Are other full-time working families finding there is nothing left?

[fatface001]

Alarm went off at 5:30 this morning, then an hour stood on a packed train into London for the commute. We are a normal family: one child and two full-time jobs. I’ve always enjoyed working and have always worked hard, and I don’t mind that at all — but I do expect that full-time work should still mean there’s something left at the end of the month for a normal life.

But that really doesn’t feel like the case anymore.

There’s nothing left at the end of the month. Everything has been stripped back, all non-essentials have gone, and even basic things around the house are being put off or done ourselves because there isn’t spare money for trades. It’s just constant cutting back.

What’s hard is that we’re both working really long hours and doing everything we’re “supposed” to do, but it still feels like we’re going backwards rather than getting ahead.

When I hear talk about “those with the broadest shoulders” contributing more, I honestly don’t recognise it anymore in real life. It doesn’t feel like anyone in our position has anything left to give — it feels like the pressure is entirely on ordinary working households just to stand still.

I’m not looking for luxuries — just the sense that working still gives you a bit of breathing room. Right now it doesn’t feel like that at all.

Is anyone else feeling the same?

@Differentforgirls

Everyone is not entitled to JSA

The clue is in the name. You have to be looking for work. If you are not, then you are excluded

True, but when you see posters saying things that imply moral superiority it’s usually someone paying £3k a year tax and receiving a whole measure of benefits.

www.google.co.uk/search?client=safari&hs=9wcp&sca_esv=df25ec6ca4037ad0&hl=en-gb&sxsrf=ANbL-n4mEu2ROCS12nb-pMMIEUAzpcQNOA%3A1775033176982&q=job+seekers+allowance+contribution+based&oq=job+seekers+allowance+co&aqs=heirloom-srp.2.0l5

Do you think that's the only way to be permanently knackered?

I have a disabled child. I can assure you that I am far from well rested just because I can't work.

Where exactly did I imply moral superiority?

‘ I have this thing called empathy for others’

Free time is a luxury if you have money to spend or other people all off together.

Is it a luxury when you have to watch every penny are stuff circling the same local park, or watching tv all day?

You are more employable with job references and experience, if you are in the working world you at least have a chance of moving jobs or getting promoted to earn more.

Leaving your house each day, having something to talk about, having work colleagues etc etc are all benefits of working.

Many people break things down into just money.

And right now it’s difficult, wages are not increasing as fast as inflation and bills. Workers do feel depressed at the erosion of living standards. An able bodied worker cannot just stop working a reap hundreds in benefits.

It was predicted the UK wouldn’t start to see the financial fallout from Brexit until about 10 years after the referendum and here we are, lower investment into the country, EU organisations moved, businesses relocated.

It’s difficult to keep your enthusiasm up when things continually seem harder and harder. But these are the times we are living through.

And yes it’s demoralising, we are GenX with teenagers and all of our disposable income goes on them, not even fun stuff, we are overpaying the mortgage every quarter to be able to pay their uni rents when they go. Next bonus, filling ISAs and opening pensions for them, fucking pensions aged 15! That’s how much we don’t see anything improving (on the positive side we hope if they see how it increases they might be more inspired to take a pension more seriously at the start of their working lives).

It’s fucking hard and we are more worried about our children’s financial future than I thought we would be, much more. Consumerism can go to fuck we don’t have the wingspan to buy crap anymore, or pay for extra services. Bills and the teenagers that’s it, that’s all we can do.

Haha OK fair enough

Just surprises me how little empathy I see on here. Mumsnet is full of bootlickers for some reason

@Differentforgirls

Have you actually read that
You are disqualified from JSA if you are not actively seeking work ie if you are disabled or too ill for work
You also need to have NI in the last 2 - 3 years.
I left my public sector job three years ago to become a full time foster carer. I left with a full NI record, therefore did not pay any extra NI
So I am excluded on both counts

Yes I did read it. I qualify if I want to seek work. You didn’t because you won’t be seeking work.

Well empathy work both ways. Most people who say things like this are just only thinking of their own situation and self interest, they are paying about £3-5k tax per , they simply don’t realise or care that they cost the state £13k per year (on average per person) and someone else is making up that £8k. The empathy stops at the people paying this, who sacrifice time with their families, endure long hours and are now saying the burden is too much …in fact the ‘empathy’ oddly turns into animosity with comments like boot lickers.

