To think that on higher incomes, having no money left often comes down to spending choices?

[ThatGoldZebra]

Sometimes when I hear what people are earning, I’m surprised when they say they have no money left at the end of the month.
I understand that everyone’s circumstances are different but at a certain income level it feels like spending choices and lifestyle play a big role. AIBU to think that?

Totally agree, it can effectively be the same at both ends of the spectrum.
The issue to me though is the attitude difference, lower earners are often seen as architects of their own doom when they struggle to survive. That they deserve to struggle, that it's because they need to economise or get a better job, their own fault, lazy, uninspired, feckless etc.

Yet when you look at higher earners saying they are struggling, there's a sense that they deserve to have the better lifestyle, private schools and healthcare, large houses, expensive experiences and holidays.

The issue is the same at both ends, wages have not kept pace with the cost of living, it's caused a drop in the standard of living for a lot of people, same problem, completely different attitudes.

Well, as a pensioner who lives almost entirely on the state pension (now with a few hours per week part time MW job - only make a couple of thousand extra a year) I agree.... If you've got a high income and still can't manage, some of it must be because of your spending choices.
I rent, run a little car and manage on around £14,000 per year, all in, and no big savings back up either. Try that for a few months and then tell me why you think you can't manage in your 100K job....

No childcare bill I assume? Single? Heating top up?What part of the country? No NI?

Context is vital.

Housing too. On 14k with no mention of top ups, a pensioner is unlikely to be privately renting. Someone old enough to be a pensioner now lived through a period of much easier access to both SH and house purchases at much lower real terms cost than, say, a person in their 30s.

But what if you are from the SE, it's not unreasonable to expect to stay where your roots are, where your family is etc.

Spending and lifestyle choices are relevant with most incomes. Hope that helps.

Over simplification I’m afraid

And all our friends are here. DH's job is pretty tied to London as there are kids more jobs in his area of work there. Once we have moved out the safety net has gone.

Not sure why I included a "kids" there.

My mortgage has gone from 1600 to 2850. Yes I didn’t expect the low rates to last forever, but no I did not plan for my mortgage to jump as much as it has.
I also didnt expect the ongoing costs to be as much as they are - bigger house = more stuff to go wrong. Kinda snookered now though as would cost a lot to move.
We don’t have new cars, go on fancy holidays, go out or buy new clothes or anything I would describe as frivolous. We are comfortable and can pay all bills, but certainly not rich as you would expect on our incomes.

I think it depends to large extent on when you got on the property ladder. Older people who bought cheap property and have little to no mortgage can afford to live on a lot less than younger people

Even those who bought 10+ years ago are in a much better position than those who bought in the last 5 years. There is massive inter generational inequality, and it’s getting worse for every generation.

Everyone is feeling the squeeze
generally the whole purpose of pushing yourself is to have bigger and nice things

if you’d worked your way up to senior level on 6 figure salary then your house would reflect this you would still be in your two up two down starter home .you wouldn’t have a clapped out fiesta you’d have a nice car
so % wise your overheads would be the same irrespective of of income also higher earns are being squeezed in every direction

I think if the lower to middle incomes added on there free childcare they too would be in a good salary
once you go over threshold your in next tax bracket so straight away that’s 40% gone plus paying for all there child care

Sounds like a combination of the green eyed monster and "oh well, it serves you right" sour grapes income bashing.

as why else would you occupy your mind thinking about other people's spending habits....

@rwalker 2x nursery places for a 1 and 3 year old at my nursery, make a £45k income equivalent to the £100k income once tax free childcare and free hours are accounted for.

Oh yes, there's definitely a difference in how those people will be treated.

On the thread that my second example came from, I was told I should just move somewhere cheaper. Despite me not having the upfront fees to move. My job was here. My children's father and step/half siblings were here, as were all our friends. My family and friends provided me with free/ very cheap childcare. So whilst my rent costs might have gone down, my childcare would have gone up.

When I suggested that the wealthier family could also move/downsize it just wasn't possible and why should they. Same reason I should I suppose!

Yes of course. Well off people too have a finite amount of money that they have to prioritise.

But you still get those who could live in a 2 bed but a 4 bed detached then moan about being skint

I love my dad’s saying “enough is always a little bit more” - as in you have what you have but then you’re striving for more. It’s a reminder to stay within my financial constraints.

I have had some months where I have no money left despite dh and I earning well but that’s because we paid for covering big without touching savings - a new patio and gazebo one month, twins’ ski trip another. But those were our choices. This month we have a big car bill so there won’t be much spare money… but we can cover it without stress. when dd goes to uni, we will be supporting her and I think that will take most of our fun money.

Yes and no really depends on the wage but also the outgoings.

Nursery is a killer for example when we had 2 in Nursery it was nearing 2k a month (wasn't full time and we had funding for DS1). It was over 3 times our mortgage (we definitely live within our means).
Mortgages have also jumped massively in the last 4 years. We were quoted a £400 increase per month 2 years ago due to this and that was on a 100k mortgage it was insane.

Some spend like mad but for some basic costs to work and commute to work can be high.
I also think that people hear wages over 60k and seem to think that all goes in the bank. The reality is once higher tax, pension and NI has come off its not as big as people think when they hear a salary.

I do agree if someone is moaning whilst telling you they are going to a concert and a city break etc.

I grew up in zone 6, my parents etc still live there. I don't because it's cripplingly expensive, I moved further out and I didn't even have to go that far to be honest to get a much, much cheaper house. I think people on high wages expect the earth and it's just not realistic anymore. Having a massive mortgage and kids in childcare in central London will swallow up even the biggest salaries. Shocker.

You can’t have it both ways - if you live in London or the SE you have an expensive mortgage, if you live further away you have an expensive commute. If you live in cheaper areas there are far fewer well-paying jobs.

Yep, big houses, big cars, nice clothes, new trainers/shoes…

I have enough money and am able to save but don’t have any of the above 🤷‍♀️

I live in the SE and had more disposable income in my 30s than I do now in my 50s. My DH and myself never thought we would be so broke at this stage in our lives. So fed up! Our kids are settled in uni here but if we had a choice I would leave the UK, things just seem to get worse and worse for tax payers.

Many luxuries there though. If family is same size no need for one having far higher mortgage than the other
If they didn't move to bigger house then bills would be lower

Well yes, of course it's due to lifestyle choices. But higher earners should be able to afford a better lifestyle than people who earn less without being judged for it. They should be able to afford things that are luxuries to minimum wage workers. That's the whole point in building a career. Someone's got to buy that £200 dress so that another person gets it in the charity shop for £10. It's not a good sign for the economy or the society when high earners can't afford "luxuries", it's worrying.