To think you can’t save if you simply don’t earn enough?

[MyAmberBird]

A lot of advice around saving focuses on habits and discipline but it feels like that only goes so far. If someone doesn’t earn enough to cover their basic living costs with anything left over, then realistically there’s nothing to save.

AIBU to think income is the limiting factor here? I don’t think habits play as big a role as people like to think.

Some people cannot save 1p

You see, that's the kind of attitude/excuse i was alluding to in my last post.
@ToffeeCrabApple made a fair point, but you are more interested in biting back and being a victim (unless you are defending 'the poor people' from your middle-class life, which is worse imo)
I work in a professional job in a traditionally rubbish-paying industry (paid under £40k for a senior role). I do the occasional extra shift for more cash.
Working more to earn more so you can spend/save more used to be considered sensible. Now the suggestion seems to be regarded as outrageous. When did that happen?

I often see lots of "just do xyz" and I don't think some understand how you can through no fault of your own get stuck in life with very little option for forwards motion to even getting on the path to get unstuck.
Saying "just get a better job" to many people is as helpful as "well just win the lottery"

There's lots of invisible privilege going on that most of us will have to some degree. But having more of them can give you this sense of anyone can do anything because I have been able to.

It's all very much the sam vines boots theory. It cost more to be poor. Its far easier to see a way forward when you have privilege and money.

Well, obviously.

Been there. Got the T-shirt. Nearly lost our house. Business failure.
Still think the pp's statement that some people can't cut back to save 1p is rubbish.

Well if you can’t cover essentials then you can’t save

however, there are some low income families who don’t imo prioritise spending or really understand budgeting well etc so arguably possibly could save a bit £10 here and there if a little savings made elsewhere - eg not smoking or vaping as a start

my sister as example has zero savings, zero pension ) and is mid 50s and forever complaining she’s skint and worried about the next bill but every week some sort of Shein ( or equivalent )parcel turns up and her wardrobe is rammed with clothes and shoes that are not needed. Can she spend how she wants ? Of course? Could she save ? Yes a little .and she’s in v low income but just doesn’t spend wisely

Oh lord the masses on here that put away 25% of their salary won’t be happy !

That is true.
But i am not sure how victimising NMW workers are helpless cogs unable to do anything but accept their lot is especially helpful either.

We’ve lived hand to mouth, we’ve also been reasonable earners. Illness then put paid to self employed DH’s income, and we were stretched again. We are well over retirement age now, lowish incomes, but fewer outgoings. Our bank offers ‘Save the change’, which I really like. Anything spent on the debit card is rounded up and the difference goes into a savings account. If I spend £3.25, 75p is transferred into a savings acoount. I wouldn’t make the effort to save these small amounts, but it’s a simple and fairly painless way to save even a little.

Obviously it depends.

Of course many are at a point where there is simply no money available to save
Many could save a little if they adopted a few efficiencies
Many could save a bit more than they do by changing their habits
Doubtless there are those that save but cannot save a penny more because they are already super efficient.
And those who could save more but choose not to because they have enough / would rather spend.

It’s worth it for all of us to review our situation regularly and work out which category we are in.

It doesn’t have to be laden with value judgement

And out comes the defensiveness.

Most of us (not everybody) will move through different stages of earning more or earning less. I've had over 50 jobs in my lifetime thus far. It was great when I had no real responsibilities, but those basic jobs paid basic wages.

You can bleat all you like about "All jobs should pay enough" but the reality is they don't. The 1950s are over and one wage earner is not enough to support a family.

If you want more money you have to take on more responsibility. For most people it's their choice to make.

The unemployment rate is the highest it’s been in years and predicted to increase. Having savings in this day and age is hugely important, IF you can save (six months equivalent of essential expenses). Particularly if you have a mortgage.

Oh I didn't see understanding and having empathy as victimising people. I think it's helpful to understand the system's we can be trapped in and how many are against us. For many people I think there can be shame that holds them back too.For many situations looking outside the box is the answer but that's not always easy information to get especially if you're exhausted just existing.I think understanding where you are at and why is part of the way forward.

