We have been told that 15 and 16 year olds cannot help the Woman's Institute wash up without every volunteer being police checked at a cost of over £30 for each CRB. Madness or what?

[seekinginspiration]

We have been told that 15 and 16 year olds cannot help the Woman's Institute wash up without every volunteer being police checked at a cost of over £30 for each CRB. Madness or what?

I've checked it out with the D of E people, and yes it is true. Britain has gone bonkers when our legislation will not allow older children to become socially responsible. At 15 and 16 children should be able to be trained to deal with life and hot water. I'd be gobsmacked, if any of the W.I or their husbands would flirt with a volunteer, but even if they did, Britain needs to get a grip. Don't moan about the lazy youth, STOP WRAPPING GOOD YOUNGSTERS UP IN COTTON WOOL... let them help.

BBC Saturday 21st June Anti-stab workshops for children, More than 10 teenagers have been stabbed to death in London this year. Children as young as 10 are taking lessons in how to avoid being stabbed. Specially adapted self-defence classes are being run by a martial arts school at All Souls Clubhouse in Camden, north London, for 10 to 16-year-olds. The workshops will teach youngsters how to deal with confrontations and advise them to run away from potential attackers or hand over their property.
A total of 16 teenagers have died as a result of violent crime in London since the beginning of the year.

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WI washing up ladies in no way fulfil any of those criteria, cod

Yes, we all understand about working in a child-related environment but this is an OLD persons enviroment that youngsters want to work in. The complete opposite. Hence my post about all workplaces being affected.

Completely agree with cod but I would change the system by only requiring each person to have one CRB done every 3 years that would cover them for each organisation they worked with, plus I would make them free.

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fwiw, a person that we knew only got caught when the girl he was molesting got pregnant. he had loads of friends his own age, considered to be a strict but fair dad and rarely voluteered to work with kids. it's fine having guidelines but they rarely allow for they annomalies. hamster is right, the situation is totally different. it's like saying i should insist on CRB for everyone at DSD1(16) work. she's choosing to go into an enviroment where there are adults.

cod, you see paedos in your professional life, don't you? How often are they picked up or prevented from working with kids by a CRB check?

(NB I'm not saying there shouldn't be checks, just that the process seems to be getting out of hand)

Yes,, it's not about the police check, IT IS ABOUT THE MONEY THE C.R.B. criminal Records bureau costs the charity or the local authority. If, as a charity or fund raising charity you are taking a financial risk: stall costs: £50 = cakes (have to pay the cake makers for ingredients these days, and buy the orange juice/ribena, paper plates, plastic cups, and black platic sacks = more than the cost of C.R.B ..ing your volunteers who have to take the woolies plates, plastic glasses and stainless steel forks (because ... in the end - that's what we were offered for free)....... = NO profit for the charity. Please POLICY MAKERS ..... just do one Saturday at a fair ... and then tell me I have to to check the 30 people (cos I'm not quite sure which of them will turn up to man the stall, and then go to the church hall to wash up......... I still dispair!!!

Yes, Ian Huntley has a lot to answer for.

But really it's all the fault of the head teacher who hired him without checking the references. Even a cursory investigation would have revealed that Huntley was a very suspicious character who should not have been allowed around children.

I have about 3 current CRB checks. What a waste of money.

I thought there was something about Huntley though that even if he had been police-checked it wouldn't have flagged up because he wasn't charged for the previous offences. It would only have been apparent by doing a more in-depth check. I could have that wrong though.

Part of the problem with him was that he had moved county - oh, and changed his name I think. A proper check should still have caught him though - eg using Nat Ins number, which the CRB form does require.

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I don't think it is to do with whether people are on their own with children anymore (it used to be). DS is going to do some squash coaching for younger children but he has to be CRB checked, even tho he won't be on his own with the younger ones. Our school even asked for CRB checks for parents helping to walk children back from an event, even tho it was in a crocodile with teachers present. Am all for protecting our children, but it has gone a bit OTT IMHO.

i refused to volunteer at my dc school, because i find it insulting to be asked for a crb chheck. i have two alreaady. i am a qualified teachher as well.
a crb check means absolutly nothing. it is a snapshot of your criminal record. it doesn not show what your inclinations are. you may have been abusing for years and years, but if you havent been caught, then you wont have a record. so it wont be picked up on. it is a complete waste of money imo.

when ds was in reception. he had an accident. being a very young four year old. potty trained for only 11 months. he had an accident with pooh. one of the crb checked mom's was helping with swimming. she proceeded to talk about him in the playground in a horrendous way. he was really traumatised by his accident. he didnt tell anyone. the teachers didnt notice. this woman, i dont know what she did or didnt do. but part of helping out at school includes discretion. how do we weed out such people?

when i volunteered to do work with old people, i had to have a crb check. not the old people. but i was over thirty at the time.

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So would a caution flag up now cod?

I can totally see why school have to be overly careful - cod lists some really good examples of why. What I can't understand is why people have to be CRB checked to be in the same place, at the same time, as a teacher.... is that "the way it is" or have some schools overreacted?

If it's just the money that's the issue, could you:-
Not have 15 & 16 year olds helping wash up? Do you have a source of older teens you could tap who wouldn't be seen as "vulnerable".

How big's your kitchen? Could you just have a team of teens washing up and a couple of CRB checked WIs supervising? Nobody else allowed in the kitchen? If it's a yearly, or more often, event, then you check the stalwarts and then re-use their CRBs next year as well.

I can understand why people who volunteer for jobs specifically working with youngsters should be CRB-checked; this is precisely what a would-be molestor might do.

But somebody who joins the WI and makes jam (or whatever they do) in the company of middle=-aged women, and then after 10 years a 16yo might join for a spot of washing up.... .

As Wherethehamster says, this is hardly a child-related environment. Surely it is partly the responsibility of the child and his/her parents to decide whether it is worth taking the risk of moving into an adult work environment.

Also, we are talking 15/16 yos, so people who may well have an active sex life. A 16-year-old is above the age of consent- does the grooming concept still apply under those circumstances?

Humberside police misinterpreted the Data Protection Act and destroyed records relating to Huntley that should have been kept - Soham report

Also Cambs police "were responsible for recording Huntley's birth date incorrectly and for checking only his alias Nixon on the Police National Computer"

"Huntley had been accused of several sex-related crimes, but Humberside and Cambridge police failed to spot the allegations during his vetting" - so the allegations weren't even spotted, regardless of the lack of any convictions.

It's not very comforting, is it

Interesting comment about Belgium....I live here. I have a crb check as I was a teacher in the UK. Here, I run the YC at ds's school and none of us have had to have any kind of check done and we have on average 170 year 7,8 and 9s on site once a month.

There have been cases in the UK as well of kids disappearing off the streets, so it's not just over here it happens.

The CRB system needs an overhaul.

Instead of several institutions checking a person, a person should be licensed i.e. someone, either the employee or first employer, pays a proper fee, say £150, and receives a licence for say 5-10 years.

They have to show this licence to employers who then register with the CRB that they employ the person.

If convictions are then made of the employee, the CRB would contact all registered employers to advise them.

FAR safer. No need for multiple applications.

Am v hacked off re CRB checks this week as my application form with all its sensitive data about me has been LOST in the process and I have to complete another form, produce ID again, etc and meanwhile my info could be anywhere. FFS.

Also I would like to know how many people have been 'caught' i.e. stopped from working as a result of CRB checks and have that figure as a ratio of people:applications since many people like me have to have multiple applications for different roles, at one stage apps going in within just a couple of weeks of each other.