Still waiting for you to tell me what I should feel shame for.

Sorry, I’ve lost interest.

@Differentforgirls

Thats fine. You qualify, I don't.

You posted that everyone is eligible. Which is clearly incorrect

Just shows you shouldn’t judge someone because of your imagination rather than facts 👍

I was helping another poster. It’s a given that if you’re claiming JOB SEEKERS Allowance you should be seeking work!

I mean the majority of the taxes are paid by the wealthy, not by normal working people. And I don't have sympathy for them (the ultra rich). I think the ultra rich and businesses with huge profits should pay more to ease the burden on normal working people.

This is the issue. I think most can agree that everyday working families are stretched too thin. But we disagree on how to solve the issue. Some people think the people at the top who are exploiting and profiting from everyone are to blame. Others think it's lazy poor people.

You can talk about moral superiority but I do think there's a bit of a moral issue here. Why are so many people so ready to not only blame the people already at the bottom, but spout such utter vitriol and hatred? I think it doesn't make for a very nice society to behave like that.

@frozendaisy indeed - I and many others predicted post the Brexit deal that plenty of the very people that voted for it would be the ones moaning about the consequences- a lack of large investment- you’ve got a factory to build that has products needing export, not just uk centric, woukd you build here? Of course you wouldn’t, you would build were the barriers to export were a lot lower and where you could probably get good grants - we simply gave a lot of good business to competitors over the channel on a plate. We are not the USA, they have a large enough domestic market, as big as the EU.Sovereignty and flag waving doesn’t pay bills or create better paid jobs or stop import costs . It’s global world whether people like it or not and creating barriers just shoots yourself in the face. Dont forget by the way that according to Farage and Rees Mogg everything was going to be cheaper by now- they mentally live in the 50s -a world of the commonwealth mattering and Britannia rules the waves - it simply doesn’t .

Nope, the majority of income taxes are paid by the top 10% which starts at around £70k.

‘but spout such utter vitriol and hatred’
Nobody has done that on this thread as far as I can see with exception of when you called the people who subsidise you ‘bootlickers’ simply because they pay more tax into the system than they take out. If it’s moral issue, then it’s the people paying for their own families and subsidising others who have the moral high ground. If it’s an economic issue, then the people paying for their own families and subsidising others who are aiding the economy. Your sympathy is irrelevant, it’s common sense that people are looking for.

Not sure if it's wilful ignorance or genuine here?

you called the people who subsidise you ‘bootlickers’ simply because they pay more tax into the system than they take out

This is wrong in many ways. I didn't call people who pay taxes bootlickers, I was referring to those who do all they can to defend the wealthy, oppose taxing them more, essentially do their bidding.

And top 10% does start a 70k, but the maths shows that in terms of actual monetary contribution, ordinary working people are not paying more than the wealthy.

Working people have had it up to here and have been completely shafted by this govt, why should they be “nice”?

You only call people bootlickers who defend the wealthy, oppose taxing them more?. Can you tell me your definition of wealthy? How much tax they currently pay and how much more you’d want them to pay?

The top 10% starting at £70k pay 60% of income tax, again you are going to have to define what an ‘ordinary working person’ is and a ‘wealthy’ person. A wealthy person wouldn’t be anyone earning more that you would it by any chance?

They've been shafted by the government so it's ok to spout hatred at poor people?

Why should people be nice? Maybe because in difficult times community is all we can cling onto? Would be good if people came together, supported each other, rather than turned against each other. I don't know how to explain why you should be a nice person

So you are mad at the government so you are going to take it on the disabled, elderly and people working minimum wage jobs

No, When I talk about ultra wealthy I'm not talking about people on 70k, 100k, even 200k. The ultra wealthy is an elite class of people above most of us.

It happens so often on mumsnet people talk about wealth tax and someone comes along with their 70k going 'I'm not paying more taxes!!!' Wasn't talking about you!

I call people booklickers when they act like bootlickers. If someone wants to increase wealth taxes then I wouldn't call them a bootlicker because they're not acting like it. If it quacks like a duck...