I read a thread on here a few years ago where more than one poster was surprised anyone living in London earned under 35k! Which was one of the more mind boggling things ive read here.
But several things can be true at the same time

• some people whatever their income can make poor financial choices, and could save more than they do
• people have different ideas on what's an essential
• sometimes having a small luxury might be more important to someone, than saving eg £5/month
• some people are only meeting essential bills and payments and do not have the capacity to save

Its entitlement and lack of responsibility

The Im owed it mentality
My Dsis is like this

DH and I have worked extra for years to get in a good financial position, saved, been sensible and she thinks we are " lucky" and hates us because she doesnt have the same.
Same upbringing, same life chances-in fact DH has a life long illness
She "wants it because she deserves it" and constantly spends on crap, thinks its outrageous to expect her to work to pay off her debts and hints that we should pay them off.

The trouble is the shit is now hitting the fan, jobs are scarce, extra hours are expected with no pay and debt is costing more

Some people can’t work more, because they have caring responsibilities.

My DSis is a good example. She has always done NMW jobs - shop/bar work, before becoming a carer. She worked hard, very long hours. She then became a HCA in a hospital and after a year or so did an access to nursing course. Nursing was the obvious logical next step to improve her career.

But she couldn’t pass the course because being brutally honest, she’s thick. Her DH recently left her and she’s bringing up 3 DCs alone. She can’t work longer hours than she already is because she can’t get childcare in the evenings/weekends.

Unfortunately some people just aren’t cut out for ‘more than NMW’.

I laughed. So many people on here don't get humour. I'm sure the avocado toast was a joke.

Why we dont teach finances in schools I dont know

because being wealthy is even more lucrative when you’re few in number.
(Takes off tin foil hat)

Yes how very dare poors have leisure time or spend money on anything other than the barest essentials. A hundred years ago George Orwell wrote ‘The Road to Wigan Pier’ and nothing being said now is any different to that.

There’s a big difference in being able to save, not needing to spend it and seeing that money accumulate and sticking a fiver in a pot and then having to dip in to pay for school dinners or the gas bill. I imagine it’s absolutely soul destroying.

Sometimes it's about when you decide to do things too, if you have 3 children when you're 25 renting and working nmw and have no savings your chances of getting out of that are slim.

When I was in a low paid job (nmw wasn't even a thing) I always had a second job bar work or restaurants etc, I did all sorts whatever was going fruit picking , shredding files at the end of a financial year, cleaning, I was babysitting and earning from 13 and working from the minute I got my NI number at 15. I had to my family couldn't give me anything, if I wanted it I had to earn.

Even when I got my first job in a professional field at 25 I carried on doing a second job working night shifts and did that for years and so did DH until we could afford to buy our house. We didn't have DC when a lot of our peers were in their twenties because we knew it would scupper our chances of owning a home and make it harder to work second jobs. We now both earn well but still do overtime and on call etc voluntarily to earn extra cash.

I grew up in a situation where an unexpected bill could mean no money for food, provi men knocking on the door and pretending you were not home, the lights going off because there were no coins left for the meter. My parents both worked my whole life in low paid jobs but when they separated there just wasn't enough to run two homes even with my dad in a studio flat, there had barely been enough to run one. it means I will always prioritise savings and working extra to have them because you never know what's coming around the corner.

Agree
I did the 1p savings challenge

I prioritised it and ended up with £667 at the end
The money could easily have been spent
It takes intention and then you realise how pervasive all the ads are on insta and FB

It’s a long time before you get to the point of needing care home fees. I have been self employed all my life in an industry which is rapidly replacing me now with AI tools. I won’t get my state pension for a few years. Boy, am I glad I have savings. And a small private pension I can take now. Over the years it has sometimes been hard to save, but what a good job I did.

Saving perhaps not, but investing if you can afford it. Save £200 a month for 40 years and put it in a savings account and you’ll have maybe £50k profit when you retire. Invest that same amount in S&P and you’ll probably have closer to £500k profit after tax, possibly more.

There is so much vitriol towards lower income families on Mumsnet at the moment. Why not project some of that towards the billionaires who should pay more tax?

But so many people insist on having the latest phone on a contract and pay 30 to 50 a month or more. You don't need that. When the contract is finished keep the phone and get a cheap SIM deal. I've never cared about fancy phones, my contract was 15 a month but I've kept it and have gone on to a SIM only for under 5 a month.

The same with streaming. No one actually needs to have any streaming, there are loads of programs and films on iPlayer, itvX, channel 4 all for free. All I have is Netflix with ads for 5.99. Not having streaming could save over 50 a month.

So by rationalising those things alone someone could save at least 60 a month or more, which all adds up.