader runs a GE campaign and the voters vote for that person and their policies more or less i.e Farage at the next GE or Boris when he made the correct noises about Brexit. When they are parachuted in (RS wasn"t even elected by the party members?) the power of that government evaporates quicker than steam.

How did they gamble with G&D? The sitting MP resigned for very good reasons (being found guilty of a crime), the by- election was inevitable.
Or do you think they thought Labour would keep the seat, regardless of who their candidate was? It was pretty obvious to me that only AB was likely to win it for them. Why would anyone vote for an un known to replace a criminal?

I'm a leftie Labour Party member, and also a member of an affiliated union, and I didn't vote for Andy Burnham in 2010 or 2015. I probably will this time if I get the chance but he has a lot of hoops to jump through.

Makerfield voters will not just be voting for the next PM, as if Burnham loses the other candidates are not going to be Labour leader, and any other winner is also not necessarily going to be their party's candidate for leader or PM. If Burnham wins, and it's still a big IF, it's in Labour MPs' hands in this case to decide whether a leadership election takes place. Then he needs to get

I don't argue that this is democratic, just pointing out that one constituency isn't going to get to choose whether the current PM stays and who the next one gets to be.

i think the issue is that a moderate leader won the election and Burnham is very left wing so the tone and policies of the government will change. We didn’t vote for that.

But by that reasoning, why should it just be Makerfield that gets to decide via the back door who is the next PM?

You don't understand how our democratic process works. Did anyone vote for Liz Truss to be Prime Minister?

Suggest you educate yourself. We vote for who we want to be our constituency MP and the overall winning party decides who leads it and therefore who is the PM. That's why we didn't have a GE every time the Tory revolving door gave us a new PM..

Not sure Sunak is the example you want to make the 'wasn't even voted in by the members' point, since he was greatly more stable than the candidate who the wider party picked. He did alright as a glass cliff, caretaker PM in the circumstances really. Bad electoral campaigner for the party but they were fucked anyway.

Its still not how our democracy works
People might be voting with the leader in mind, but our system means anyone within the leading party can be PM

I agree with a lot of this - in the current economic and geopolitical circumstances it would be immensely challenging for any PM of any party to turn things around in the two year's that Labour has had and people's expectations were completely unrealistic.

However I don't think it's just about public perception by any means. There's clearly frustration with Starmer from within the Labour Party because he doesn't seem suited to the job of PM - lots of the decision making, communication, prioritisation and driving things through just doesn't seem to be his strength.

As Labour supporter I don't think we can waste the next three years (could be the only three years of government we get in a generation!) with a PM who hasn't got a grip on getting things done. And I can't see any way we'd win another election with him as leader.

So as painful and difficult as it's going to be I think something has to change.

No you are right, it would be another victory for common sense. The idea that AB is somehow good for the UK is laughable IMO, he has openly said that you can ignore bond markets, that alone should disqualify him from any position in government. On the other hand prudent savers and sensible people looking for a return on their money and a nice crash in the property bubble should be willing these idiots on, I think AR has the slight edge in potential to blow up the UK Gilt market, only a slight edge though.

You’re not being unreasonable.

There was a thread yesterday about how broken the UK democratic system is. It’s long overdue a major overhaul.

Hahahaha. Did you sleep through all the PM changes of the Tory governments?

The country first mantra appears to be ever elusive.

Well, I mean that's bollocks because if we were just voting for Keir Starmer in the 24 GE then there's no way labour would have won because even most labour supporters don't like him

This summed it up for me, yesterday, from the Times:

Labour showing ‘out-of-touch contempt’

The Liberal Democrats have accused Labour of “arrogance” and “out-of-touch contempt” in response to the resignation of Josh Simons to allow Andy Burnham to run for parliament.

Lisa Smart, spokesperson for the Lib Dem Cabinet Office, said: “The arrogance of these men is staggering. To believe that representing a community is a gift to be handed to your mate shows utterly, out-of-touch contempt.

“Labour’s internal psychodrama has triggered this by-election so they should pay for the consequences — all £5 million pounds’ worth of the mayoral election.”

Really! A sittng Tory MP gave up his seat so an by election could be called and Boris ushered in.

Of course not. he was voted in a General Election. He did not ask a Tory MP, in the middle of a Parliament, to shuffle over, call a by election and let him have his seat.

It really is not the same thing or pretty much anything like what Burnham is doing.

Burnham went around asking people to give up their seat, call an expensive by election and usher him in (this last may not happen and be a surprise to the gormless bugger) for a reward which will no doubt become apparent as time jogs on

The markets have responded very negatively to the prospect of Burnham as pm. The cost of borrowing has gone up and value of the pound against the dollar has dropped. That tells you all you need to know. Burnham will most definitely not be good for the UK.

Burnham is very left wing

Nonsense! Burnham was a Blairite. He may have moved leftwards in the last fifteen years but he is very much mainstream centre left Labour.

The only people struggling to justify this will be those who want a hard left Labour party.