AIBU to think Marrakesh was far worse than I expected?

[LondonLass37]

I'm 40. I went to Marrakesh for a week with a female friend of the same age. Both white, both blonde. Just looking for some warmth, culture, and a proper break.

What I experienced was genuinely awful.

We were harassed constantly , not just persistent sellers, but followed, hissed at, and touched. A man spat at my feet because I wouldn't give him money for directions I never asked for. Later, a drunk local chased us through the medina. We had to hide in a shop for nearly half an hour.

The medina is filthy. In the markets, animal carcasses hang next to food. Live donkeys are visibly mistreated and beaten. I'm still upset about what I saw.

The food was bland and lukewarm. My friend got food poisoning.

I wanted mint tea and beautiful tiles. Instead I felt unsafe and miserable.

So – AIBU? Or is Marrakesh genuinely as terrible as I found it?

I find that when it comes to the hassle factor, places that are more 'loosely' Islamic and used to (female) tourists - eg. Morocco, Egypt, Tunisia, Turkey - are worse than countries that are more strictly Islamic. When I was younger, I travelled in places like Pakistan's North West Frontier Province where, outside of the main cities, women are not seen in the streets at all. The men will stare but they won't approach you or hassle you - it's like they don't know how to react to single women out and about.

The worst place I have been for hassle is Egypt. Not so bad if you're in a resort, but backpacking in the south of the country. Nightmare! Constantly followed all day by groups of men wanting photos. I'm not even blonde. What could they possibly want photos of some random woman for? Everybody trying to rip you off and talking utter shite basically - eg. you agree a price to get in a taxi, then once in it, they claim no price was agreed and you have to go through it all again. They drone on in inane repetitive loops designed to wear you down. Or you buy something in a shop and find them boxing up a cheaper item, hoping you don't notice until you get home. No standards of behaviour it seemed to me - well, at least where the men were concerned. Such a shame because the country is so uniquely beautiful. Also, Egypt has the highest proportion of FGM in the world. I hadn't realised this at all.

Yep that was my experience and in a ‘5*’ hotel! Never again!

Hated every minute of my holiday there.

Having visited all those places, I think you are lying.

As others have said its one of those places where you need a man by your side. Like Tunisia and Egypt.

Why would I lie? I know exactly where my daughter has lived and why her experiences are. From memory, my husband and I have been to Tunisia eight times, Egypt seven times, and Morocco four times, and around half of those trips were with our daughter. My daughter are white and Im blonde, and in all of our trips, the only time we’ve ever had a significant issue was when my husband and I were arrested in our 20s when we were with a couple of Moroccan men who were caught speeding and we were seen as an easy target to pay a huge fine. I assume thst my daughter developed her love of the Middle East from the holidays she had with us when she was younger, and after travelling round asia, India, and the Middle East after she finished her masters degree, she decided to take a job in Cairo. She then moved to Jordan, where she met the man who is now her husband. They lived with us during 2024 and hated it here. Living abroad for several years, my daughter had forgotten what the culture was like in the UK and they were glad to move back to Turkey.

After Tunisia, Jordan, Egypt, Morocco and Turkey, I’m only holidaying in Europe now, although I’m glad I’ve seen them and loved our Nile cruise.
Its the haggling, arguing and constant attention in some of these places that puts me off. And I can’t haggle to save my life, which means I don’t buy anything (one bonus!) I’m not too keen on being shouted at if I change my mind on a purchase either.

i had a snake wrapped round my neck in Marrakesh. It didn’t bother me as it happens, but it might bother some…

Been 3 times. First time in a group with men following a group hike in Atlas. No issues.

Second time was with a female friend (again following a group hike). We had a few issues, particularly in restaurants which I didn't expect, but ok.

Third time I was on my own in the city, again following a group hike in the Atlas. Never again. I was covered head to toe (cap, sunglasses, baggy shirt, baggy trousers, trainers) but had constant hissing and harassment, being followed and shouted at (had to ask a couple for help at one point). The young male owner of the riad I was staying in questioned me constantly about why I was alone without a husband there and wouldnt accept my answers. To the extent I left there the next day. I am a very confident solo traveller and I found it unnerving. I'd never, ever go back to that city on my own again.

What’s so bad about the UK and Germany? They always seem like pretty good countries to me.

I loved it. I went about two years ago, and apart from some pushy stallholders in the souk, I had no problems at all. My accommodation was in the Medina, and I hung out in the buzz of the square until midnight each night. Didn't have a moment's hassle, and and the tourism police were always evident, had I had any.
And I was travelling solo, independently.

Is there a country in the world without rampant misogyny? Certainly not the UK - you just have to read Mumsnet to see that. Not Australia, given you're not even allowed to state what a woman is in most of the country. USA, with their abortion laws? Hardly. Closer to home? Well none of the French men I've ever met are exactly feminist. Etc., etc.

