To think Andy Burnham will not make Labour any more electable.

[4thweekofjuly]

I think there is little appetite for a new PM and a new Labour leader will make 0 difference to their chances of winning. I also think the best the public can hope for, from any government, is a slow, well managed decline. I don't think there is much of a future in the UK and the public need to accept the social contract is no more. .

of course he won't, because subsidising bus fares just really isn't going to cut through at the national level.

He's held up to the great hope of "true labour" and "proper working class" merely because he has a northern accent. That's all it is.

Nobody lives "in Makerfield". It isn't a town, it's a parliamentary constituency comprising Ashton-in-Makerfield and part of Leigh. Burnham is from Leigh. He's a local candidate.

What about what he’s done in Stockport? Does that kind of thing pass you by? I’d be interested in your thoughts, should you have any.

Yes they do, in the constituency of Makerfield. Where I actually live so I'm fully aware which electoral wards sit within it. I was referring to the constituency as a whole to the OP rather than list Ashton, Bryn, Orrell, Abram etc. I know exactly where Burnham lives as I go past his house several times a week and have seen him out jogging an shopping locally. I'm really confused where you seem to have read that I said he wasn't a local candidate though?

Considering that Reform took the most councils from Labour, the issue is that they're not right enough. Who they seem to be putting forward e.g. Burnham, Rayner, seem to be more left than Keir. Big problem.

I'm equally confused that you seem to think everything I post must be a challenge. I said he was a local candidate and he is. At no point did I claim that you had said otherwise.

Maybe it was the way you were challenging the fact that nobody lived in Makerfield

Why would someone living outside his constituency be aware of what he’s done in Stockport? They aren’t his local constituent, so they’ll be focused on national issues and how he can benefit the Labour Party and the country rather than what he can do for Stockport.

That wasn’t addressed to you, so it’s odd you answered it.
I am waiting for an answer from @oldwhyno who appears to be claiming, wrongly, that Burnham’s only policy is bus fare prices. It’s this kind of nonsense that needs to be challenged.

@Thefastandthecurious5who are you hoping wins the by-election?

I don’t think it’s odd at all that I answered it. @oldwhyno was answering the OP’s question on whether AB will make Labour any more electable, and I agree with her!

She didn’t talk nonsense - I thought she made a lot of sense. She said she didn’t think he wouldn’t make them more electable because all of his achievements - whilst good - are local and not relevant to national politics

She also thinks his working class credentials come down to the fact he has a northern accent. I disagree, as I know he had a working class upbringing and roots.

I really want Labour to win. If they don’t, I hope the Lib Dems win.

I just don’t think Labour will win because of all the reasons I’ve set out in my previous posts, which I’ll summarise here as: there’ll be a merciless briefing campaign against Burnham by Reform, marking him out as a posh and out-of-touch politician because he went to Cambridge and because he left his mayoralty early to further his political ambitions by standing in this seat.

I think Reform will win, Labour will come a close second and the Tories will come third.

To me, this thread shows why politics and government are in the states they are in. Totally unrealistic expectations from the public. Abuse and contempt for any policies people don’t agree with. An unwillingness to face up to structural problems. And ir’s not just the UK. Look across the Channel where Macron’s ratings are in the doldrums. And all because he wanted to make a modest increase to state pension age and modestly reform workers’ rights. Burnham has made a decent fist of it in Manchester. So did Johnson in London. But different from running a national government. But out of interest-why shouldn’t he stand? Politics has always been a game of personal ambition.

Why would Labour turn on each other, pushing out briefings, in this situation? I don’t understand this at all. Labour will want AB to win, because they’ll want him to give them a job in his Cabinet and, if he doesn’t win, that threatens their chances to get re-elected in the future.

Starmer’s allies are the people who would, as they know if he wins he would likely beat Starmer in a leadership contest.

ETA of course others will fight for it too, primarily Reform but no 10 have a knack for undermining threats. A recent example - Karl Turner who’s Labour.

I agree with your other post it’s a close race.

Oh I see, thanks for clarifying. I can see why KS would not want AB to win. I understand now.

and who is the new PM in your scenario..?

@OneTealShaker must want Farage as PM. Why do people think these cranks are the answer to their prayers? We’ll know who to thanks when Reform sell the NHS to Trump.

I agree. Labour have been a dead loss, so a new leader won’t help. Next GE, they are toast. 😉

If Farage gets in at the next GE we’re all toast.

@Boomer55 It’s impossible to get growth when we have such expensive fuel. Employment costs are too high and people aren’t spending. No new leader will change that if they are coming in on a spend, spend, spend agenda. Plus look at the rabble of MPs! Their doorstep interviews won’t improve by changing the deckchairs on the Titanic. People are not going to get richer but they might relish Burnham punishing the better off but job prospects will continue to diminish.

Again, it’s unrealistic expectations. Migration is down. Health is improving.More help is given to children. Renters have more rights. Our Pam has coped with difficult international situations. But because they haven’t worked miracles, they are a dead loss. Investment and Tech are doing quite well compared to our peers. Our policy on energy might not be to everyone’s taste but I see the point of it as it will hopefully give us more energy security. I’m not a fan of Keir Starmer-he doesn’t have the political leadership imo. I also think it was a mistake to say no rise in taxes while increasing business taxes and costs. What do people actually want from a government?

Let's hope the voters of Makerfield upset his plans and he fails to win the seat. Very unwise to take the voters for granted.

Are Reform planning to sell the NHS to Trump?

Do you have a link for that or is it something you just made up. If so next time could you try and weave in an Epstein and "it's all about the oil"angle as well. It would make it look much more sensational.

They have made it clear they want it privatised. They’ll have to sell it to someone and Trump’s money is as good as anyone’s. Let’s see if I’m right.