I went to Tangier a few years ago. I was with my partner so no one went near me. But I am blonde and I was stared at everywhere I went. In a shopping mall men would stand in the shop doorways watching me and walking along the beach we were followed. I felt really self conscious and very glad I wasn't alone.

This - and much, much worse - is how local women would be treated if they didn't 'follow local customs'/make themselves effectively invisible/give up their agency in one way.

I loathe the relativist 'liberal' misogyny that says respect for cultures should come before women's human rights, whether that's here or in other countries.

That's when you see what liberalism really is - ie, a beard which allows another ideology to go unmolested. Global capitalism and the patriarchy, usually.

That’s reassuring. I’ve been there several times and was reading the op and others’ descriptions and wondering how butters I must be.
There is a certain way of being I’ve noticed in some cultures which wards off men. It’s hard to describe, a certain briskness, no eye contact. I first used it in Turkey when I was 19 and noticed English girls getting unwanted attention were more open, walked slower and returned looks. I’ve also been to India loads including with teenage daughters and no body language worked in keeping unwanted attention at bay.

How miserable. When I walk my dog I nod/say good morning/afternoon to virtually every passing bloke. Having to lower my eyes to ward off men… strewth.

That being said, when in Rome and all that. But agree that those liberals that trumpet that this behaviour is fine and dandy in the UK can go and do one.

I went a couple of years back with my ex while we were still a couple. We stayed outside marrakesh but went there on a day trip. It was way too hectic for me. Didn't enjoy the constant harassment for money, most stores sold the same tourist items. Glad I seem it but many times didn't feel safe, definitely wouldn't go without a man.
There was one very strange insodence I will never know what really was going on. We got off the bus with mainly American tourists. There were 2 staff on the bus, the tour guide and the bus driver. The tour guide rounded everyone up to lead them to the market. The bus driver said come with me if you British that tour is for Americans. I whispered to my ex that it didn't feel right. Saw the Americans go off in another direction. I said no they are going that way, he said his way was the quicker way and markets closing soon. I tried to tell my ex a few times this ain't right and we should just go our own way and I tried to make excuse I need toilet and pointing out bars/restaurants where I could go and we could have a drink. Bus guy said he will take us to this shop he knows on the way so I could go toilet there and said again that we would miss the market if we didn't stay with him. Stupidly didn't just trust my gut and say outright that I didn't feel safe with him. Was trying to make excuses to get away subtly.

Well it didn't work. We got to the shop he lead us to, he said I need the toilet. They said it is upstairs. Said to ex i want him to come with and him wait outside the door. They were saying no no he stay down here and can look around the shop. I insisted he come up with me. When I got out again they were trying to get him to go downstairs and I could look around upstairs. We said no, I could see on the way out a bed in another room. When we got downstairs the bus guy had gone and we had to find our own way to the market, so he had no interest in taking us there.

On the way back I led the way and realised he had took us on a very long detour saying it was quicker to the market. God knows what was the intention of them all, but I'm very glad I insisted my ex stay with me at all times.

Advise to anyone going there, trust your gut, don't be afraid of offending if you don't feel safe, stick with the majority of tourists

I foolishly had a holiday in Morocco in my 20’s with 4 girls, it was awful.

Some of these posts remind me of that time when Judi Dench (91) said "Well Harvey Weinstein never sexually harassed ME."

I've travalled a fair bit around Algeria. Very different to Morocco- the country is basically empty of tourists. You need to apply for a visa- £85- and provide a few docs etc, but if you're the adventurous type, go for it. Lots of impressive Roman ruins, and of course the everlasting desert to the south.

I’ve always wanted to go to Algeria. It looks wonderful.

I had some good bits and bad bits - a real mix. I got touched by lots of men on a train at rush however as a 20 year old blonde girl by myself (my friend was in another carriage as I was looking for a toilet).

I've been twice (male). First time with DW, wasn't harassed. Second time on my own and it was absolutely horrendous, constantly harassed, could not look up without someone coming on to me, followed down dark alleys demanding money for directions I didn't ask for, robbed of change in the medina. Never again thanks

Went with my dad and step mum when I was 17. I stuck to my dad like glue and felt pretty safe but he is physically imposing and looks quite intimidating. I still got moderately harassed (moderately compared to you). The food was good but I wouldn’t go back.

Have been harassed on holiday in Turkey with a group of men chasing me down a street and narrowly avoided being dragged into a car by a man outside my holiday appartment. The worst harassment was in Italy though. I went to Verona to attend a language course and stayed with a friend just outside the town. I took the train to my class every day and the walk from the station to my class was pretty horrendous with men in cars stopping to proposition me, cat calls and being followed.

I’m a Black female and my Italian friend apologetically told me that most local men would have assumed I was a sex worker.

That's absolutely awful.